Don't merge realms of different languages!

Community General Discussion
141

Guess you have a point with this, even with an english majority, since aggra will keep the portuguese tag, you are the equivalent of being marked as a new players server for portuguese people, so pretty much every portuguese who wants to start playing comes to your server.

I guess if a language is used too little they could perhaps remove the portuguese label, as in, if all portuguese who want to play in eu are so few they can’t go on without connecting to english realms, it might be there’s not enough interest from portuguese people.

And yes, given what you said about transferring you will have plenty of time to make an assessment about the situation before the time comes.

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142

But does blizzard give any stats at all population wise? If not, isn’t some semi-correct data better than nothing?

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We can only use the data we can see on various sites as an indication but at times it’s completely inaccurate. Blizzard don’t publish their information but they have access to the actual real information that we can’t see.

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Blizzard did not create any Polish realm, so the Poles made it themselves for several years. Now blizzard has done the stupidest thing possible to combine english-speaking servers with 95% trade chat burning legion. You will see what happens at the premiere of shadowlands. Player will run out of ignore limit. In this situation, it would be best to undo it, but it probably is not possible, so the simplest solution would be to create default trade channels on realm what character you login and it should also be the main trade for all realms. you should can disable enable chat which you want. That would fix the problem.

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What if the English speakers just spoke too? If there is enough of them you’ll just see both being spoken.

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Same story with Al’akir/skullcrusher/Xavius, i lost so much for blizzard after this merge… They clearly just think about the numbers and give 0 f’cks about their customers. (Give us free transfers, i dont want to learn polish just so i can play wow)

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147

They can’t even if they want to.

It’s stupid I know.

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What do you mean by that?

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@Ishayoe: I happen to play on Xavius (and some German realms), so your assessment of the overall situation is invalid. I also did not claim that everything is fine. You are reading far too much into things and there is absolutely no need to be furious. You must have already red at least some of the posts regarding what happened with the Burning Legion connection? Some of the bad things I was afraid of are already happening, but that does not mean the end of the world (of warcraft). What it does mean is that I and Punyelf among others have to deal with posters, some of whom are outright xenophobic and quite frankly very rude. I am actually grateful that you have mostly managed to remain civil even though you are irritated by the situation.

I am sorry, but this is NOT fine… 2 500 people evenly spread means about 1 250 per side and given the typical activity patterns that means prime time peaks of about 313… Which is in no way sufficient. Blizzard has to aim for far bigger connections than that and luckily it seems they are finally doing that. This is also why I noted that there is a high probability that Blizzard will make further connections. Frostmane by itself has a minimal impact on the activity of the 3-way and this is especially evident for the horde side, where as I noted, the impact might be as little as about 50 to 70 people, which in turn increases horde prime time peak by about 13 to 18 people… But on the reverse side, those few people will have access to far larger AH and other benefits that larger realms offer.

Now, before I get more sleep (I dozed off for a while too early), I am going to monitor Xavius horde side for a while. I am also considering establishing an alt (perhaps even two) on Frostmane to look at the situation there in person.

EDIT: Typos. :frowning:

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150

I think both of you are overplaying that hand, not something I like to see from MVP’s.

There are a few xenophobes in a sea of people who are not and yet the both of you seem eager to make this an issue. Making the discussion into something different. I wish the both of you were a bit more cautious and thoughtful on this matter.

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@Trelw

Uhh, that’s interesting info, your comparison about total population and peak activity being 1\4 of that, I usually deal with peak activity or anyway amount of people on at the same time, since I do manual who’s a lot, so I often get confused when I hear “this realm has 10.000 actives” cause I didn’t know how it’d translate in “people on at the same time”.

And onto your particular example, 313 at peak are indeed like nothing, quel’thalas some years ago when it was low pop on minority side had around that, and certainly was considered pretty dead!

Also, interesting news from america: they are connecting SEVEN realm clusters next thursday, and some are very particular; aside from the typical low + low pop making a medium realm, there’s an interesting connection between cairne and another, what’s noteworthy is that cairne has just been connected, so this is the 2nd time that realm gets connected just in this year’s connection program, so blizzard indeed intends to connect realms multiple times if population is still not high enough.

And also a crazy decision that caused a huge uproar in america: they’re connecting proudmoore, which is pretty much exactly like our blackmoore, full and ally-only, to hyjal, which in america is a high pop realm horde dominant, what is probably their purpose is balancing ally and horde on those realms since the minority is otherwise non-existant, but the resulting population is huge, it’s the biggest merger I have seen so far, so people are very upset there!

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152

Yes, it’s not perfect, depending on the website you can find different weaknesses.

Wowrealmpopulation sometimes has some completely wrong faction balance info, says some ally realms are horde, and that for example silvermoon is 3x ravencrest, that can’t be obviously, its main utility imo is that it still shows the population split as before the connections, as in if realm A is connected to B you can still see if A or B was bigger or which of them was ally favoured etc.

Realm pop is gone since a few years, wow progress isn’t updated on the population section since the end of legion, in the guild section it’s updated but even then it requires some sort of raiding for people to count.

And raider io realm section is imo the best we have atm, most numbers seem accurate, although for example frostmane was considered, before the connection, extremely close in population to aggra, which when a realm has 2,5x more guilds than the other can’t be accurate ofc.

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@Esploratore: Things easily get confused, because people are rarely sufficiently specific. Active players vs active characters, prime time peak vs either of the two preceeding, ect. Also, since there is no way to detect things below level 10, for some systems below level 20, many of the values are slighly borked to show too low values. In short, things are both complex and complicated. :smiley:

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154

I really don’t think it is.

There keeps being this confusion, from you and many others, that this is about merging two language communities. That’s bad enough, but it’s not - it’s so much worse: it’s about merging two different servers with a different official language. Like merging an Italian and German realm.

You are confusing individuality with the collective. No, WoW is not going to end because of this connection, but my connection to it very much could, and that does make me furious, and I think I have every right to be angry with this connection.

This isn’t even a case where they didn’t dig into the community. I can forgive that kind of ignorance because it can be hard to work out what a community is like on all servers to find the best connections.

However, in this case they didn’t even read the names of the realms they’re connecting - or they just don’t care. Meanwhile I see them going around this thread editing posts and whatnot, yet they don’t read the feedback, they don’t pass the feedback on, the server literally breaks, there is no communication, no second thoughts. There’s just nothing. I don’t even know where to place this on the customer service scale because it’s literally worse than doing nothing.

Sorry, I meant 250 prime-time users. :stuck_out_tongue:

Anyway those were numbers plucked out of thin air. I merely meant to point out that rolling a lot of small realms into a big one can be just as effective as rolling small ones into large ones.

Either way, there was no need to merge Frostmane into another realm from the alliance PoV. There was a reason for the Horde PoV, which is why I suggested in my OP to merge us with a Horde dominated realm. Aggra-Grim Batol is not a Horde dominated realm at all - although in terms of skilled players, it is.

Why didn’t they merge us with a decent horde-dominated English speaking realm? There are a metric ton of those. Why did it have to be Aggra (Portuguese)? Do you think the 80 Horde players are going to think they got a good deal here, when they go from having 0 guilds around to having 0 guilds whose language they can understand around?

I think the only reason you haven’t heard anything from Frostmane Horde players complaining about how pointless this is is that there aren’t anyone to complain.

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Wow, was about to say that based on the grim batol numbers before it was connected to aggra there had to be enough hordes that spoke english but I gave a look at wow progress and I’m impressed: I had to struggle to find ONE english speaking guild, all the rest, and there’s a lot are portuguese.

I guess the percentages are quite far from what I thought on that realm, frostmane might bring a little balance on ally (but not enough) but horde will continue to be exclusively portuguese.

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156

Right. It’s like 30 Portuguese guilds, 3 Swedish ones, and 1 English.

Oh and the English one has died and wasn’t in Mythic either way.

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Yes, it’s silly mergers that don’t keep into account anything more than the population, that’s what’s gonna get better, the economy, cause you can buy items no matter how little you understand about what the seller says in AH.

The burning legion-al’akir merger might be even worse, cause burning legion is sort of 7-8 times al’akir’s size, al’akir is english, burning legion is polish, so for al’akir it’s basically better without merger, AH aside, and they had 14 guilds of which 13 horde, so they weren’t in a great situation before either.

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@Ishayoe: I will try to explain myself in a slightly different format and I apologize in advance that parts of my theorycrafting are in the “Al’Akir” thread with Esploratore.

Blizzard is connecting realms in phases. If I knew or strongly believed the current situation is the end result, I would be more inclined to share some of your thoughts. However, since the connection program is nowhere near being finished, I see the Aggra / Grim Batol / Frostmane 3-way as a building block, not a finished product. Same actually applies to the Burning Legion 4-way, by the way.

Just as examples, Frostwhisper group is small, but very heavy on horde… Deathwing group is also small, would bring some more of both… and there are likely other options, I did not look too long, just confirmed that a few of my ideas were too big or more precisely more likely to be used as building blocks for other groups.

Could Blizzard have chosen a different order for connections? Yes, absolutely. Could Blizzard have put Frostmane specifically in some other group? Yes, probably. Could Frostmane have ended together with an already expanded Aggra group at a later date? Yes, fully possible. Could Blizzard have left Aggra unconnected with anything? Extremely unlikely, given the massive size of some US connections I would even say impossible.

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159

@All: I am not sure, if the forum broke or if something else happened, but the Al’Akir thread I mentioned seems to have entirely vanished, because I was trying to reply to it, got 404’d and now I can not find it at all… :frowning:

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Might be a blue intervention, although they normally only lock threads, not delete them :slight_smile: