Feedback: Hunters

This thread is dedicated to leaving feedback on Hunters in Midnight. Look in this thread and in the Midnight Alpha Development Notes for adjustments and bugfixes made throughout the testing period.

Please note that off-topic or inappropriate posts will be strictly removed.

Apex Talents

Many Apex Talents are available for playtesting and may be selected using specialization tree points in the final specialization tree node. The current User interface (UI) is temporary for playtesting purposes and will be replaced with a final UI later in development. As with any test cycle, we will be adding more Apex Talents to the test over time and not all will be available with the start of the alpha test.

To help us refine Apex Talents, please consider the following questions as you playtest:

  • How gameplay-impacting, exciting, and fantasy forward is your Apex Talent to you?
  • Are your Apex Talents and new Hero Talents meeting the approachability goals laid out in our Combat for Everyone in Midnight article?
  • Are there cases you would consider not selecting your Apex talent?
  • Does the Apex talent disproportionally favor a particular talent build or Hero Talent tree?

For feedback regarding the changes on making the combat system more approachable for players of all skill levels, leave your feedback in the Combat Approachability feedback thread.

Thank You

We greatly appreciate all your feedback and are very excited for you to test out all the changes in Midnight!

Beast Mastery

Beast Mastery Hunters have a fantasy of consistent, reliable, and powerful pet-sourced attacks, and that’s something we’re looking to lean into as we move into Midnight. We’re reducing the number of conditionals, auras, and modifiers on Barbed Shot to make it more easy to spend as its available. We’ve grown fond of Bestial Wrath’s shorter cooldown, and as such are removing Barbed Wrath’s dynamic cooldown reduction effect to instead give Bestial Wrath a flat cooldown of 30 seconds when fully talented. Multi-Shot has had an odd place in Beast Mastery’s kit, so we’re giving it an update, causing it to be replaced in the Beast Mastery spec tree with a new pet-sourced attack that deals substantial damage in AOE while also activating effects like Beast Cleave and Kill Cleave. We hope this new spell will feel powerful and contribute meaningfully to your area damage. Bloodshed and Call of the Wild felt like they were both competing for a similar role of a cooldown that summoned a few more units to fight for you. As such, we removed Call of the Wild and are focusing on Bloodshed as a cooldown to get a few extra beasts to attack your enemies. With the change to make Kill Shot a Marksmanship only ability, Dark Rangers will now learn Black Arrow as a separate ability if they choose that Hero Talent tree.


Marksmanship

We are generally pleased with the state of Marksmanship after their Undermine(d) and Ghosts of K’aresh updates, but there were a few bigger things we’d like to address as we move into Midnight. Most notably, the introduction of Streamline as a core mechanic for Marksmanship inflated the amount of cast time reduction Marksmanship Hunters have access to while also contributing an extra aura to track. Aimed Shot is meant to be a long cast that is worth the wait. As its cast time reduces, so too must its damage, and we feel that flies in the face of what Aimed Shot should be about– as such we’ll be removing Streamline and increasing Aimed Shot’s damage. While Explosive Shot found a home as a guaranteed way to gain Lock and Load in Ghosts of K’aresh, we feel that it’s healthier for the spec as a whole to distance itself from Explosive Shot and instead focus on the more fantasy-forward spells like Volley and Kill Shot– spells that more often than not are competing with it in your rotational priorities. Speaking of Kill Shot, we are removing it from the Hunter class tree and letting Marksmanship fully own the execute niche it provides. Trueshot is gaining some cooldown reduction, cast time reduction, and focus cost reduction to compensate for the removal of Streamline.


Survival

As we head into Midnight, we’re continuing to refine and focus Survival Hunter’s fantasy, giving clearer playstyle, gameplay, and visual direction. Over the course of Alpha, we’ll be reintroducing one-handers into Survival Hunter’s pool of available weapons, which means we’ll also be looking to distance Survival from its spear-only identity that it’s had since Legion. We’ll be doubling down on Survival’s relationship with its pet with new talents that create an interdependency between the Hunter’s damage and their pet’s damage. Additionally, we’re leaning into the rugged, crafty, and bomb-centric fantasy we explored in The War Within with a new Fire grenade called Flamefang Pitch, a new visual and fantasy identity for Fury of the Eagle called Boomstick, and a host of new Wildfire Bomb talents and synergies.

Survival Hunter had a substantial number of abilities that were competing for your attention at any given time. Coordinated Assault and Flanking Strike have been combined into a new burst cooldown called Takedown that strives to take the best parts of both spells and blend them into one moment. We also made the tough decision to redesign Mongoose Bite. We feel confident that simplifying Mongoose Bite will allow us to carve out more interesting design space for Survival both now and in the future.
Lastly, in Midnight, we’d like Survival Hunter’s area damage to come from their explosives: Wildfire Bomb, Boomstick, and Flamefang Pitch, and as such we’re removing Butchery and its associated effects. We expect Raptor Swipe (Survival Hunter’s Apex Talent) to provide meaningful and exciting moments of AOE in between your chunky explosive spells.


Dark Ranger Hero Talents

Black Arrow provides an unusually high amount of damage relative to the rest of Marksmanship and Beast Mastery’s kits. In Midnight, we’re making some adjustments to ensure that Dark Ranger’s effects don’t completely overshadow the core abilities of Marksmanship and Beast Mastery.


Sentinel Hero Talents

Sentinel has been rebuilt and redesigned for Midnight. Our goals with this update were targeting the Keystone and Capstone, since that was where a majority of the tree’s complexity stemmed. This updated version of Sentinel should provide more active and directed gameplay, require substantially less tracking, be more deeply ingrained into the playstyles of Marksmanship and Survival, all while being less visually and audibly noisy.

Just wanted to provide some feedback based on the initial changes and general pain points, from a Beast Mastery main perspective. For context on what my perspective is my main content in WoW, other than being a big collector, is Mythic+ and have been in the +15-16 range these last two seasons:

Hunter’s Mark
This spell has gone through a lot of iterations over the years and now it feels like we’re repeating history in a way. I’m happy to see Hunter’s Mark becoming useful in all situations. However a lesson learned from the past needs to be reapplied now. Applying Hunter’s Mark is a giant pain in the butt. It’s on the GCD and it has a 1 target limit. In the past this was solved by having Hunter’s Mark automatically apply (if I remember on arcane shot cast) and this should be the case again. Make it so that Hunter’s Mark is the same type of automatic debuff such as the Monk’s and Demon Hunter’s debuffs.
If for whatever reason you don’t want to do that, please take Hunter’s Mark off the GCD so we can macro it into our spells like the last time we were in this section of Hunter’s Mark design cycle.

Multi Shot/Wild Thrash
I completely understand why the changes were made as they were. In endgame content Multi Shot feels like nothing more than an annoying maintenance spell you have to press every 6 (in MN 8) seconds to keep your AoE going. However the removal of Multi Shot is a really awful change for other types of content. I really really miss having a repeatable AoE spell for pulling multiple packs in outdoor content and in farming legacy content. For this last one especially also having Barrage removed really sucks.
Please keep in mind that when designing talent trees there’s more to the game than just the endgame instanced content.
Please give us Multi Shot back as a CD-less AoE spell (and preferrably Barrage for legacy content too).

As a side note, Wild Thrash, with its 8 second CD, currently can’t even be used to pull a single pack of mobs. When targetting a mob and pressing Wild Thrash, your pet does the AoE attack where it’s currently standing. It does not charge at the target and then perform the attack.

Stampede
I like the idea of moving the current Pack Leader tier set bonus into the capstone talent. However there’s one giant pain point with this version of Stampede. And that’s that the tank doesn’t see your stampede. So in Mythic+ where the tank moves around a lot to do things like chain pull the tank moves mobs out of Stampede because they can’t see it’s there. So please either change it so that others can see your Stampede or change it so that the Stampede direction changes to your target, and not a static direction from the moment you triggered Stampede.

Dire Beasts/Guardians
A quality of life change I would really appreciate is if dismissing pets outside of combat (for example to skip sneakily past some trash) would also dismiss your dire beasts/hati/fenryr so there’s 0 chance of a ninja pull or having to wait for them to run out their timer to dissapear. Of course this request is really specifically for out of combat dismissing only. Your dire beasts should not be dissapearing in combat when you dismiss pet to swap to a different pet for a different utility spell.

General Thoughts In Regard To Pruning
I think the general changes to stuff like Bestial Wrath and Barbed Shot are okay. The barbed shot changes will only really matter in the first tier of an expansion. Proper Barbed Shot management for Frenzy stacks typically becomes irrelevant once we get more Haste, which is why the first tier of every expansion has typically felt bad on BM.

I’m not a big fan of not being able to reduce the cooldown of Bestial Wrath with Barbed Shot anymore but that’s just because I’m a creature of habbit. I’m sure it’s just a matter of getting used to it and having to change the muscle memory of my combat expectations when pressing the button.

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