Giantstalker [WoTLK - EU] and Hydraxian Waterlords [WoTLK - EU]

WoW Classic Cataclysm Classic Discussion
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Hi all,

At face value, Giantstalker and Hydraxian Waterlords couldn’t be more different. One’s a PvE server, a fresh realm since the launch of WotLK, the other an RP server that’s been around since the relaunch of WoW Classic.

Yet, these servers have a lot in common. Both were practically destroyed by free transfers to other realms, and both servers faced the impossible task of rebuilding a community after said transfers.

Fast forward to today, and it seems both were extremely successful at doing so. Giantstalker has two active alliance guilds, who together have cleared all content (except for LK 25 man HC, but we’re almost there! :wink: ).

Hydraxian Waterlords has kept RP alive in Europe, being the only RP realm left. They even managed to welcome refugees from other language groups, offering them a safe haven within their community.

Blizzard, please realise that not everyone wants to play on a mega server. By forcing us all to move to the same two servers, our game experience will change completely.

Therefore I ask you to please keep both servers alive, or, if that’s not possible, to at least let us be merged. So our communities of like-minded people with similar playing styles, can continue to exist and flourish.

Thanks!

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Free transfers are currently being offered. This is being done to improve realm populations

It’s unlikely that any realms will be exempted from this.

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Anything’s unlikely in life if you don’t ask for it.

We don’t need our server population to be increased. It’s exactly the reason why we play on our servers and why our servers exist.

People who want to play on servers with big populations will have plenty of options once this is finished. People who prefer to play on servers with small populations (let’s say, anywhere between 10 to 1500 people) will have nowhere to go.

People who enjoy PvE and PvP will be able to find a dedicated server. People who enjoy RP, will not.

So we have a use case: people who enjoy playing on smaller realms and people who enjoy RP. Now we just need Blizzard to realise this and continue to implement it.

Thank you!

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While I support keeping RP server, I don’t see what is the issue of playing on a bigger PVE server. You don’t have to group or trade with players outside of your community. A brand new player doesn’t have to do research before choosing a realm to play. And most new players want to play on realms with sufficient population. They need groups for difficult content, they need mats on the AH.

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We have all those things on our server. We’ve cleared all raiding content, do you think we can’t trade, have no access to consumables or find groups for challenging content?

This is not an ‘or’ story, or at least, it doesn’t have to be. The mega servers will exist without us as well. We’re just asking for one ‘server’ (it’s not an actual server, there’s no actual extra cost or hardware here) that can remain relatively ‘low’ pop.

And speaking of ‘new players’ having to research where they start: most people who start on our realm actually end up staying. Because we take the time to actually whisper them and explain them the situation on our realm. So that’s a moot point as well.

And come to think of it, who ever asked for realm consolidation? Why does everyone seem to think this is all the playerbase wants? And if that would really be the case, why not just merge every single PvE and PvP server into one per type? Not to mention the fact we actually set up multiple guild banks, who’s going to refund us for that?

There has to be room for an alternative to the servers with layers, GDKP pugs and 5k+ players per side. Especially in our modern world that continuously promotes ‘having the choice to be yourself’. It’s not because you don’t understand the appeal, that it doesn’t exist.

Well, here’s the alternative. I’m proposing one.

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I still can’t understand why you don’t want to move the whole your guilds to the bigger servers and continue playing there. As I said you can ignore all the other players. But I am sure you would have a look for few seconds at a nice transmogs or mount, which you would rarely see if you are on low population realm.
It’s mainly the PVP realms that are infested with GDKP, I think on PVE realms it’s less prevalent.
And there is extra cost for the hardware and running of every realm.
Lots of players asked for realm merging, consolidation and connecting.

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Firstly, it’s a big logistical operation. You can’t transfer guilds, you have to remake them (transfer all the items over, buy the bank tabs again, etc.).

Secondly, it’s not about ‘ignoring’ other players. It’s not about unique mounts on the auction house. It’s about the fact that we play the game in a completely different way than most people do on the bigger servers. It’s a completely unique experience, that you can only understand if you’ve ever played on a similar server. We have no bots e.g., we know practically everyone that plays on our server and we’ve got a unfying cause (which we won’t have once we leave the server).

Of course we know we could play on another server. We’ve had free transfers for more than a year now to Nethergarde Keep. Does the fact that we never used them, make you understand this better? Surely, you must realise that there’s a reason why we’ve never taken the transfers.

It’s like people who play Hardcore or Self Sufficient mode. You can go and tell them as well that you don’t understand why they just don’t group up with other people or just ‘ignore’ the people that don’t play Hardcore (remember how they had to do that when all they had was the addon?).

Playing on Giantstalker was a challenge to us, a way to play the game in a different and unique way. And now it’s our home, just like Hydraxian is for the small RP community. We can only play like this on our servers.

So honestly, you have no idea what you’re talking about. And that’s fine, you can’t really understand it unless you’ve actually played like this. And if we ever get to keep our servers, then maybe you can come around, give it a shot and see what it’s all about. We’ll definitely welcome you with open arms.

And no, in today’s setup there’s no significant extra cost anymore. If there would be, they would simply consolidate all servers into one. No, this is most likely linked to the fact Blizzard is scared that numbers will be low for Cata and they’re making a preemptive strike to make the numbers seem bigger than they actually are (big populated servers look good).

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Any horde RP guilds choosing to move to one of these realms? Or anyone on these realms suggest the better one for rolling horde when pre-patch goes live?

Thanks.

Edit: I would 100% prefer that the devs reconsidered their decision to close HWL. It’s OK to have a small RP realm if everyone on it is HAPPY.

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I would not move just yet and I would also suggest that, if there is planning necessary, we should plan in the discord, too. most active guilds have at least some members in the discord, not nearly as many people are looking in the forums :confused:

Edit just to say: I would absolutely support a merge!

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I 100% agree with this statement, and not only that, but I, including the rest in Hydraxian Waterlords, would be welcoming to anyone who wants to come over from these smaller realms, as we are not all that different!
Keeping both realms alive, yes, but I don’t see why a transfer over to one of the other isn’t a bad idea either, or a merge? working together with a like-minded community! ^^

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Of course, to my mind, Giantstalker players have as much right to keep their realm as we Hydraxian players do ours, but if keeping both going isn’t for whatever reason possible, then allowing us to find a new home among kindred spirits on one another’s realms is something we could accept. Despite their different realm tags, both realms have been kept alive by a close-knit community of guilds, therefore the players of each realm are likeminded and compatible in this regard.

A merge then would be an elegant solution if a need to reduce the server count exists; you’d be injecting the numbers you believe are sorely lacking from both realms at the very least.

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Last time I checked Hydraxian wasn’t locked, maybe it won’t be closed?

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At the moment it seems not locked but we have no official announcement so we should persevere in our quest.

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You don’t want the population of Blizzard’s server you are playing on to be increased and it won’t since fresh and RP realms are technically dead. However Blizzarrd are keen on consolidating dead realms as it was the case with realm consolidation before Wrath and August 10 2022. Wrath fresh realms were dead shortly after DF came out, because they were full of FOMO hype wave riders, but every as short lived as they were the fresh realms existed only because previous consolidation freed up server capacity. It is unlikely that we get Cata fresh realms, most casuals that wanted fresh start would rather jump to War within especially after hyped Pandemonium WoW remix 10.2.7 patch PvE event, so only biggest progression realms would survive up to the end of Cata Classic and I can’t blame Blizzard for doing something wrong in this case.

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But what is a ‘dead server’ and what is ‘technically dead’? There’s no official measurement to determine this and it feels arbitrary to just point at mega servers as the only example to follow. That’s not how WoW used to be played and I thought all of this was a revisiting of the past?

The servers aren’t dead, there’s several hundreds of people playing on them. In the case of Nethergarde it’s even several thousand.

If there’s a need to consolidate these servers (financial/technical), why not say so? Why not state, clearly and openly, what the required benchmark is in order to keep a server open?

Right now, it all feels completely arbitrary to me. It feels as if Blizzard just assumes nobody likes a realm with a small population (what is small anyway? <500? <1000? Blizzard should clarify this).

If there would be clear rules as to how a server can remain open, with clear requirements such as active subscribers, raiders, … then smaller realms could monitor these numbers and turn on the ‘marketing’ campaigns once numbers start to get too low.

And you know these ‘marketing’ efforts work, because a lot of people are always looking for a new ‘WoW project’ that makes them reroll for the hundredth time (think of all the repopulation efforts and ‘fresh start’ projects we have seen on these forums in the past few years).

Because, contrary to popular belief, many players enjoy playing on a server where ‘everybody knows your name’. It’s just that most people are unaware such servers exist (they just assume they’re completely dead) and they need to be informed (basically the issue with anything in our digital world where there’s an overabundance of information on a daily basis).

I mean, think about it this way: on most Wotlk servers raiding numbers currently decrease week after week. We manage to stabilize this and even introduce new players each week. We’re the only realms where people still fully enjoy Wotlk and where people still have clear raid targets that almost the whole realm contributes too (because of the specific difficulty/play style our servers require). We also have a very good retention rate when it comes to new players who start on our server: most actually continue playing all the way to level 80 and see raid action with us.

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I fully support the idea. And I would go a step further and ask to keep HWL open and give both Giantstalker AND Nethergarde Keep the option to transfer to HWL. So players have the choice if they want to go a big server like Mirage Raceway or Pyrewood OR settle down in a smaller, cozier community on Hydraxian.

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I would like to give this some more thoughts.
There absolutely ARE people who prefer smaller servers. We’ve stayed for so long for a reason.
So why not make those megaservers for those who enjoy them - and keep one smaller server (aka HWL) for those who prefer it smaller? Why not give people a choice to move to a smaller server instead?
Just announce it on the big thread, open transfers from Giantstalker to HWL - maybe from nethergarde keep, too, they are said to have had a healthy rp community - and let people make the choices?

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Please consider allowing the people from Giantstalker to transfer (free) to Hydraxian Waterlords.

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AND the RP tag on Hydraxian is a perfect reason to keep it alive. You would have an RP server left AND you would have a small cozy server for those who prefer that. Win-Win.

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Exactly this! It looks as if for the time being HWL will stay, which is great.
But it wouldn’t hurt if those who wanted to come would be able to come, too.
Something seems off anyway with those realm consolidations… More info from Blizz would be really cool :confused:

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