Don't go alliance if you want to play a rogue and pvp with it

Blizz never should have nerfed the racials and if anything, the differences between races should be more prominent. Pre-release, Undead were actually classed as Undead and not Humanoids; Priest and Paladin spells specific to Undead targets worked on them whilst Mages Polymorph didn’t.

I am completely in agreement with this. The Forsaken make little sense as a race to begin with (and less and less as extensions go on), having them “not really be undead” is the cherry on top.
Escape artist I also find extremely lackluster in terms of flavour. Not to mention it is severly redundant for rogues (up to 4 root breaks already).

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Switch to Horde? Never!
Night Elf and proud!

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My plan is to play a Hemo build that still has Opportunity (increased damage on attacks from behind). Basically, if a target is sitting, I’ll ambush them into Cold Blood Backstab. That should be a dead Orc, no stuns needed

I’m actually in favour of redundancy. In a logicial sense, if we were to consider PvP as the default state of the game rather than Blizz having cynically designated the ‘safety mode’ as ‘Normal servers’, then there are certain unavoidable aspects to having 8 classes per side with two of them being unique to each.

  1. There is objectively going to be ‘the best class’ 1v1.
  2. There will also be ‘the best race’ for that class.
  3. There will also be ‘the best class’ for any PvP with groups of people.
  4. That will also have ‘the best race’ for it.

For balance, the ‘best class-race’ pairing should not be the same for both scenarios, nor class or race separately. In fact, the more those scenarios are not permitted to be cleanly the case, the better. It’s right then that there should be other scenarios created by unique and unpredictable traits caused by class and race combinations. There should for instance be a class which is most likely to win when outnumbered, one which works best with others of the same class or of different classes and so forth.

WoW originally looked like it was designed in such a way; with class/race VS class/race considerations first and then the PvE content was designed around those classes as they are. Only the raiding changes this, but it came to define the game despite being rushed and shoe-horned in.

He thinks using Twitch emotes on a forum is somehow funny.

Ah… Youtube generation… That explains that.

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He is a night elf priest.
That explains a lot.

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Thinking that using "wat drugs r u on 4Head " in 2019 when exposed to facts because you have no argument is somehow funny WeirdChamp Clap

Oh, it is that dwarflet again who is still salty that he was forced into the ugliest race so that he can have a chance to live 5 seconds longer before he gets globalled by horde “scrum” (like his 5Head dwarf IQ makes him spell it, I suppose). No wonder he’s malding PepeLaugh

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Should I even present arguments when he’s fundamentally wrong and people above me already rebuked him?

Your argument is “either you pick a race for aesthetics or you’re a f^cking nerd”. Funny, coming from someone who uses Twitch emotes in their normal speech.

Also, at this point I’m starting to think you have issues…

I do wonder how the alliance rogue Perplexity keeps owning so hard every semi + skilled player or gladiator streamer, hax maybe ? This theme must be a joke…

Can you destroy shammy totems in classic? Not done any PvP yet

Yes, you can

Is there a version of the game where you can’t?

Or perhaps you mean “can you macro your pet to destroy totems in Classic?”

Yeah that was my follow up, had vague memories you couldn’t in classic for some reason.

Why would they complain about that sh*t, when it’s the horde that has the OP racials

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Hi, I’m Dume

and I’m a Human Rogue on a PvP server.

The great thing about Alliance Rogues on PvP servers is they are both better and easier to use than Macs and PCs.

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Racials shouldnt dictate your class or the style of play. I agree that they should be unique but they should be equal in different things. It is very hard to do but possible. Perception is a good one but not enough alone (maybe on a shorter cd it would be) as it is good against something. However Gnomes Mana isnt good as it tells you to play a caster class to get the full benefit of a gnome.

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Guys I don’t want to defend the horde dudes here, but I have to agree with them on several grounds. 1. Racial wont make the deal - the classic servers, sorry to say, have far worse players than any pservers I played, I did stuff I never did before such as killing players 10 levels above me (might have been due to the bugged hit rating actually).
2. As someone pointed out, orc is super super OP, but rogues have other things to worry about as well such as snares or dots. Thank God none can remove magical dots in this version (I mean there is no cloak of shadows), but dorfs can remove physical ones. Also the, by far, best rogue in this game, Perplexity, plays a gnome rogue, he also played dorf in the past. I believe when it comes to melee classes or mages, alliance in fact have it better, even though orc is doubtlessly the most OP race of the game. If you stick to human or nelf though on a pvp server either you have to be confident in your abilites, or just…be weaker. Humans will be way better once arenas come out, if they come out. Furthermore, there is an interesting addon what I found is to be very useful to make perception an actually viable racial - classic spy, it looks at the combat logs in your stead and tells you when people use abilities around you, thus give you info when perception is to be used. I personally do not consider it cheating as perception is extremely situational and pretty bad without it, plus, just like soundalerter in later expansions, it doesn’t do anything other than what players could do - looking at the combat log.

Also if you manage to get into a group of people with a big bearded santaclaus or two, the latter beinbg a paladin, you will have it waaay better than the horde dudes who are stronger alone, but weaker when father Christmas is around. A priest can give you a buff that is better than wotf due to require no global cd on your part and has a shorter cd (you can have an easier job against a priest for example), and the dude with the hammer can make you very good at moving as well as stronger than an orc, despite being a small midget. Plus neither of those guys can be killed, especially in vanilla dwarf priests and palas are far superior to their counterparts on horde.

The only reason I would, indeed, buff alliance racials has nothing to do with their effectiveness. It has to do with this weird and strange classic community/retail community here. Most people don’t really understand vanilla/tbc/wotlk (personally its my first vanilla experience, palyed years on AT and elsewhere though) and roll horde, thus contributing to these atrocious faction imbalances that were absent even on tbc pservers, where horde is actually better (once they get fearward). If blizzard gives something equivalent to humans as emfh and the wotlk version of shadowmeld to elves, I can guarantee balance would be restored. Shame community really forced even back then to make a situation in wotlk where horde is, arguably, useless for pvp.

I always roll Troll because of op racials.

That’s like saying Orc racials are bad because you don’t get the full benefit if you don’t play Hunter… but nobody would dare claim that Orc is a weak pick for pretty much anything. Not every race is going to be the ideal choice for all classes and there are perfectly good RP reasons for that.