the quicker people understand the mentality the better.
Since for whatever reason we can never win any games, maybe 1 out of 10-20 and we gotta maximise our honor per our just do as follows.:
1 teamfight with horde. Let em pass /cap everything afterwards and let them win while you kill all LT’S and maybe capping 1 or 2 towers and try holding them.
There’s no point on really playing and trying as the map is what it is so we might aswell let em win win everygame easily without even resisting and just going for LT’s and few towers. In a perfect scenario a game such as the one described above should not last more than 20 minutes.
Favours our Honor per hour anw.
Few issues with the “let them pass” and alliance waiting at Hill of Shame. Horde wait sometimes 2 hour queues. They do not want fast games, they want max honor.
You kill a lts from horde, they lose honor. You cap a tower, they lose honor. They will chase you in small groups to maximise honor. There is an honor bonus at 30 minutes as well.
So suggestion, instead of trying to run past each other, try to work together and pvp, kill as many horde as possible. Stack at SHGY, farm horde until they get bored and run up and cap SPGY. When SPGY capped you run south and kill lts and they will let you as they can see you actually have lots of HKs and bonus honor.
Trying to run past them while they kill of the people on 60% mounts, capping SHGY and forcing choke point, waiting 3-4 people on the hill near cave to kill of alliance as they come slowly is how most games work and why we get little honor per hour.
I would blame the Allie faction more than an broken map(even if its abit broken yes) People on Allie faction are just to lazy to really put in the effort to fight for something in AV. Its either rush, or just afk.
If you admit that the map is broken, why not fix it?
If it’s the map that is broken, don’t you think the alliance morale is most affected by that fact and not because of something intrinsically wrong with themselves?
The only reliable way to win in AV as alliance is full turtle. You need to defend with full team first 1 hour, get SF gy for sure, horde’s “wtf did i wait 1h in the queue for this crap” will start kicking in and then you slowly push.
“Just run south pass through them” doesn’t work 99% of the time because 99% of horde players will never let you pass. They will just zugzug forever because they know most alliance players will give up after dying once.
I did a full turtle game just half an hour ago as i said, finished the game with 3.6k reputation, 11k honor, 800+ hks and we camped the horde in their GY. (only had a 5 man group, rest is full randoms).
ps: sidenote, the map is totally skewed, not because it’s not doable, but because horde choke points are at the very beginning of AV, where as alliance choke points are at the very end(db bridge). For random players with no patience, it gives one faction an incredible psychological advantage from the start.
In other words, mindset problems. And no, the map isn’t “skewed” in favor of either side. It’s just asymmetrically balanced, i.e. you’ve got an advantage in one way in one place, while the other side has a different advantage in another place, and so on and so forth.
It’s the ignorant people with a complete lack of insight who just follows the ever-popular confirmation bias to feed their own narrative. Because it just simply can’t be their own faults as a team, right? Right?
No, it’s a mindset issue where the Alliance see the grass as greener on the other side and thus it affects the way Alliance plays. Been like that from the very start of the WPvP phase.
Congratulations, you found a way to win. There are other ways too. And you know what decides the BG? The PVP decides the BG. Your collective force of 40 people outmatched the opponents. The thing about having so many random cogs in the wheel, is that those cogs are very quick to give up once something doesn’t go the way they want it to go. Which has been the core issue permeating the Alliance side in EU and NA (but nobody seems willing to translate and report back what the Asian realms thinks of AV for some reason).
Now go explore other ways, improve, and then you’ll see a turnaround. Just because you try, it doesn’t mean you’ll win. But have all 40 players try for 1000 AV games and then you’ll see a much better statistic than the completely made-up “99%”.
And the best way Blizzard can solve these mindset issues, and the “premade vs. pug” problems, as well as AFK and bot problem in PvP, is to simply remove the automatic matchmaking for teammates in BGs. It makes people more sturdy in the face of losing when they have no “solo option” and no pugs to play against, and deals with the Alliance mindset in AV as well.
Because at the end of the day, all BGs, including AV, is decided with PvP.
No, it’s not mindset problems. I know it’s hard for you to understand, but I will try to explain shortly anyway.
The hard part of alliance AV is the start, where the hard part of horde AV is at the end. In any given situation, this creates an advantage for horde players, unless it is a premade group that knows about the macro game and has good focus.
Here is an example: You get 1000 random guys on the street and get them to play tetris. 500 of them starts from level 1, where it is easy at start and hard later on. The other 500 of them starts from level 40, where it is already hard at start. I can guarantee you that the latter group will get bored/give up much easier than the former. The same thing goes for AV. Alliance has it hard at start and if it’s not a coordinated group that knows what they are doing, they will not succeed as much as the horde players which have it very easy at start.
When you say it’s a “mindset” problem, you put the blame on the alliance players, which is easy to clap for the toxic classic nerds but is hardly the truth. If horde players had the same challenge, they would have the same win rate, it has nothing to do with individual players. This is how human psychology works. If you get into a street fight and take 2 punches on your nose the first 2 seconds, you are more likely to run away. Only someone who is well-trained will stand still and say “I got more stamina than this guy so I will keep losing at the beginning but I will outlast him”.
All the numbers back me up. I have 5k+ registered games of AV on my 2 accounts. I have 61% wr in AB, 57% wr in WSG(vs randoms). I have 1.8% wr in AV. Now you tell me this is a mindset issue, because you are a hypocrite.
I played horde from 2004 open beta to 2019 august until classic release. I have seen both grasses and I don’t get your blabbering.
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Thank you professor, it was a dull and useless article that you wrote up there. Now, can you stop stalking me?
I have 2 seasons rank 1 gladiator on retail, 2 seasons HotH, arena master, but I can’t deal with random AVs in classic, I see, I have to improve.
I know English can be confusing sometimes, but the context clearly insinuates that the ‘you’ in that quote means you in the general sense. i.e. the alliance.
But thanks for the useless info. Not hard to get all that in a dead battlegroup back in the day.
You sure are funny. You’re gonna go back to that distance to the first clash argument again? For real? You do know that’s an advantage for the Alliance, right? Alliance resurrects much closer to the first clash, so in a clash where both sides are going at the same speed in clearing the opponents, then Alliance will receive their backup first and can create a wave of continuous PvP encounters pushing the Horde back. But that isn’t what they ever do. They prefer to run around like a herd of gazelles, sacrificing whoever gets caught by the “zugzug”.
In cases where the Alliance gets wiped first, then it already shows which side is stronger in their collective PvP ability so to speak. Which is why that first clash matters so much, and why Alliance has an advantage for that fight.
It’s actually pretty funny, you guys keep claiming that the distance to the first clash is a big reason of what’s causing the losses, yet arguing that a GY further away is a negative thing when SH GY is lost and you ress at SP GY/Cave. You do know the Horde side got a GY further away from the first clash than the Alliance does, right?
Erh no, that’s called confirmation bias.
You don’t see because you don’t want to see. Which is related to you suffering from that martyr complex and confirmation bias.
Well said! The other guy is just trying to get a reaction out of people, is my guess. He lives for it… It’s not personal and it has nothing to do with the game itself.
I could go on and list all the obvious flaws that makes the BG heavily favour Horde. Some of the more unfair ones will get fixed in TBC. But I don’t have to.
I don’t have to because I have played about 60 games and won 3. That’s starting to be a sample you know. 1/20.
Are you telling me Alliance win 5% of the AVs because of mindset problems when the winrate in AB and WSG are 50% or close to it? Is the problem of the level 40 not being able to beat the level 60 really that he doesn’t try hard enough? N O N S E N S E.
Think about that statement and think about how reasonable it is.
Also, there is no way a 50/50 ends up as a 95/5 after 60 trials.
It coud also be that alliance can just requeue while horde has to wait putting more effort into winning.
AB and WSG wait times arent as bad as AV.
Also worth mentioning. Alliance pugs often have better setups than what horde has. Ever seen a horde healer? They sure are rare. There is also a lack of shamans in pugs making offensive purging and dispelling poisons very annoying and majorly favours alliance and because of silly warrior meta, games tend to be filled with warriors who are pretty useless anyway agaisnt the many paladins and mages.
Overall alliance has a much easier time everywhere. Including PVE with their paladins reducing aggro and kings. Pvp healing as a paladin is incredibly easymode as well.
By using that logic I could argue that indeed the horde brain activity is less tuned to winning the game for withering in the queue for so long - contrast to the alliance who are constantly playing and therefore all fired up.
And what would be better than to have fast queues and win games? People don’t lose on purpose because they have short queue times. N O N S E N S E.
If you insist on having an imbalanced map in the game, then you can expect to have those long queue times for that map!
Dont be silly . You still got plenty of advantages outside of AV anyway. Alliance just likes to complain. Been like that since forever. 1st it was the racials then it was the map. xD. Even tho you are playing the easy mode faction.
Doesn’t sound like easy mode to me when we are losing 95 or 98 games out of 100.
I don’t care about any other advantages or disadvantages at this present moment. The most glaring issue has to be fixed first, which is Alterac Valley. Thanks for your time.
Paladins is the most easy mode class ever and they are so popular cause of this. You see them everywhere. You have a massive advantage in WSG and decent advantage in AB.
Yes you lose AV … No1 can do anything about it but yourselves.
Im not going to change your opinion cause you are stuck in your ways. But alliance = easy mode.
In TBC it might be the other way around where Horde gets more easy mode.
