Before anyone gets the wrong idea. No, I am not defending the devs against anything.
But just curious. Does in-game skill = developer skill?
The best Nascar pilot/driver doesn’t automatically qualify as the best car mechanic or new car designer
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If they played daily, even casually, they would encounter the problems that we do and feel taxed for certain decisions they took.
Or perhaps they enjoy it that way, who knows.
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If a nascar driver has never or barely interacted with the cars then they’ll be horrible at their job.
Similarly, if a game developer has barely interacted with the game they’re supposed to be designing then they’re going to deliver a bad product.
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For years, from TBC to Wod, we could just spend time in the aspect of the game we enjoyed and it was fine. There were complaints, for sure, but I would say this : Forcing players into a piece of content is garbage design. I’m in favor of incentives for doing pvp and Pve, but I’m against pressuring players and micromanage them.
Essences are in essence a proof that way of thinking is completely out of touch with the game. For instance, the best pvp essences were obtainable in PvE content whereas the bis M+ essences for melee was only a BG grind. What the actual heck??
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But they do play casual PvP.
It’s just that when they enter the random battleground, they already have their ilvl 130 M+ gear. So they don’t see what the big deal is.
At this point in time I would acutally give them the benefit of the doubt, I do think PvP is shaping up to be better than it has been in quite some time in Shadowlands and they are still tuning stuff.
As far as other content goes we’re all forced to do content we would rather not in order to do the things we want to do. M+ players will really benefit from raiding, Raiders will benefit from M+ because lets face it both M+/Raiding got items that are bis.
We all require to do the weekly quests to raise our Covenant level, we need to do Torghast to raise the level of our Legendaries. We need to do some farming in The Maw to get materials to get sockets. The game has loads of stuff you would rather skip if you could so why should PvP be special and be able to get everything they want from just one thing.
As far as PvP gear goes its been ups and downs over the years and it could clearly be better but with the PvP gear getting Versa on everything and PvP trinkets that gives a big bonus to Versa I think they are moving in the right direction.
Most of the people complaining about the PvE trinkets atm havent even properly compared them to PvP trinkets in PvP and tried them out they are just making assumtions. Depending on how much Versa you will have I think its safe to say its at least 20% since all PvP gear comes with Versa.
So not only do you look at the Use/Proc of the 2nd trinket you look at an overall passive boost of at least 8% dmg/healing. which will increase the higher your Versa goes. And I’m confident in saying that no PvE trinket will compensate the loss of almost 10% passive damage/healing across the board.
Going with PvE trinkets will kinda be you going all in and putting everything on one play, while PvP trinkets will let you have higher output and more consistent damage.
Disclaimer: I aint Defending blizzard, nor do i bbeleive the way their pushing the game is in the best interest of the game or playerbase… i feel like their “Vision of the game” has Simply bbutchered several working systems in the game to push a Agenda that only works on paper.
you think this only applies to PvP…
Challange blizzard to do M+ With no raiding.
Challange blizzard to Raid without M+
Challange blizzard to do Mythic raiding with No borrowed power farming.
Challange blizzard to do Visions without doing M+ or raiding.
these Enforcements apply to the entire playerbase… they force everyone to do all content.
your forced to do visions
your forced to do islands
your forced to do warfronts
your forced to raid
your forced to M+.
your forced to do PvP (Essences)
your forced to do Rep Grinds.
about the only thing they dont force us to do is proffesions these days
you cant solely play any part of the game exclusively. as their Vision, basically removed all ability to play the game in your own way anymore.
WoWs just designed to be one massive theme park and you must go through every stop.
i guess its to be expected in a PvE Focused Theme Park MMORPG though… they removed any Close-To Sandbox mmorpg Designs this game has had.
at the end of the day, your asking them to play the game Against what they’re actively pushing the game to be.
they’re designing the game in a fashion where effectively
your PvE Playerbase Is ur PvP Playerbase
Your M+ Playerbase are your PvP and Raid Playerbase
your PvP Playerbase is ur M+ and Raid Playerbase.
they want One Community that are a WoW player and Not a “Part of WoWs content” Playerbase. in practicality it’ll annoy alot of players. but sadly thats what they’re doing.
problem is, they’ve changed the direction of the game itself mid way. which ofcourse means u have people who played this game on a Old Philosphy which this new direction has betrayed.
but sadly, i dont think they’re gonna Push down on their breaks and change direction at this point
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I really hope that’s not the case, it defeats the purpose of playing in the first place.
Started interesting. Ended up as a PvP whinge thread.
Side game folks, Side game…
Yet tens of thousands of raiders and pve players never touched a bg or arena in legion and bfa and were at optimal gear for their raids and mythic+. Pvp’ers can’t step into pvp without spamming dozens of mythic+ and raids. Hmm do you see the problem with your statement?
Remember when blizz said they got rid of pvp sets because they didn’t want players to have their bags cluttered up with 2 sets a pvp and pve set. So they replaced this with having 5 peices of every peice of gear in bfa, so instead of wearing 1 set at a time and only having 1 other set in my bag I have 4 large bags full of nothing but different peices of gear in bfa, blizz logic. Do you see their hypocrisy with statements like “they don’t want you to play only a single aspect of the game.” And then only pvpers are forced to do the content they don’t want to do…
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They did play M+ and raids, though. That’s two aspects of the game. PvE and PvP aren’t the only two. I haven’t played in Legion, but in BfA, if you wanted to be optimal for raids, you played M+ too. If you wanted to push high M+, you had to raid as well. For quite a few specs in BfA, Conflict & Strife was also an important essence to have, so many of us did PvP aswell.
Judging by Ions character, id say just collect all the rank 3 essenses.
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Barely interacted, fair point (kinda)
But people here are saying that for a developer to qualify they have to get X rank.
This isnt akin to suggesting a NASCAR designer steps into a car and drives it fairly often. It’s suggesting they only do that, but they drive professionally and win ralleys as well.
I’d argue having some direct experience of the thing you’re designing for is ideal, but the idea they need to reach X rank is stupid. These things don’t take zero time. What do people expect these people to do? Take it out of their work budget time actually developing? Or do it at home? So basically their time off is “kinda work” on a hobby with a contrived purpose? Naaaah.
That’s what player feedback is for. Why do it yourself and interpret what you think is the problem when you can ask those who directly articulate the problem. The thing is the feedback loop needs to be good. Not saying it is.
But that’s the solution. Not having Devs be forced to achieve X in their own game lol. You set that up as a model for development and you’re basically endorsing them never listening to the playerbase as they make Dev decisions based upon their experience of the content only. I mean that is a terrible idea.
This is all assuming you gain some insight via this direct experience anyway, which can be argued. An architect doesn’t need to pick up a single brick to be considered exceptional at their job, nor do they need to live in the houses they build. The idea design always benefits from direct experience is false. So long as the designer has a way of gathering feedback on their design that works, that’s all that’s required. The notion they need to directly experience it as well is not necessarily true. It also assumes they have a lot of spare time on their hands.
I mean, I assume these people suggesting that Devs climb to X rating don’t feel that half an hour of arena a day would satisfy? So how exactly are the Devs going to find the time to do the few hours a day to “properly experience” PvP? As said earlier, cut it from their actual Dev time (almost cutting it in half) or place additional demands on them in terms of working? I don’t see it. It’s a nice idea, but it’s a bit naive and not rooted in reality.
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Pretty sure this requirement even without the “PvP gear only” part would mean 99% of them won’t even get close.
Sorry but they are classed as pve, you attack none player enemies the whole time. Sorry but mythic+ and raids are both classed as pve, doing mythic+ is just like doing raids just with a smaller group, both you just kill mobs and bosses with different mechanics, the end. How can pve’ers being forced to pve elsewhere be the same as pvpers being forced to do pve.
But I remember you from the thread I made about SL not being alt friendly and you just kept making up any nonsense on there too that wasn’t true. Remember you kept insisting random conduits can be collected by doing any content anywhere and a pvper doesn’t have to do any pve to get them. When in reality each conduit comes from specific bosses in raids and dungeons (check dungeon guide where each conduit comes from) and not only that but you have to rerun that content to get the same conduit again but with a higher ilvl from the different difficulties. There are only 3 pvp conduits per class, and 1 is for tanking, 1 for healing and 1 for dps. So I can only get 1 conduit for my mw monk from the pvp vendor and it’s a bad one. I will have to do pve content to get the specific ones I need for pvp. Pve’ers yet again don’t have to touch 1 drop of pvp in SL to be optimal as usual…
Anymore nonsense you’d like to make up here too?
These are your words from that thread I made,
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Strange they’d say this, as Shadowlands is shaping up to be the most unfriendly expansion for playing multiple areas of content with your main…
Yes. And PvE and PvP aren’t the only two aspects of the game. M+ and raids are two aspects aswell. Both are PvE, yes, but as far as Blizzard is concerned, they’re different aspects. Just look at the weekly Vault, and see the three aspects of the game it provides loot options from: raids, M+, and PvP.
I get it, you don’t like PvE at all. Some PvE players similarly dislike raids (hi, I hate raids), some really, really hate M+. PvP and PvE aren’t the only two aspects - see above.
Wrong. Most conduits will be available from multiple sources, Blizzard repeatedly told us so. They can be WQ rewards too. They can come from PvP aswell - although it is currently unknown how, as PvP sources are incomplete. We simply do not know all sources yet.
Not really. Yes, you won’t be at your maximum theoretical power level in every area, and you’ll have to focus on one. Having a focus isn’t bad. It doesn’t mean you’ll be completely trash in every other area.
If i can’t be at my maximum power level in every area through actually being able to chose my powers, then there’s no point in being competitive about that area.
Since it isn’t me that’s limiting myself, it’s Blizzard not letting me chose what’s appropriate for each area.
Have them farm azerite for an year, 16 hours a day
With that logic the very best gear should then be able to acquired from any aspect of the game there is from questing to mythic raiding.
Hell by your logic and developers logic i should be rewarded by bis gear from doing pet battles too.
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