But it seems you still want to have the F1 title and Championship?
one problem why there is so many toxic players as people say comes down to one thing relay gear nothing else.
Many who farm high end Mythic keys does it for gear not to for timer, but they insist on joining high keys, what makes those who go for time again angry, what is understandable.
you se the hole game is designed arround getting stronger gear pretty much, what meens even in low level dungeons people want to ge the levels fast so they can grind gear, what again does the same thing they get angry if someone is not good enough for their standards.
combine this whit human nature to almost always striving for the best stuff or atleast the majority is like that, regardless if they admit it or not, you end up whit a game that everyone wants to become the best of the best and be able to do high end content, regardless if they have the gear or skill for it.
this is shown in DF much more now due to how gearing works, becuse no borrowed power and to be able to get the best there is you have to do higher mythic keys pretty much or mythic raids, or you can not in anyways or form even uppgrade your gear to max (unless changed I am on a semi brake until next raid).
Cute. Very cute.
No - nobody is suggesting that people are going to spend two hours carrying someone doing 30k DPS, but you are making the basic assumption that the only reason people might want to take longer in a dungeon is that they are bad at playing the dungeon.
This is plainly not the case. Whatâs really going on is that everyone, even friends, and even rank 1 groups, get a go-go-go mentality forced upon them. M+ does not allow for: Getting a drink, toilet breaks, wife aggro, chatting, recomposing yourselves, discussing strategies, getting a disconnect, and many other such simple things.
Requiring that people slow down and take breaks with things such as drinking and keeping the timer in the game would frustrate literally every person alive who tries it.
The problem is the content cycling. New patches are coming when people still push alts. When there wouldnt be new gear progression all 3-6 months, then this would stagnate and people would play more relaxed on the highest gear already.
E.g. the timewalking dungeons are rushed because most want to complete their 5/5 asap to get their piece of gear.
Also, the game is dope easy and therefore rushing is not killing the tank in any way when he solo pulls every room.
Most content is made for big aoe pulls due to tanks that dont die. When u can survive it and cc the important spells, then u kill it.
Game would be way harder when melees would hit much harder, because everything would be about the small pulls of the tank, because he cant take anymore.
This would certainly lead to more kiting and a meta around that, so every melee needs a slow.
wwell if you play good neough you can literaly go for liek lteraly 15 minutes toilet break mid dungeon and still time .
the key words is you have to play good enough .
you can get literaly full 445+ gear in like 2-3 wweeks if you play enough with how game now works.
you dont need to be 445+ on all 3765489375349789 alts you have.
and if you feel like you need to - well thats you problem not problem with game.
Thatâs my case.
I play 25 characters.
If I feel that my Tank character, can pull the entire room, I will do it.
Ofc if things donât go well, I will apologize and next time, Iâm on that dungeon, I will pull less.
Also, you donât need high level gear for TW. All gear is downgraded to a certain ILV.
Iâve been ditching the ILV 400+ pieces, my characters have, in favour of Heirlooms (repair bills 
on high level gear make me 
), Azerite gear, Azerite neck, legendary cape, ILV 376 gear with stats like speed, leech or avoidance.
Cheers.
This is like the third time Iâve seen you use the same nonsensical example for like three different things. I guess your over exaggerating on purpose but comeon get some new material
1 Like
if you have an experience tank that is geard yes, take a new player or a reroller and do that, and it is totaly different
There is no response possible if this is the level of logic weâre working at.
1 Like
The old way of the game would have been that they took into consideration that esport style content is not for everyone. So the crests you only get in M+ would have been available to casuals through world content at a very slow pace, maybe even soft capped to be limited to a few a week. Gaining these would have been slow enough that by the end of the season they would have been able to enjoy the âmythicâ gear.
1 Like
I find this whole discussion nausiating. So many people use such specific and uncommon examples to justify the most spurious points. And then just attack eachother in an endless back and forth of meaningless blather
Games have difficulty curves and failure states. So people will do what they can to accommodate the difficult and prevent failure. Itâs a simple as that
No one is advocateing for no difficulty that would be boaring. And no one is advocateing for everyone being a world first raider.
Itâs literally one person saying hey guys it would be nice if this content was t so rush rush so I could take my time with it
Not everything is so apsolutionist there is middle ground.
Does every effort/difficulty = reward argument gets rubber stamped âtoxec elitist, e-sportâ these days?
Second, as others above already mentioned. M+ consists of many levels. Not everyone must have all 20s done. Not everyone will have CE. Not everyone will be a gladiator and etc.
Everyone plays what the game allows. If you want slower runs, you have to significantly buff the encounters. However, that wasnât successful strategy for most of WoWâs lifespan.
If you go to instance via auto finder, you undertake risk of meeting people not matching your expectations.
If you want similar people, you have to build your own group.
You canât change peopleâs goals or thinking.
immediately false, proven by the following comment. also, just because one entity doesnt need to play that way, doesnt mean that most players do.
If you want slow gameplay with chats etc. - go hc wow. A lot of people group up, chat and plan in party chat, do quests together. Itâs actually quite chill and relaxing environment to be in. Well if you die - you just transfer to Era, which is very alive.
Retail will never lose gogogo.
many people want that mentality, they play wow like league of legends so iâm not sure if itâs an issue to everyone . itâs rapidly losing itâs mmo aspects with the increasing focus on seasonal content but i believe itâs possible to support both sides in an mmo. not sure if blizz wants that.
2 Likes
Realistically the only way to get rid of the âgo go goâ mentality would be to make the game brutally hard. But the general consensus seems to be that WoW is already too hard as it is. So i am not sure that would go over well.
Please donât make it harder as it already is, when you are dealing with a team, in which people have low dps and donât know what they are doing. Iâve just been in a series of long runs in TW on my 2nd BE Holy Paladin. Because the Vengeance DH Tank wasnât prioritizing the targets and was dropping HP fast (Tank wasnât level 70, was like level 68, there was more people low level as well) I had to stop attacking and just stay and supervise the HP of the whole party and it took ages to complete them.
- In Gekkan we wiped, because the Tank was so far ahead, I didnât noticed he had already jumped in to the boss, I could had still make it, but the debuffs on my character stopped her, from doing her work.
On our second attempt, I was prepared, however the whole party is focusing on the boss and let one of the casters spam debuffs on my BE Paladin that slow her casts and decrease her HP overtime, it also stacked so I had to constantly spam cleanse on myself. Finally, I had to take matters in to my own hands and CC that mob, with Hammer of Justice and Blinding Light. - In Xin the Weaponmaster, I donât know why, the vengeance DH Tank, decides to stay on the throne zone and I couldnât heal him properly because he was out of sight. I had to climb the stairs and cast, Combat resurrection on him after he died.
I mean, Iâm guilty of going ahead of the party, when Iâm tanking, however I donât rely on the healer to spam CDs on my Tank in order to keep him alive. I rely on my own CDs and I try to not put my healer under stress.
Cheers.
Luckily there are 2 more game modes that provide the top end rewards and donât have a timer.
PS I just knew it was about the rewards. Every single time its about the rewards.