Thank you.
Its good to know since it makes my belief on some peoples âOnly me not youâ mentality stronger.
Most of us just wants better/more customizations for the velf and belf.
While lore can be a reason for it, to me, it smells alot like âthey can only do the lore according to my belief moving forwardâ rather than âits a possibility in the futureâ.
Afraid not, Iâd assume that theyâre taught by the VElves? Or maybe itâs just one of those cases where Devourers are /only/ VElves, but for gameplay practicality, the spec is available to NElves and BElves too. I actually know precious little about the Devourer DH spec and lore associated with it. Havenât seen much.
lightforged void strider
I joke - probably some courser/charger?
I mean weâve seen the basics of the first DH learning to use Void in the Kâaresh Questline although the Demon Hunter was Night Elf I believe and it ended poorly. The knowledge would spread among them afterwards.
Keep in mind Demon Hunters be it Night or Blood Elves donât seem to work within their society and use methods that neither group approve. I mean using pure Fel is also a taboo among Blood Elves considering Fel Energy is a contraband and we deal with the ring snuggling it in a Murder Row Dungeon apparently.
It does, actually.
Whether youâre receptive to that information is another matter ENTIRELY.
Judging by how this thread has gone so far ⌠probably not. It includes a lot of confirmed sources and official material. In other words, stuff that has seemingly been irrelevant to you.
Still waiting for that answer, by the way.
This is your source. Again, deprecated.
âThis article is a copy of âThe Warcraft Encyclopedia,â an official article by Blizzard Entertainment. It presented information about a variety of things in the Warcraft universe. The original article, formerly located at âŚ, did not survive the overhaul of the World of Warcraft Official Website.â
âââ
And besides. Weâre playing a game. Whatâs presented in-game should triumph external sources. And what we have seen so far, blizzard is more than eager to litter high elves among the Alliance.
That is not deprecated.
That is the article is no longer present on the official site. Loads of things that were on the official site have been removed over the years. That doesnât mean the information within was decanonised.
The Warcraft Encyclopedia was intended to be expanded over the years, but it never was. It was removed, not because the information was wrong, but because it was all that was there of an aborted project they never finished.
For something to be decanonised it needs to be explicitly retconned. And no, Alliance High Elves are not âlitteredâ around the place. Each and every instance that you claim that they have been has been forensically analysed out of necessity in this debate. We have seen at most the same few elves from the Silver Covnenant showing up from time to time and an occasional Stormwind Mage.
Pretty sure that in terms of canonicity - Blizzardâs official stance is that all sources are canon until disproved by something newer.
Itâs why most of the sources that are cherrypicked and utilized kind of fail? Like Iâm sorry - but these people are using a 2001 novel, a 2005 forum moderatorâs post and a 2008 novel to prove that High Elves are not really existing any longer. All came before WotLK when they changed their stance and cluttered the Alliance with HElves. And sure - in Classic that was a partly correct assessment. But then we get WotLK and everything thereafter where the High Elves receive dedicated representation in patches and expansions as an integral force of the Alliance Millitary.
Disproving most of that.
2001 novel, 2005 forum post, 2018 commentary (twice) from Ion, the very existence of Void Elves, the lore of the game itselfâŚ
And the Silver Covenant was a part of the Dalaran military, not the Alliance and Dalaran was mostly neutral till it became a pile of rubble. They were Alliance friendly, but technically not Alliance. Same reason the Sunreavers had to be integrated into Horde forces following the purge. Thatâs why most of the times they showed up was really Dalaran involvment.
Because they are hell bent on cherry picking the tiniest little thing to prove their point. Or being exceedingly pedantic over ultimately irrelevant things.
Ignoring that blizzard themselves have largely ignored their own writing and statements for what they present in game, the primary source.
As Iâve said earlier. Look at what blizzard does, not what they say they do.
Before I ask my questions, I will happily provide a baseline so that Iâm not misunderstood.
I do not believe this information to be deprecated until I see an official source that contradicts the one that exists. That is also, by the way, how the Warcraft Wiki works.
And beyond speculation, how any body works that uses sources and information.
Until you have something that confirms the invalidity of something else, it remains.
Otherwise it is speculation. It might very well be true, but one canât know.
The Warcraft Wiki puts anything that is not confirmed information under speculation, and that particular information is not put under a speculation category since itâs not considered such. Not by me, mind. By them.
Are you saying, with 100% certainty, in light of a former confirmed source [and sadly the latest source] that itâs not a relevant source anymore?
Because thatâs what I argue youâre suggesting.
Iâm not saying I know, Iâd be happy to be wrong. As Iâve stated several times now.
Iâm saying I will believe what the official sources say before I claim otherwise.
But you and this posse have spent this entire thread claiming -you know-.
Not that you wish, hope or would like for things to be a certain way based on what you perceive to be the evidence in-game. Not that all the signs point to the high elves being more relevant, and that you meanwhile acknowledge the sources that exist.
Thatâs not what the discussion has been.
Any suggestion that touches upon the contents of those pages have had us called haters.
Because if any of you had ANYTHING that would strengthen your claims or SHUT ME THE HELL UP ⌠those links wouldâve been the first thing posted in this thread. You wouldnât have the âplay the gameâ, âKeep reachingâ or âAwesome way to filter out the trollsâ, âmy bff is an AIâ 8-year-old shenanigans.
Those links wouldâve been put here so fast I wouldnât even have had time to type the word âsourceâ before they were presented to us. But theyâre not.
Because they donât exist.
Hereâs the issue. This debate has gone on for over 15 years. I can recall folks being breathless during the lead up to the reveal of Warlords of Draenor to see if High Elves were about to be announced it has been going on that long.
If you want to clear all the crap on this out of the way, letâs do that. Letâs ignore the lore, the tedious debates over numbers, the number of times the Silver Covenant has been used, whether they were working for Dalaran or not, letâs get all of that off the table and just get down to brass tacks. Letâs remove pedantry and irrelevances.
Itâs all gone now. So here it is.
They arenât adding the same race to the game twice because you donât like the faction theyâre on. They may use high elves on the Alliance for story reasons or nostalgia, but they use Ogres the same way. Thatâs it.
Theyâre not taunting you, or teasing you or anything else. That is LITERALLY all there is too it and all there ever was to it. Everything else is just fan debating.
Unlike the Quelâlithien and Quelâdanil High Elves - the Dalaran High Elves never left the Alliance nor had to rejoin it at any point. Theyâve always been Alliance-aligned. Likewise, Dalaran itself never was neutral - per the dialogue in The Legacy of the Kirin Tor between Jaina and Khadgar, theyâve /always/ been Alliance-aligned. They just saw it fitting to accomodate and play host to the Horde after Aethas brokered deals with the Kirin Tor to allow Blood Elves in the Kingdom sometime before the start of WotLK, according to Lorâthemarâs short-story in Cataclysm.
Iâm still waiting on a source on when all the High Elves returned to Quelâthalas btw and are now Blood Elves.
They already replied.
This entire discussion is a trivial issue of blizzards own making. Players got a simple request, a request blizzard themselves have taunted the player base with.
Blood elves wonât lose anything with the addition of playable High Elves. Not their City, not their identity, story or heroes.
It would just make something that already exists in game, in plenty. Playable.
And still not answering the question. Merely dancing around in a circle.
Around and around.
For one simple reason:
⌠You canât answer the question.
Livia, we are leaving all the crap aside now, right?
Thatâs what you wanted and that is what this boils down to. We are leaving the lore aside now and this is the one truth.
They ARE the same race. Theyâve always been the same race. And thatâs why they were never added and why they arenât going to be. That is all there ever was to this. Everything else was just a rhetorical arms race with you trying to prove they were different and others trying to show you they were the same.
I think they are cognizant of the opposite, otherwise they wouldnât be so vocally opposed. Speaking in relation to Argent Dawn (since a few of the posters here are RPers), back when Void Elves were added on the Alliance side - the BElf RP scene died off instantly and became a ghost town over night ever since. I guess itâs shown some recovery in the past month, but thatâs only because of the BElf expansion on the horizon.
The way this game treats races, even the same race like pandaren is in fact 3 races, one of each faction and neutral.
This is due to how the god awful mess the faction system is.
So even if the exact same âraceâ was added to the alliance, they would be flagged as a different race.
Aka, the core of this entire damn mess is the faction barrier. Which in itself has been a stain on both gameplay and story.
And much like how blizzard ignore what they say and write about high elves, with how they are treated in-game. They are more than eager to ignore the faction barrier in all their writing both inside and outside the gameâŚ
Even the pve sceene hit unprecedented imbalance thanks to the damn barrier back in DF with what, a 1 to 10 ratio favoring horde in end-gameâŚ
But so long as they insist on keeping that barrier around, so long will i advocate for playable high elves. No cosmetic choice for blood elves or void elves, but the high elves they have paraded around in game all these years.
Isnât it the same you do on your side ⌠e.g. High Elves are original, never used fel, they donât have green eyes, they wear blue, the were always part of Alliance ⌠yet ignoring other facts.
Like you - they are not the same race cause they didnât embrace the name Sinâdorei
We said many times there are options how to add more customization options to have more presence of Quelâdorei in the game. Like my post where I am saying, therâs ALWAYS a way how to deal with this (and even proposing the possible solution. Yeah, I am not a dev, nor Blizz employee so I cannot guarantue what will be. Just saying my personal statement with my ideas, how this can be handled in future).
Not a single issue with that. But if I am asked to provide source or explain my statement, I will stand by it and will try to do so. Whilst, when we ask the same from âyourâ point of view - the usual answer is âBecAUseE WEEE wwaNNt it!!!â ⌠or like here âCause Blizz change their mind in the pastâ.
I really would like to know the perspective you can confirm with any in-game or out-of-game source:
- Why should they be Alliance NEW race separate from Sinâdorei?
- How are Quelâdorei and Sinâdorei different to earn them the place as Allied Race?
- and so on ⌠cause in last 500+ there were questions, where we usually get the answers that we are just haters
Quelâdorei and Sinâdorei are physiologically the exact same race, who after events from past shifted apart due to different point of view of current situation.
Is this something what earn them a place for new race especially if we know that Sinâdorei are just renamed Quelâdorei?
âThe High Elves who refused Kaelâthasâ path are still our kin. I do not forget that, even if they do.â
After the Nightborneâs liberation, Thalyssra compares her peopleâs isolation to the Blood Elvesâ history. Lorâthemar mentions the High Elves :
âWe once called ourselves High Elves, before tragedy changed us. The name matters less than the heart of a people.â
During this questline, Blood Elves reflect deeply on their past and the Sunwellâs restoration:
âOnce, we were all High Elves. Whatever names we take, the Sunwell shines for us all.â
Itâs actually just barely favoring the Alliance nowadays. The roughest the faction imbalance got to was back in SLands, with 35-65% for the Horde, presumably because of all of the Horde fixation we had since Cataclysm onwards, but thatâs an entirely different story altogether.
But ever since the faction restrictions were lifted, itâs now hovering at 51-49% for Alliance after the launch of DFlight. But yeah, I agree with you 100%.