Yes, I’ve always hated that spell!
They should’ve migrated Chain Harvest or Vesper Totem over from Shadowlands instead of Primodial Wave.
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I know nobody plays Guardian Druid anymore because it’s so boring, but I think the Druid of the Claw hero talent could make them quite a lot of fun to play. Cat-weaving being a part of their rotation would definitely make it less boring.
The Survival Hunter side of the Pack Leader tree are in a dire need of a buff.
Survival presses Kill Command so much less than BM and also the Kill Commands themselves aren’t as powerful.
Not really sure if the Hunter devs realize that if 2 specs share an ability doesn’t necessarily mean they benefit from it equally.
If warriors aren’t getting some sort of rework going into this expac I’m genuinely so lost on Blizz mindset
P.S ADD GLADIATOR STANCE BACK
nO mAjOr reWoRkS sOrrY
So many specs in an absolute garbage state and they see no problem with it
Forst DK? Survival/Marksmanship? Fury? Windwalker/Brew? Ele/Resto? Affliction?
Hello? Devs? Get to work maybe?
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I really hope they arent pinning all their hopes on these talent trees as the next expansion big feature…because they are incredibly dull.
The DK Riders sounds pretty good as thats what this tree should of been. Less about actual DPS (thats what your original talent tree is for) and more about character identity and visually cool spells.
Sadly it just sounds like a dumping ground for talents that didnt make it to the other tree!
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It’s insane to me that so far this has been the only spec with actual lore/RP implemented properly.
Literally not a single other spec got this much “class identity” focused talents.
Closest might be Diabolist and Farseer but comparatively it’s not even close.
Did they actually say that?
From what I’ve heard they don’t any plans to alter classes substantially until TWW release, and if we follow Blizzard history of reworks they should be coming around 11.0.5. Fun.
EDIT: ok I found a statement they had from an interview in Blizzcon:
Q: Any big playstyle shifts coming in WW?
A: Right now goal is shipping the best hero talents we can ship, no plans on big baseline class changes. The work of class gameplay/balance is never done, and there will be a few talent changes here/there rather than making big changes.
So, so many boring talents.
Why spend time and effort on this at all? This is just weird.
I agree. Stormbringer should be more of a Resto/Enhance Mix as Enhancement is mostly about Air and a Storm is mighty Air that is accompanied by heavy rain and water is the element of Restauration.
It’s kind of funny how all the specs that do not add any new abilities to the rotation seem so much better designed, while the ones that do feel clunky and awkward.
A few points of feedback on classes I play actively:
Demon Hunter - Aldrachi Reaver (Rating: 5/5)
- Firstly, change the name - the Aldrachi were long gone by the time Azeroth became important and are irrelevant to DHs except being present in obscure lore related to one of many weapons we have wielded since being released from Warden’s Prison, so association makes no sense.
- The first post by Vrayth mentioned “Soul Reaver” as a possible name and I’d say its way better, especially that the tree also plays into Soul Fragments. Plus it gets extra points for connotations to an old, great video game!
- Secondly… It’s actually looks decent!
– It doesn’t add new abilities to convolute the rotation, just simply empowers existing one
– The nodes do not seem to require an intricate set of WeakAuras to be able to not fail at benefitting from tree’s perks.
– Obviously, you still should get the WA, since there’s a few “next ability deals more damage” nodes that are worth playing into, but looks simple to track.
– Army Unto Oneself looks like a strong buff for Vengeance Felblade users - I personally found that ability useless and rarely pressed, and with this talent it will quite a priority.
.
Death Knight - Rider of the Apocalypse (Rating: 1/5)
- There was a potential in the name that indicates a powerful individual. Instead, the tree reduces the DK into a “sidekick that calls in his friends to do stuff for them”. It looks like we’re “Friend of a Rider of the Apocalypse”, since we summon them, not become one of them.
- RNG chance to summon a Horseman, which can occur at a time that does not line up with our needs, with a 25% chance to get the one we actually wanted to summon. My situation needs to slow an add, I’d love Trollbane to pop, but instead I get Mograine with a free Death and Decay, and due to RNG he pops after the add is already dead. “Great success!”
- “Horsemen’s Aid” - somehow I can already see getting random AMS applied exactly between big hits. It’s an example of a toxic stockpiled RNG ability with an absolute zero player agency: RNG to summon a Horseman (outside long CD), which has RNG to cast AMS at RNG times?
- There is only one talent that looks like a proper Rider of the Apocalypse, and it raises a question, too: “On a Pale Horse” - it states it allows us to mount in combat, but does allow us to fight while mounted, or do we get dismounted upon pressing a damaging ability?
- I’m glad I play Blood most of the time, because even if this tree was overtuned I’d still hate to pick it.
- How come there is no tree that is related to the mastery of the Runeblades? Rider could have been such, having our weapon empowered with the powers of the Horsemen, rather than having them associated with a summoned NPC.
Death Knight - Deathbringer (Rating: 4/5)
- This is way better design than Rider of the Apocalypse, putting power into player and not random minions.
- Personal note: I much prefer having the tree interact with existing abilities (either by having abilities proc traits, or the ability to change into upgraded version of themselves like Vampiric Strike), adding new abilities can create a bit of a bloat or disrupt a rotation. In case of Reaper’s Mark, it adds another longish CD (1 min+) to a class that already has quite a bit of those.
- Reaper’s Mark creates a gameplay loop with a bit of player agency (timing using abilities that can speed up the explosion). The only downside here is that there is 3 minutes CD on the extra bit at the end - depends on damage tuning, but on a 1 min cooldown it feels unnecessarily excessive.
- Most talents are decent but interesting passives (Wave of Souls, Shuddering Soul) or give a meaningful twist (Dark Talons)
- There is a “fake choice” node at Death’s Bargain/Rune Carved Plates that looks very much like one is themed for DPS and other for Tank (Death Pact is not very tank friendly due to the downside it causes, and the small % damage reduction is only useful during constant damage intake really relevant to tanks only).
- Capstone Exterminate’s first scythe has 15% chance to apply Reaper’s Mark that is 1 min CD… I don’t like it, there is no agency and there is too much power in it. Imagine if there was a talent that said “After your Empower Rune Weapon ends, you have 10% chance for Empower Rune Weapon to be applied to you again at full power.” What I mean is that it is not OK to have 15% chance to reapply something that has longer cooldown. It is fine if something has 15% to reapply a disease that we can actively refresh anyway, so we just save resources, but this? I would rather have 15% chance to regain 3 Runes or something similarly less significant.
- “Blood Fever” talent makes irrelevant damage of a DoT still irrelevant (though adds interaction with Bind in Darkness talent). I would love to see the diseases be more, either do more damage or create some rotational interaction.
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This is literally a reason to stop playing for me.
Im not in the mood of rerolling FOTM.
Not kidding. Shaman has been in dire need of a rework since S1 of DF. Its really disappointing to hear that.
The worst part is that they will tune the Hero Talents to a talent tree that is by default bad.
So when they actually rework the talent tree, they will need to rework the hero talents from the ground up as well.
Its a STUPID idea. Stupid management, and stupid overall.
Address the talent tree FIRST. THEN do the Hero talents.
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Agreed, although I’m not sure we ever really had this Ancestors / Spirit vibe in game.
We’ve always been the Elements class apart from Ghost Wolf and maybe Far Seeing (whatever it’s called, that spell we never use). And totem although they’re almost entirely gone from my gameplay (I still drop a Healing Stream Totem but mostly just to have a totem on the ground as I’m not sure it does anything). PVP players might be using some CC type totem (Earthgrasp or whatever) but I don’t pvp.
If they want to bring more Ancestors or Spirits to our class then you need to do it much earlier than some Hero Talents at level 70 and you probably needed to do it in 2004.
In the legion death knight campaign you will learn that as the playable death knight you are the deathlord. The riders are your servitors. The entire campaign is you going around and raising dead champions to become the new 4 horsemen who’d serve you. You even assault the paladin order hall in an attempt to raise Tirion as the new leader of the 4 horsemen. So no, you do not become one of the 4 horsemen because you are far above them in lore.
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The Deathlord raised this 4 Horsemen we are borderline the closest thing to a Lich King right now thanks to controling the Frozen Throne, that means the 4 Horsemen serves the Deathlord as hes the lord of death.
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It means the first. There is already a Garnision ability in Nagrand and a Class Hall Order Upgrades for Paladins in Legion.
I played the campaign so no need to reiterate.
My point is completely different: the hero tree is called Rider of the Apocalypse and not Deathlord. The four risen are Deathlord’s Horsemen in service of Acherus.
Most of all, in my opinion, being a Rider of the Apocalypse should make the player hold the powers in their hands, or in their Runeblade.
Like Chillmore above said, controlling the Horsemen makes us the Lich King, so we could rename the hero class to Lich King, Lich Lord or even just Deathlord.
Again, it’s my opinion, and you may disagree. But from non-lore perspective I would prefer the power to be in my hands, not that of powerful randomly summonable sidekicks, making me the guy that calls stronger friends to help me all the time.
I would assume so as well, but since you’re not a dev I cannot take your word for it. Nothing against you, we simply had enough disappointments in the past for me to be too hopeful.
But that is what death knights do, you summon ghouls, abominations, gargoyles, frost wyrms, small wyrms…I mean death knights summon a lot of friends.
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