The problem still exist even on lower keys but since you can overgear them people think that below 10 keys Druid magically become equal to other tanks.
Of course doing low keys on a 400+ Druid is a cakewalk but you really think a 360 Druid will not struggle more compared to a 360 dk while doing low keys?
Taking another tank instead of a Druid (at the same skill level) is always a good choice, the only difference on keys at 10 or below is that the room for error is way larger and so the druid lacks can be tolerated, the higher you go the less space for mistakes you have.
I am not saying Druid are completely garbage but they need love.
not sureâŚ
i tried my crappy 380 dk on a +7 KR and he got smacked hard. It wasnât exactly easier than on my druid
Take the first boss room as an example:
The caster mobs hit like trucks - advantage dk because of ams + selfheal
But the berserkers also hit like trucks and enrage - advantage druid because high armor and rage dispell
both have to face tank them pretty much
maybe i m just too bad at my dk but certain dungeons feel easier on my druid
I did tank with dk too and compared to Druid is way easier, at least in my opinion.
Grip and Mass Grip are pure gold, the self sustain is insane and In dungeon content self sustain mean healer can go push dps, and a person doing dps can make a big difference overall.
Ofc Druid have a better mitigation but dk ability to recover from hits is way better in my opinion.
I am not saying that Druid canât t be better in specific situation but overall, dk are better by a far margin.
You can have the enrage dispel even with a resto Druid, you donât need to take a Guardian Druid for the dispel, on the other hand you canât have the mass grip taking frost or uh dk.
I agree that guardians need some changes.
I play with 2 guardian druids as tanks in my raid and i do keys with both of them and they do well in their roles and never had problem healing them.
I would like to see them being able to dispel in bear form, and getting rage of the sleeper back or something similar. Both my bear friends do miss that ability terribly.
I know they are not the best but if we are talking about low keys, you can take any tank and complete it. Im only doing 12s max really but its because our dps is bad and never felt that our guardians were pulling the group back.
I also did couple keys with our dk offspec tanking and i still didnt feel any difference between that and our druids in terms of oh we made it faster or better just because a dk tank.
The % of different tanks is you know not just about who is best. There are not an equal number of ppl playing with each tanking spec. And guardian is pretty dull and boring to play so many just dont play it. I only play bm and blood dk tanks as offspec/alt and play boomie/resto on druid simply because guardian is boring.
I agree that it affects the % but there are just less ppl playing guardian compared to dk overall. And doesnt help that random groups will ignore bears signing up for keys because the community perception is they are bad to do ANY keys with.
I dont agree with what someone said about bears being good in legion so now they are ignored stop complaining.
Blood dks were bad at the start of legion but became really strong throughout most of it, and they were the only used tank on the second mdi pretty much, that you just felt sick seeing every group with a blood dk at that point.
And blood dks are good and popular still.
Bears need some changes. Thats not a question.
Guardian druids atm have no way to deal with magical dmg, we can be 1 shotted by it ⌠this needs to change ⌠to we need keep iron fur up to even match the armor of a paladin ⌠what kind of bull@#$% is that ⌠if we use 1 skill we pop out of bear formâŚat the same time other classes can do everything they want ⌠fix this #$%# blizzâŚ
I mean none of the tanks have much protection against magical damage. They removed it from even veng dh.
Now there is AMS for dks but on a big cooldown and paladins have spellwarding or bubble i guess both big cooldowns.
Blizz wanted to nerf tanks against magical. Now it hurts every tank if there are multiple casters.
Oneshotting a bear though? Nah dont think so.
I dunno if Iâd count a 1 min CD on AMS as a big cooldown (and you can talent it down to 45 seconds). But yeah, tanks overall are weaker against magical damage than they were in Legion but no one is getting one-shot by magical damage, unless it was straight up meant to be a one-shot mechanic. In which case, everyone without immunity is gonna die.
other tanks have better passive mitigation against magic damage because their mitigation just works differently.
Heals from dks,dhs and pala work the same way against magic as against physical dmg, but ironfur (our main mitigation without cd) doesnât do anything
Brew master has stagger and warrior has IP
On top of that, other tanks (except brewmaster) has more tools against casters (interrupts, silence, grip, ams, whatever)
I mean you are comparing ironfur to other tanks selfhealing. Other tanks mitigation doesnt do anything against magical damage either like demon spikes or shield of the righteous. Atleast compare 2 of the same category spells, like frenzied regen vs death strike vs light of the protector vs soul cleave or spirit bomb vs ignore pain.
Monks stagger some amount of magical but thats about it.
Sure, druid selfheal is not as good as dk, but magic damage still hurts dks a lot too as any other tank.
Brewmaster has tools against casters m8. its called interrupt, leg sweep and ring of peace lol. Idk why even put interrupt in this category since every tank has one.
Mastery increases your maximum health and your healing received, which effectively functions like a damage reduction in practice (damage reductions increase the amount of damage you can take before you die, just like health increases).
If you compare this with a paladin, they have reduced damage from their mastery, but have significantly less HP. Thus effectively the same âmitigationâ, just a bit more reliant on heals.
The ââpassiveââ mitigation from SotR is plain Armor, useless against magic. Our 2 cooldowns do reduce all damage taken, Spellwarding can be used and bubble. But our passive mitigation isnât that different.
There are some changes I would like, and dps/threat gains would be at the top of my list. However Guardian Druids can tank very well. So far I havenât come across any insurmountable odds.
However:
I miss FR off gcd.
Thrash snaring enemies
Rage of the Sleeper
The -10% magic dmg to a specific school once you take damage.
The chance to double/triple thrash.
Rebirth having 0 rage cost (caught me out a few times!)
I miss these things, otherwise I was quite happy we didnât change much.
One thing Blizzard should think about is that we are DRUIDIC bear, a force and guardian of nature. We seem to be a little too limited to what a ânormal bearâ could do, thematicallyâŚ
no i donât need to compare armor buffs to armor buffs. DHs and DKs have no or less uptime on armor buffs because they have a second mitigation type (self healing).
Guardian has no self healing, therefore 100% uptime on at least 1 stack ironfur
FR doesnât do anything and also has a long CD, I wonât call it really a mitigation tool
Interrupt works for everyone other tools you described doesnât work on every mob and against no bosses at all
If i have 0 tools as a tank and others have 1 bad tool; the bad tool is still better
not sure if I remember it correctly, but isnât it that DH has 10% general dmg reduction?
Last few days I have been trying the Incarnation talent to help with threat + damage on Reaping. Yesterday on a +10 WCM I pulled 80k dps on our 2nd Reap and I constantly was 2nd or even 1st during Reaps with Incarnation on.
Way to put Protection Warrior dps to shame.
It saddens me, how Guardians have so much potential to be a highly performing tank, but since we lack in so many areas, we end up trying to close so many holes on the âshipâ in order not to âsinkâ and we end up coming out shortâŚ
i would appreciate it if we get atleast a perma slow on thrash of 20%, paladins have perma slow of 50% with their consecration, we only have Ursols Vortex every 1 minute and our mass entanglement which has only limited use.
We have Feral Affinity, so that will not be a underwhelming buff for guardians in comparsion to paladin tanks as example.
I think that is all we need to be competetive. and maybe a bit more damage, about another 12 - 17%?, only maybe, it is not that important as a perma slow on trash.
Just do it Blizzard, that will not be a overpowered buff for guardians. I dont see the problem to do so, please blizzard, guardian tanking makes a lot of fun, and that is what i wish myself to play with.
i want it to feel great agian like artifact abillite i think made you feel powerful. it feels canda cluncky to me comperd to legion i still main gardian im Abel to do my 10s just fine but its easyer on other tanks BC lack of kiting abilitise and some mobes bing immune to slows make ursuls vortex bad on necrotic weeks, skittish weeks are a nightmerr on bear in my apinon BC of bear being the lowes thret generating tank. all in all i still like its defentli callenging but i think that the treat isu is the Worst. i recamend a change to the incarnasjon talent makeing you do high burst of treat during its window and better damge reduction let me know what you think about that. sorry but my English isent that good xD
its actually a bloody shame on balance team.
healer in my group refused to take guardian druid with the same Rio as him, only to take the prot warrior with ( same Rio) but 15 ilvl lower.
Why does the game punishes people who want to take this responsible role?!
I am very mad at how guardian is treated atm, cause as pally I remember what is to be underdog.
Another issue is group buffs. A warriorâs Battle Shout gives all melees +10% attack power, and since most M+ groups now run with two or even three melees, that alone would be another reason to not take a bear even if everything else was equal (which it isnât). The scrolls, besides being costly, only provide +7% attack power.
Fewer tools, low damage, and less group utility and nothing to really compensate for those shortcomings. Iâm actually perplexed that we are halfway through the second tier and nothing meaningful has been done to improve bears.
I think its very sad how the balancing department allows such a gap between the effectiveness of tanks. Its so clear DH and Bears need buffs and Warrior needs a DPS nerf. Everyone agrees, especially content creators, yet Blizz themselves do nothing. Ask yourself whyâŚ
Its in their interest financially. Every expac there are underperforming classes. This will result in some poor souls buying their boosts and rerolling. A terrible long term strat as balance is one of the main reasons people quit. Many get attached to their class and want to play only that. Itâs also not good enough saying well Resto and Boomie are performing well so be grateful. I didnât roll a Druid to play these specs, so its completely irrelevant. If the balance department decide its your class this expac, well enjoy my friend. Short term gain, long term loss. Gaming companies are so short sighted.
Its a shame as I really love this game and apart from balance, its really well polished imo.