I think the problem here is something along the line of blizzard removing PvP vendors. It’s not anyone’s fault you don’t like PvE, and what you should be probably complaining about is for blizzard to make more PvP gear. Believe me emptying your wallet isn’t fun either.
Well if they’re pros I’d imagine there’s money involved. It’s silly to think they wouldn’t invest money. I’d honestly consider paying as simply cutting corners as it just gets you to your goal faster.
I mean no matter how much top level gear you’d bestow on me I’d still not be able to be on par with those guys.
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Yes!!!
End of discussion
/closed
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Yes it has. Anyone denying that is a 
, 
user or booster
My point still stands, a P2W game makes it convenient and the game itself is designed to make you impulse buy, WoW isn’t, and for those who can’t afford to buy subs will instead farm gold to buy a token for sub, it’s a win for the player, in P2W, there is no winning what so ever for the player, the items in P2W games are always there to buy, and players in WoW who want to get an advantage to buy gear have to be lucky it shows up on the AH, NOT convenient, so they truly don’t have an advantage to just hang around updating AH over and over and spending a bung load of money on tokens to afford a good set, you’re better of actually playing the game, buying one piece now and then when you’re lucky it’s on AH ain’t gonna give a major advantage.
I always enjoy your strong, coherent arguments.
Thoe blunt as he may be,he nailed everything in one sentence.
As I am neither of his three arguments and don’t believe that WoW has become Pay2Win I am obviously the outlier here.
Being in a disagreement is part of the forums,everyone has there own look on things.Nothing bad in it,just the forums 
as long as it is civil.
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Which one of the 3 are you?
That’s exactly what they’re doing lol people don’t enjoy doing pve to farm corruptions. Yet they’re too good to avoid it and because of that you need to buy gold or pay with real money to get mythic carrys up to nzoth for the extra 485 pieces.
No. If you think that then you haven’t even checked what is happening with pvp in high scene atm. only a “literal” handful of people earned the gear by actually playing PvE.
I am none of the three which is what I said later on.
Yes there is pay2win in the game currently, but it is neither of what you put as examples.
You don’t really get a strict advantage. You will have to spend less time doing stuff on multiple characters, but it does not strictly favor you in a 1 characters setting.
It has some indirect implications if you use it to hard farm gold for boes, but more on that later.
This is not winning. You don’t win the game by getting cutting edge or keystone master, you win the game by earning them.
Boosting is not pay2win because you’re not taking rank away from other players really. In the case of cutting edge your kill won’t matter since it’s ranked by guild, and in M+, the amount of gold you would have to spend to realistically affect someone, who cares about their rank, is so insanely high, that i doubt anyone would pay for it.
What is currently pay2win is that the best gear in the game currently i obtainable on the AH. And unlike previous tiers, it’s not just a bit better than what you would get, it is much much better, to the point where you’re not even playing the same game as top players, because you can do the exact same things, play just as well and do half the damage.
And that’s why multiboxing to farm gold for boes has an indirect effect as pay2win.
This is the biggest joke of a comment. It’s not at all that someone doesn’t want or need it, but if i loot my BiS as boe, but i can sell it for 4m (yes that is what my bis is worth) then you can be sure that i am selling that, 4m is way more valuable than any upgrade.
And also paying to obtain the best thing in the game, when it’s not realistically obtainable for an individual, no matter if someone else earned it or not, is inherently pay2win.
How is buying tokens and then buying gear from the AH not pay to win? Especially in pvp where now only item level matters.
How is buying tokens and then paying scummy, spammy boosters to boost you not pay to win?
multiboxers most likely paid only one or two months with real money and then use their gold earnings to buy the subs, but on this only blizz could confirm this trend.
people that buy boosts for gold or real money are the same kind of losers that would use aimbots / wallhacks and the likes in 1st person game and then boast on how skilled they are as a player.
Yes its true, but I am just quoting what the pillar vs pillar simulator community keep saying.
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This is not exclusive to wow. Every single game that has some sort of online progression system will bring with it pay2win in some way. Legally or illegal. It’s just how it is. Wherever theres customers there will be a business in whatever way. Even if Blizzard tried their best to prevent it, it’s still going to happen somehow. If anyone’s fault it’s really the people’s fault who actually buy boosting services because it’s them who keep this stuff going. Though as well to blame are some leaders who don’t invite people if they don’t have a certain achievement.
My friend for example has no curve. He is ilvl 460 and can’t even get into a normal raid even though he knows the tacts. So what is he supposed to do now? He tried for weeks to find a raiding guild or to get into pug groups but no luck. All he can really do is buy curve at this point.
Well, the ago old answer to this age old question is a bit disheathening, I know
But: form his own pug
Seen several way - i mean WAY, 425 way or lover - lover ilvl people succesfully make a pug raid team for Ny’alotha Heroic, not even for normal, Heroic!
Take a bit mor time, sure, but with his 460 lvl even who regurally inspect/watch HP wouldn’t have problem with him as a RL 
So he is actually not forced to buy a curve - makes things easier, yes, but not a must
With the current we have after all the fine details are worked out it most certainly is p2w(skip) with couple of lootbox like systems since the gear is rng.(depending what you are buying)
You buy gems(gold) from Blizzard so you can buy boosts from players (effort,time) be that we are talking about achivments,leveling,gear,rank,items.All thx to the Token that made it mainstream.
So I thought I would look at some farming spots, you know get my tailoring up … youtube found a spot all you tailors will know the spot
Guess What …
Yes that’s right … botting farm
3x boomkin 3x frost mage 1x Monk tank all standing in in a triangle pulling none stop, so been watching him for 3 days now logs on about 8-9-30 am and still standing tin the same spot 16 hours later 
Of course I have reported him and his little grp, but 3 days later he still logs on in the morning still botting … now he could just be multi-Boxing for 16 hours in the same spot… 
Like you said money talks
Power Corrupts, absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely !