Cant say much about m+ since i mostly heal.
The raid design punished shadow more than the actual nerfs. Shadow scales extremely well and the nerfs will be outscaled in a few weeks, but the boss design is the main reason why shadow is sitting on the bench.
Whation and skitra have short burst windows, the rest of the fight you’re semi afk waiting for something to happen.
Vexiona, ilgynoth, hivemind and carapace have loads of adds that that die too quickly for the dots to tick twice.
Maut, doggo, xanesh and dragon dil#& are the only decent fights for shadow but even there are better classes for it.
On top of that most encounters requires to move twice across azeroth on a regular basis which again punishes shadow more than any other spec (except maybe arcane mages, but who plays arcane anyway).
Not true at all. There would be no problem with the raid design if we didnt get nerfed to smithereens. And stop waiting around for some magical scaling, it isnt coming.
Tbh I hope blizz is looking into actual logs (if they can find a shadow lulw). Its totally no fun to be benched forever. I think about playing holy/disc in m+ now cause the problem on m+ is long existing (every1 hates you, you will never be able to do dmg like other classes…). but on mythic raiding theres no spot for me, and i cannot play that good to play a healing priest (and we have 2). so forever benched. maybe i quit since I will stay benched for at least 2-3months in the hope of my guild is clearing someday and I will hopefully get a kill on nzoth sometimes…
Its mythic + forti week and trashes doesnt life long enough for 1 voidform when you play with dh and rogue. Its a joke. Do i need to play +20 to benefit from my chorus?
Honestly im not even sure that it matters at this point. Last patch I could clearly feel my dps went up alot doing higher keys like 18-19. Now im not even sure it matters that much if the mobs live longer.
Blizzard can’t make a proper balanced game because you’re not your class anymore. Azerite, Essence, Corruption. It’s like extra talents added each patch that mess with the balance from the previous patch.
Do you think shadow is fine for now? You are wrong! Do something, Blizzard!?
Ye no class balance this week either…they have to fix those dumb corrupt effect first so they can properly judge performance of classes instead of getting data from warcraftlogs filled with echoing void and infinite star lotery winners.
They won’t make any adjustment to classes, only nerf what sticks out.
Because Shadowlands is coming and the loss of Azerite, Essences, and Corruption after a few levels will mess with class balance anyway.
Shadow priests were already struggling before 8.3 in everything besides raiding, but they got massive nerfs due to the raid design in 8.2. Now we don’t even get to benefit from raid design because it’s all single target and cleave, so we got stomped double hard. Someone at Blizzard really hates shadow priests and just wants us removed from the game already.
What does it even matter? Its a hard reset with a new expansion. Im assuming there will be some big redesign with alot of specs anyways. Whats important right now is that we dont suck for all of 8.3.
That’s exactly what’s likely to happen
Oh F### off shadow was top dps in EP by a LARGE margin do NOT downplay it.
And mythic nyalotha shadow is right now above ench shaman, balance druid, MM hunter, Elemental shaman, assassination rogue, WW monk, Frost mage, survival hunter, demonology warlock and sub rogue.
Shadow is just not the number 1 spec unlike in Eternal palace.
Also yes shadow is not doing so well but did you really expect 0 changes from EP where it dominated like crazy?
I expected nerfs, I expected those nerfs to heavily hit spread multi dot in preparation for a raid with lots of spread multi dot.
What I didn’t expect was bliz to knock 12% off single target dps, when the delta between the top and bottom classes for single target was 9%.
What I also didn’t expect was Bliz to then make a raid completely designed around burst single target and 3-4 target stacked cleave. As well as repeated stacking immunities, as if they hadn’t learned a thing from Tomb of Sargeras.
Then again I also didn’t expect blizzard to release a system so obviously untested and poorly thought out that it almost single-handedly undermined any semblance of class balance anyway. Corruption is an absolute shambles but that’s another story for another day.
Monk and priest dps are languishing at the bottom of performance this tier. While shadow was given a raid that was damn near designed for it to perform in Eternal Palace, there’s still a pretty obvious underlying issue that sustained dps is inferior to burst with the way blizzard designs raid encounters overall, and that’s also true in Mythic Plus.
Statistics are also a little wonky right now, because Warcraftlogs reset everything today following the EV nerfs.
So you think it’s fine that burst classes have much higher sustained dps over long fights than a DOT class?
Could you show where you have that math from as when i did it in EP it was more then 15% when i excluded the top and the bottom specs and it was more then 20% when i had them in.
So that is why REt paladin has been bottom of the middle of the pack for 3 expansions now.
Being a burst spec yet has not been considered good on most fights in the expansion.
Also if this was true then BM hunters would not be doing so well As the whole gameplay is about getting as much uptime on the stat increasing things as possible. So in other words Not being spiky.
Shadow was top dps in EP Top dps in Crusible of Storms 3dps in BoD 10th in Uldir.
You have 1 raid tier where you are in the bottom of the middle of the pack and you complain like it is the end of days.
They have a pre and a post you can look at them yourself.
But yes it makes it a little wonky but so does corruption in the first place.
So you are fine when you are number 1 dps spec but when you are low middle of the pack the end has come it is useless.
You sound like one of those people that wants the entire world to burn because the store ran out of cookies.
Ellipsìs knows what he’s talking about. Unlike you.
It’s not a problem for a spec to underperform. The problem is that shadow is our ONLY dps spec. If sub was all rogues had you’d see a storm of QQ all over the forum.
And Ret And Windwalker but you people did not give a damn
when that was the case before but now that you are in the same position as you where top dps.
i have 0 sympathies for people who said oh you are low middle of the pack it is fine but the second their own spec is there the spec the class is useless.
This is why i react to this you are the same people that in earlier patches would complain that other specs in the same situation as you now are in should stop complaining.
Well clearly he does not using warcraftlogs data for 8.2 right now gives the difference from top to bottom as 23.8%
And that is shadow priest to frost mage.
I will gladly change my mind on this but i would need something more then just it being said because if he is going to say a number like that he should be able to back it up.
i know he is talking about single target but on the 1 fight where it is single target i am still seeing priest at number 3 and the top to bottom being around 21% so it sounds like a made up number or a theoretical one.
So i expect more then just waving numbers around.
Heck in nyalotha on xanesh heroic unless you do balls it is a single target fight Shadow priest is above both DK specs Ret paladin 2 out of 3 Warlock specs 1 shaman spec, 2 out of 3 rogue specs, WW monk, 1 hunter spec and 2 out of 3 mage specs.
Pre nerf
post nerf it is looking to be the same so far. (side note still around 20% from top to bottom here)
Sure this changes if i put it on max but that is not realistic what so ever.
We got our problems. They got theirs. WW sucking doesnt make Shadowpriest not suck. I dont really see your point here. I dont expect mages go out screaming on the forums about shadow being weak.
Go check simulationcraft bis gear patchwerk sim.
We are gonna scale badly. We have weak priority dmg. We got zero burst. You see there is more to it than looking on warcraftlogs.
Take orgozoa as an example. Toplogs for shadow I can guarantee you everyone is using the misery talent. The thing is, thats only viable once you got the fight on farm and its time to pad for good parse logs. In reality its really a singletarget fight. Singletarget is king on that fight as long as you got a few cleave specs in there.
If we would have been nerfed like this on orgozoa, no sane raidleader would have used a shadowpriest on that fight even though we might have looked decent on warcraftlogs because we can pad like no tommorow on the adds.
Im expecting more fights like that in Nyalotha where its a singletarget fight disguised as something else.