So we bricked an M plus key and I was met with silence. Nobody said a thing, nobody left, just silence. After what felt like a lifetime I said “do we agree to call the key?” " Yes I think we should call it" said the brave Disc Priest and we parted ways.
I didnt play great as tank and did a questionable pull, normally it would have been met with digust in chat as the group wiped, but nothing, not one comment. As they say in Suramar ‘something doesnt feel quite right’ and it doesnt.
This change by Blizzard towards mythic plus toxicity may have an unexpected butterfly effect bringing in a dystopian future where players are afraid to express themselves in any way not just a toxic one.
A weird experience that im not sure ill get used to.
Not talking beyond the bare necessities is the norm in pugs. If it became obvious we could not finish the key, people simply left without saying anything most of the time.
Sometimes, someone would say something, most of the time not rude, and then left. Cyrilic named characters occasionally said something in cyrillic and then left.
It was only in a very small amount of cases where people have been actually rude and were throwing insults at others.
The “Do we agree to call the key?” talk happened to me once when we couldn’t progress through a “+10 for the Vault, don’t care about time” run.
you’re lying, masking it in some ‘‘inocent nice person’’ disguise, just trying to get a punch at this new system that was genuinely needed for the health of the game.
Hm, had a weird CoT attempt today; we wiped twice at the first boss, after releasing, DK tank left the dungeon (went outside), we expected them to quit the group, already said things like “gl next”… but then the tank reentered the dungeon without comment (no, they didn’t just went outside to mount & rep, as one can mount inside). So… we tried again and wiped again. This time we announced to disband the group. Everyone ported away, only the tank just sat down and waited until the last one (me) left the group, obviously afraid to quit the group themselves.
Well I do wholeheartedly agree with you on that but the issue is how do you do separate legitimate reason and illegitimate reasons? Genuine question.
We are millions playing this game, so even if blizzard hires more people specifically for those kind of issues( which they won’t do because the only thing they give money to are shareholders it seems, even developers are squeezed to death), it’s hard to find a tangible solution.
Like in your previous post you said blizzard should focus on why instead of just slamming the ban hammer. Yeah you’re right, just like working on why criminals are criminals instead of just sending them to jail and forget yields better results in lowering criminality. But how do you do that?
I theoretically agree with you but fail to see where to get the ressources to make it happen.
And again, even if you genuinely leave keys for the right reasons, you have to remember that a TON of people leave keys just because they are huge Dbags that care 0 about other people’s time/have no respect for anyone but themselves.
I hope the system will be refined over time though, and that we know a bit more about what we can do and what we cannot.
And this should be punished. This is actually a 100% selfish behaviour. If the key can be finished in time, leaving it should result in a punishment. If you’re so good you can’t handle mistakes, join a MDI group and stick with them you’ll be happy and won’t waste other people’s time either. It’s a win-win for everyone involved.
its very obvious if you join keys and leave them over and over that you are griefing. Especially if its just after key start which i bet is a good measurement.
The analogy doesn’t really work, it’s not even close to being a real world criminal. I merely want the rules laid out so we know where we stand, exactly.
Not playing properly makes you a dbag. Not knowing the bare minimum makes you a dbag. You should know all mechanics, not ifs or buts in a 10+ . People deserve punishments for not interrupting/using drs/using utility/using health pots etc.
I never said i can’t handle mistakes, everyone makes them. It’s more i see people die when it’s 100% their fault multiple times or they grief the team when they have interrupt and refuse to use it.
I don’t understand how you can’t see that playing poorly is also selfish. You care so little about your team that you don’t give your all and prep before. What a swoglet.
(this wasn’t YOU you, more generalized you for the people who do this)
Constantly in pvp since dragonflight shuffles were introduced and noticed multitude of people starting to become actioned for language all around. There must been a huge spike in actions given from chat through these soloq type like shuffle/blitz and the effect is exactly this that it is not wise to have anything announced or type much in chat in general if one plays pvp. Its completely removed the social aspect of mmos from the game for me. I would rather communicate through 3rd party software outside the game these days than say anything to strangers in the game because at any given time some can click report on what you say and make some kind of report out of it and I dont know the specifics or exactly how the system works and handles these reports and does it build into some threshold till the bundle is sent for review or not. Almost anything can be interpret as something and people dont communicate only through military like short commands or as “yes” “no” they say “why Im alone with flag?” if they are frustrated and then that could be interpret as actionable.
Is that your first time actually running with decent humans?
It’s the most normal thing to do. If you see that the key is bricked and you have no strong feelings about completion, you take a moment to ask the group.
“Guys, seems like key will not be timed. You want it for completion or we call it? Better now than to leave later and waste time”
8/10 times people follow through (either calling it or going for completion), and only rarely do people leave AFTER we say to continue. This happens in cases that the key takes way more time than expected.
But yeah, that is not rare and for sure not something that started with the new policy. If the new policy actually promotes this communication, good for the community.
His made the thread because if some in his group had typed “the key is ruined, Im out” or just left the key, in both cases they could had report him for leaving and in any case the leave can build to some threshold of leaves so they was just stuck there silent instead of saying or doing what they all thought, which seemed to be give up the run like the op said. I can see how and why this creates awkward setting in the game. It carries the possibility to become the norm now for pve as it has been for pvp since dragonflight that people dont barely speak anymore.
Its an mmo, cant agree with the everyone being silent or afraid to say anything part
Ive been witnessing it in pvp since dragonflight now and I can say from own pov that game feels boring and antisocial now, and as pvp are mostly soloq now so there is not much to do with friends and inside the soloqs its not advisable to say anything. I just stop using chat with other people inside mmo and it feels weird to me atleast.
I won’t insult your intelligence, you know very well that, was the exact set of rules laid out, it would be abused the next day.
That is true.
Because you actually do keys where yes, not prepping is a huge disrespect to your team mates. I agreed with you earlier at the +10 mark. Do you know what the average key level people do? Check raider io, you’re above the average.
That’s those people I’m talking about. The huge majority of people who enter low keys and get discouraged because Joe can’t find a group for a +10 then join a +3 and leave because people don’t know the optimal route or wiped for X/y/z reason. Those people are not griefing, they’re learning.
You’re taking things from your own experience which is fair, but the system is implemented for the majority. Voicing your concerns about its limit for your experience is valid and in fact needed, but you have to take those in consideration as well.
TLDR playing poorly should not be an argument for leaving in low level keys, but yes it can be for higher level keys because those guys should know what to do unless they were boosted. But the system has to start somewhere and it’s going to tackle what plagues the majority at first.
I suggested before a stacking punishment, as in - we will lay out the rules but they will get exponentially more harsh.
I am in favour of public punishment. Put a mark next to their name or a forced negative title and people can see what you’ve done. That will be more effective than any ban. Guess who isn’t getting invited now lol. Make it account wide on a timer. If they want to be cute about it and do it over and over, make it a /playedtime timer. They have to stay logged in.
Yeah i wasn’t really talking about lower keys. I have left lower keys but its usually something egregious and i don’t think the key would be timed. I don’t do lower than minimum Gilded crest level after first few weeks/alts. But still at an 8 (old 18) i think you should basically know most of whats going on.
Nothing was changed in blizzard’s attitude towards the m+ toxicity.
Griefing was prohibited by the ToS all along. Thats the blue post was referring to.
Leaving a key which was clearly dead, is not punishable at all and there is nothing wrong with it, if it was not advertised as a weekly run.
But yes, apparently a lot of ppl misunderstood the bluepost which maybe actually good. Finally ppl will think it over if they really should click that leave group button or not.
