It's time for Vashj and KT to be nerfed - check the timeline from original TBC

I understand why Blizz chose to release Vashj and Kael’Thas in their pre-nerfed, arguably semi-bugged state. Almost nobody played these versions of the bosses back in the day, so they were cool to see.

But it’s now 4.5 months since the release of TBC classic. Patch 2.1, which nerfed these bosses in original TBC, released 4 months after the expansion dropped.

These bosses are gatekeepers for both Hyjal and Black Temple - if they don’t become more killable for more guilds soon, we’re going to be thrown radically off the timeline and most guilds will find it extremely hard to field teams for tier 6.

At this stage in TBC classic, more and more guilds were killing these end bosses every week to get attuned and gradually transitioning into tier 6. However, we’re going to get a hard drop of tier 6 in a few months’ time, without ever having the opportunity to kill the easier/fixed versions of the bosses to get ready.

I hope Blizzard will move quickly on this - the population numbers speak for themselves. The gatekeeping these bosses represent is a huge hurdle to motivation and player retention. These forums and Blizzard’s own internal stats surely show it.

By bringing in these nerfs now, in line with the original timeline, Blizzard can both improve the conditions in the game AND stay true to the original spirit of TBC. Surely a win-win?

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Patch 2.1 was Black Temple release so nerfing the bosses when we get BT seems reasonable.

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The raids will be nerfed in the next phase. Those who can deal with them now, will keep doing them, those who can’t will do then when they get nerfed. No point in nerfing them now since you’ll complain and demand the next phase to be nerfed when it releases since its too hard for you.

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Patch 2.1 was Black Temple release so nerfing the bosses when we get BT seems reasonable.

That’s the other way of looking at it for sure - but I disagree.

In practice, nerfing them alongside BT means many guilds (as in, every 8/10 guild or guilds not reliably killing the end bosses now) will need to continue working on Tier 5 for many weeks before they’ll have a viable, T6-attuned squad. This is how it worked in original BC.

But because of the delayed release schedule in TBC classic, that would mean much more time focused on T5 and much less time on T6, way different how it was in original.

There’s basically two ways of reading the original TBC release schedule - the ‘in theory’ schedule, that suggested that T5 was playable at launch and T6 roughly 4 months after, and the ‘in practice’ approach wherein T5 was only really clearable when BT dropped, and Tier 6 wasn’t meaningfully tackled by most guilds for months after.

Blizzard are forcing the ‘in practice’ schedule with their phase structure - and under the ‘in practice’ schedule, we should already have the KT/Vashj nerfs imo.

Tbh from what we know, the progression is same as ut was in naxx, which is fine in my opinion, i dont think that is the reason why people quit

Let me get this straight.
For the first time since Classic released two years ago we have content where two of the ten bosses are actually somewhat difficult. It’s been a couple of weeks since the release of this phase and you are already crying for nerfs because every single guild hasn’t completely cleared all the content. Is that correct?
No wonder this game went down the toilet.

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This forum needs a ‘remind me in x months’ tag so I can refer to this comment when we’re still in this state at the end of P2 (assuming no nerfs to the raids during P2).

If people can’t get 10/10 in 4 weeks time, they will not in 4 months time either.
Mind you they have the option of doing all week for 4/4 or 6/6, come back and do the other raid the week after. They still can’t do it this way.

Also, I’m 10/10 easy game. I might be the proverbial 1%.

Actually not correct, naxx was cleared by a little bit less ppl

So much for all the people who are saying it’s easy.

Nerf Voidreaver he is too hard and gatekeeps T5 shoulders!

The original progress was something like kill one new boss every week and spend two weeks on Vashj and Kael to get it right.
So it took fairly good guilds also a couple of months to clear the raids, back then.

People do grind through the earlier bosses faster than back in the day. I guess as a result you might have less gear when coming at Kael. This may play a small role.
Still Kael should be easy now, it’s 15 year old content. Guess people just don’t like challenges anymore.

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sounds like retail lfr is your solution

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It isn’t gatekeeping, its a skill check and you failed. You’re still not being kept from them, you just have to get better.

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I don’t think people are quitting the game because they can’t down Khael or Vashj. Get good n00bs.

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These raids was available since release in the original timeline… So your argument makes 0 sense. The raids have only been available for 4 weeks. NO NERFS until next phase!

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Oh, but they will, with 2 t5 bonuses and offset pieces from TK/SSC raid dps are grooving, as their knowledge of boss mechanics.
And also there is “remind me in x time” functionality on this forum, an icon with stopwatch right under each comment.
The game and forums are fine, it has to do something with your perception of it.

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I have not killed them yet but I feel that my guild is able to do so in following weeks. Nerfing the bosses would destroy the fun for me.

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Get of your high horse, you killed 10/10 1 time
only cuz you raided every single day during week 1 lockout, currently You are killing 8/10 just like others.

I could be 10/10 every week, but playing with some people in the raid (about 5) who don’t know the tactics will not get the repeat kills. Just waiting for people to get good.
Also nice jealous response there lol

I ain’t jealous, for example this week i dont think ill have time to raid at all and thats ok for me, You just seem to have a to big epen from your 10/10 achieved after 30+ hours of raiding in a single lockout in just 2 raids.

If every guild would invest similar amounts of time im sure the number of ghilda who are 10/10 would increase by at least 200%.