That is debatable, but a lot of the Alliances “deus ex’s” are just due to them being stupid when by all accounts they should not. There wouldn’t be a need for them if they were just acting normal and in character.
Ofc’ this is down to writing after all and I feel like anyone could write a better story at this point but w/e. I’d rather the story to be told in a way to actually make Sylvanas look smart and a “tactical genius” rather than constantly being told it and making the Alliance look stupid to make her look better than what she actually is.
Lore wise it makes no fsdfsfsking sense because the horde were DEVASTATED in all ways and specially due to this never ending horde civil war.
So for horde to actually gain a legitimate victory means that lore?
Is out the fdsfdsffking window.
I mean god damn a few years ago they killed eachother en masse in orgrimmar.
Not enough time to refill their ranks in any circumstances. So basically it would be the end of blizzard being any good at storytelling.
To be fair, about every race in WoW has been devastated at one point or another, Alliance and Horde alike, and it never stopped Blizz from using them in unreasonable numbers. Just look at the Void Elves popping up everywhere in the game in key roles. They are the guys who followed one researcher into exile, to study the void. A little part of a people…that lost 90% of its population when the Scourge came. Does that make sense? None whatsoever.
So arguing about populations is really not gonna make anyone happy.
I think Blizzard does not allow a faction to win. The situation is too emotional at this point, the alliance feels cheated since MOP for a real won war, the Horde does not see that they have to lose for a war because the players themselves did not really want. (Which I understand)
So the bottom line is that both factions will lose, in one way or another.
Void elves are just a testing phase to see how much players would jumps ships faction crossing from belves to the alliance version. I highly doubt they will implement high elves if too many players switch.
I give you War1 but WarIII was an entirely different stage what with the Scourge and then the Orc Prison Riot and then the High Elves deciding that going solo was going to be the best solution…
So its really not comparable with a red vs blue setting like WarI, II and World of Warcraft onward…!
I still don’t know how the Void Elves are part of the Alliance…a faction that was considered too dangerous for the Blood Elves, a race that has no problems in handling all sorts of arcane magic, and the Alliance openly accept them…next they’ll accept mecha-goblins and holy Forsaken…
No it is what people get instead of High Elves, because the High Elf Nation joined the Horde years ago.
What Void elves serve as is a means to delect a twist to the Story.
Granting the Sin’dorei model to the Alliance and some none-official questionable elements to the Alliance.
They also serve as portal hackers that can by pass Wards.
Making them kind of dangerous.
Now going back to the topic at hand.
Players are going to be annoyed or furious regardless which Side wins.
Thus the best thing to do for the Story is to have none of them win or lose.
Keeping the rivalry between them.
As this war is going leave scars that will not heal easily.
Both sides will continue to exist keep up -fighting-
Just not on the big War Scale.
The Two faction system moves on and Blizzard does not try another War expansion for at least another 4 expansions.
That’s the Ideal and most fair solution.
But this is Blizzard!
So, expect a re-polished MoP Story with more Alliance involvement.
More the Horde turning upon itself.
And Abundance of “Shock-twists”
that No one is shocked about but just disappointed.
Seeing how many Gilneans were still able to fight since after that, that’s not genocide. Just conquest.
As for Lordaeronians, no, Arthas comitted genocide. Sylvanas killed the remnant of an army lead by a racist idiot. Nothing to be forgiven for.
Sorry she couldn’t do a 10 minutes explanation as to why she has to leave in a battlefield. Seriously, you hear a retreat horn, you leave. You can ask for explanation later, which neither side ever did, by the way, until BtS.
What were they defending? Those Azeroth’s defenders? Because if my memory serves well, they were so incompetent they almost let the Legion get the Aegis because Odyn decided he was worthy.
And yes, he could’ve killed him whenever he entered the halls. Know how I know that? He has no quary killing the High Priest when Xal’atath tells him to ask a specific questions.
That guy is not helping anyone and nobody should care about what he thinks. If he’s unhappy we can turn him to pieces like all the Titan Keepers before him.
Read “A Good War”. It’s free. It’s said in it that, while not being the main reason, Greymane’s rogue attack played a role in convincing Saurfang that maybe Sylvanas was right.
It’s the first time I see a demon impersonating someone still alive. Usually they just kill them. I haven’t done the Rogue Campaign so IDK if there’s a reason or not to that, however.
Also, the Horde got overpowered by Legion forces in the Broken Shore, but apparently it’s still their fault if Varian died.
I actually find this unironically, very realistic.
We have the most understanding, open and progressive leader you could think of. Under Anduin’s lead, pretty much everyone is being welcome with open arms.
I highly doubt that the playerbase will get uneven, even if we were to get High Elves (hopefully never). People want to play Horde, they just don’t want to play an ugly monster.
Most High Elf fanboys don’t play blood elves because they are in the Horde.
Most blood elves play blood elves because they are the only pretty Horde race.
Uh, yes it is. We do not know how many Gilneans were left alive after the invasion, so you are just making things up. The invasion targeted an ethnic group, the Gilneans, or destruction and succeeded in killing large portions of the population while leaving the nation uninhabitable, forcing them all to evacuate. That is genocide.
Not what I was refering to. I was refering to the blighting of Hillsbrad, which again, targeted an ethnic group and destroyed it.
Ah yes, of course, it is not like she could spend ten minuted actually doing her job as Warchief to defuse a tense political situation.
It is the responsibility of the Horde and the Horde leader to explain what happened, because they created the situation.
You answered your own question.
It does not serve you well. Skovald was explicitly forbidden from taking the Aegis, Odyn simply used him as a final test for the player.
Headcanon. You are assuming Odyn’s mindset and that Skovald’s magic ould not have granted him some specific protection.
His forces aided us in Ulduar and Broken Shore, and you not caring what he thinks has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
So he has no right to be angry at Sylvanas trying to enslave his people?
How about you read it instead. Sylvanas never used that as an argument and Saurfang is wrong to demand the Alliance punish Greymane. Why? The conversation he is having proves he is wrong. He is talking to the greates, unrepentant war criminal on Azeroth, while demanding the Alliance punish their own radical elements. He is a hypocrite who does not believe what he preaches and his arguments should thus be dismissed. On top of that, this hypocricy played a minorrole in convincing him. What ultimately turned him was the idea that conquering Teldrassil would tear the Alliance apart.
i dunno serelune i would argue the saurfang is war criminals on a level that sylvanas can only dream of but the horde fanbase generally have collective amnesia when it comes to the horde’s old members war crimes they been pushing the blame on their leaders ever since the first warchief it seems
No it wasn’t. If it was genocide, Sylvanas wouldn’t have bothered to make a deal with Crowley in Silverpine. If it was genocide, Sylvanas wouldn’t have let the Gilnean leave the territory. It was conquest, it was War.
Alright.
Did the High King do anything? No? Well then, get down of your High Horse.
Ah, sure, because that’s so easy isn’t it? If none of the party tries to open dialogue, both are responsible. No matter what you think.
A title. A quote. I haven’t seen any of that done.
Did Odyn do anything to prevent that from happening? No. How can you be so sure Odyn wouldn’t have reacted? That’s Headcanon as much as I do.
And you’re assuming Odyn would’ve prevented Skovald from leaving with the Aegis. If my assumptions are invalid, yours are too.
I do not recall the Valajar in Ulduar at all. Unless you mean those he abandoned, in which case he has no claim for their actions.
Headcanon. Where does it state anywhere that he even cares about that? Eyir cares, him? He literally killed Helya to make her what she is when she refused. Seems to me he doesn’t care about anyone but himself as long as you prove your valor.
That’s your opinion. It was a reason enough to convince him.
So is Genn Greymane. On a quest called “Consoling the King”, he says that about Anduin.
" Genn Greymane says: I understand the need to mourn, but the king’s place is on his throne. The Broken Shore must be our focus. Convince Anduin to end his vigil!"
From the guy who forget about the Legion invasion for a personal Vendetta, this is priceless. So, according to you, since he is a hypocrite, all of his arguments should be dismissed. Therefore he had no valuable reason to attack Sylvanas at the Broken Isles, giving Saurfang a reason to accept waging war against the Alliance
Falacious argument, aside, what I wanted to show is that if you start dismissing people because YOU think they’re hypocrites, and I agree on Saurfang, mind you, you’re not trying to discuss. Your arguments become more biased, and lose any weight. Like mine about the High Elves a few days ago for instance.
All in all, try to remain as neutral as possible. But I am no one to make you behave a certain way. Nonetheless, thank you for sharing your opinion on the topic.