I've been extremely disproportionally hit by this frog nerf

Community WoW Remix: Mists of Pandaria
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I completely understand the contempt towards frog farmers; if I missed out, I would have it too, and in fact I did feel put out by those with 4 times the power of me. But look at it from our point of view, we all log in, we’re reliving our MoP experiences, and it’s really fun, and we’re really engaged in the grind. This power upgrade thing is fantastic, and we want to max it out as fast as possible, because that’s how many players, playing at the first second of launch play.

But I took time off work to do this thing. I did the frog farm - everyone in my guild did, we did it as guild - I got about an extra 10k STA on my cloak. I didn’t realise until I started turning in all the charms just how lucrative it was.

Then they nerfed it, and I kept farming.

I’m a hunter, I farmed open world for 16 hours a day, because I had to go back to work, and I know that being an early-brid has certain advantages. I did some heroics, but most of my time was just getting dopamine hits from threads dropping. I didn’t do goats, I killed many tens of thousands of mobs in the open world, all across the world. I’m a hunter, so I can do it while moving, and I grinded and I grinded for 16 hours a day.

I used every cooldown I had for speed, I did all the hunter tricks. Doing what we all hate hunters for: sicking pets and shooting from a distance and doing it with speed.

The hour before the nerf I have 10k agility cloak, this was reduced to 2500. This was devastating, because 90% of that was not from frogs. Yes, 10% was. The bronze rewards are great too, because every hour I have a full bag of greens and gems which I just shred into bronze.

I picked a hunter to farm, this seemed like a legit thing to do. But now my week off work was for nothing.

I think Blizzard need to rethink this, because I am not a NORMAL player, I am a nolifer who took a week of work to do this. And there are many like me, because I saw them in the open world too, farming their butts off. Fellow hunters, boomkins, and mages, farming like classic gold farms.

If Blizzard doesn’t want us to farm, why put threads on mobs in the world?

I’m completely exhausted and let down.

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I warned that this exact thing was going to happen; That they’d blanket nerf everybody far too hard, and instead of punishing the actual big exploiters, a ton of regular players would get swept up in these punishments.

The reason why it’s hitting so many regular players is because WoWhead pushed these farms by releasing guides on it, even after the frogs were nerfed they kept reporting on new farm spots, even up to the point this cloak nerf happened.

The fact that WoWhead was putting these things on the front page made them appear to be legitimate farms.

There’s other factors at play as well however; All you’re doing is killing mobs. The fact that the loot is overtuned should not be the players’ fault.

Besides that, Blizzard’s own silence for almost an entire week before they nerfed the frogs made this farm seem far more legitimate than it is, and because of that many players didn’t think anything of it and just participated.

Many players also simply tried out the farm because… well, everyone was doing it and with no word or warning from Blizzard on the matter for days on end it never seemed like a “wrong thing” to do.

Because of the sheer amount of the people affected by these nerfs, the punishment far exceeds the crime.

Most people who touched the frogs from what I’ve heard haven’t farmed them for hours and days on end. Most only gained at best 10k Stamina on their cloaks from it, which is roughly 1-2 hours of farming.

They after that went on to play the game regularly; completing achievements, clearing dungeons and raids and questing, which was the bulk of their threads.

The distribution on their cloak of how many threads actually came from farming Frogs for 1-2 hours does not exceed beyond a meager 10%.

To reset the progress of people who, besides the 1-2 hours they spent farming, spent DAYS doing raids, dungeons, quests and everything else is absolutely ludicrous and beyond any sense and reason.

Shame on you, Blizzard.

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Love how everyone of these frog farmers write up this long story as if its a terrible tragedy, unfair and the farm was insignificant because they barely gained anything from it. While its proof out there of people having massive power spikes from doing this exact frog farm.

You used an exploit to gain power faster than usual. You got hit. That’s that.

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All =/= Everyone.

You literally just disproved your own argument and proved my point within the very same sentence.

It was never obvious that it was an exploit.

Nuance is key.

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Farming open world mobs doesn’t require any kind of frog buff whatsoever, there’s a run speed bonus that’s slightly nice, I guess, but you’ve got to be kidding me if you think world farming has any kind of requirements. Quite often you’re just tagging mobs and other people are blasting because it’s so damn contested.

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There people claiming that the frog farm didn’t give them any power. Yet you have those claming they did the farm and got jacked with stats and bronze because of it.
Proved what? You haven’t said anything to me?

It was never obvious? So everyone doing it just happened to do so because, what? It was fun? “good old memories”?. Get real. You could see everyone saying how good this farm was because of how little you had to do to get the stats and threads. If it wasn’t obvious, you are oblivious as can be.

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You’re an obvious troll at this point, you’re not making any actual arguments, you’re just gesticulating a feeling of contempt. I understand why you feel this way, but you cannot tar everyone with the same brush.

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Then the people claiming that are wrong, clearly the frogs, if farmed for long enough (5, 10, 15+ hours) gave people incredible power that they should not have gotten because farming frogs was too easy a manner to attain such power.

The reward vastly outshone the effort required.

SOME people, the minority, who farmed frogs for 10+ hours were the only ones who had “massive power spikes”.

That’s a minority, however.

Most people did not farm frogs for more than 1-2 hours. Some even merely checked it out for about 5 minutes and still got their cloaks reset, despite them having gotten 99% of their power from regular content.

Punishing those people is unreasonable and unfair, especially since they decided to not farm frogs after only having checked it out for a bit.

All you’re doing by punishing these people this harshly now is proving that they should have exploited far harder and have gotten more bronze to upgrade their gear with, so if they didn’t do it this time they’ll definitely do so next time and we all know that there definitely will be a next time that Blizzard leaves in an oversight such as this.

So congratulations, you’re celebrating that they’ve made more future exploiters with these nerfs.

This is an MMORPG and metagaming is core player behavior. Besides that farming frogs was also done as a main activity in actual mists of pandaria and Blizzard didn’t do anything against it back then, either.

That means that players had both the incentive and the justification to go ahead with this, ON TOP of Blizzard’s absolute radio-silence for almost an entire week, and WoWhead pushing these farms as well --which is a fact everybody including you conveniently refuses to recognize–.

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I have no idea what you’re taking about. Frog buff? run speed buff? World farming requirement? The farm was essentially do nothing and reap massive rewards.

People who have no counter argument or have no idea what is being said often draw the “you’re just a troll” card. But fine, if you think i am one. No need to respond then.

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You’re the one without a counter-argument when all you do is parrot “power spikes!!” while simultaneously throwing all nuance out of the window.

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The duality of wow players. The frog farmers gained power doing the farm. But at the same time, they didn’t. The cloak doesn’t matter. And yet it does. Makes sense.

If you went to farm the frogs for any amount of time, knowing what it did, you only have yourself to blame.
I said in another post that people who claimed to not have farmed and still got hit with a nerf doesn’t surprise me when blizzard has banned people for varies things and then revert the ban after week by saying “We found nothing. Carry on”. People getting unjustly hit sucks major balls obviously.
But i’m also suprised Blizz didn’t outright ban people like they have with exploiters before. Cloak nerf and thats it. Still have their bronze gained and gear upgrades.

The farm when it was retail didn’t give power. At all. People wanted the charms. Just like they did now. Except this time, they turned those countless charms in for caches.
Wowhead pushing this is not new. They are a wow news site. Clicks and adviews gives them money. Of course they are going to post about this.

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You must have a grade school level of understanding if this is how you think.

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we didn’t miss it.

we have integrity and choose not to abuse game mechanics. Get rekt. Cheat

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The only frog farmers that had any power were the ones who farmed for 10+ hours.

Again you’re conveniently trying to ignore the time aspect of all of this because you know that it completely destroys any argument you may or may not have.

Many people thought that it was a normal thing since Blizzard said nothing about it, and WoWhead pushed it.

Also the game mode is literally intended to make people overpowered. That’s the whole point of the cloak.

There were enough justifications for it that made the frog farm look like a normal part of the game albeit an overpowered one.

None which warrants this type of a punishment on players who participated for no more than 2 hours and who got 99% of their cloak’s power from doing regular content.

Because it was their fault in the first place, and then again their fault when they didn’t release any statement about it.

And then a third time their fault for not responding and doing anything about it for almost a week.

They could have done any of a dozen things to stop people from farming these frogs but they didn’t.

Then you can’t blame the majority of people for doing it when a “legitimate site” that’s been backed by blizzard in the past and has collabbed with them on dozens of occasions pushes it too.

Naturally they would think that “it’s fine”.

Elaborate? It’s a very natural conclusion to come to when you’ve repeated the same “argument” in every thread on this topic and I’ve yet to hear a proper argument from you or… well, anybody really, as to why people who have barely touched frogs should still get punished this harshly.

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Let’s say you farmed for 2-3 hours and didn’t get to insane levels. That power helped you reach the heights of the other stats you got. 1-2 shotting mobs while people who didn’t farm was taking 5-10 hits to kill an elite. All of a sudden your little boost turns into way more stats than someone who didn’t do it. Hence you still get an inflated amount of stats to what you should have had.

I keep reading posts from people saying they got most of their stats playing normally, Yeah after you juiced your character to do that faster. It’s not hard to grasp that it let you do the other stuff easier, Even if you did it for 3 hours and not 10.

I’m in the camp that Blizzard should have buffed non frog farmers and it’s their fault. However I understand that something had to be done. It’s on Blizzard at the end of the day. I even made a post before any of this happened disagreeing with people calling for bans and also said it’s not an “exploit”

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Most people got their “normal play” stats from dungeons and raids and by your logic, non-frog farmers abused “having frog farmers in their groups to speed up their runs”.

And thus by your logic, everybody and not just frog farmers should get nerfed because those who had frog farmers in their runs had a way easier time than those who did not.

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That’s simply not the case. By the time you reach level 70, you’re already ridiculously overpowered for open world mobs, haven’t you noticed that? They already die in one or two hits.

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Not from their choice. There is a difference.

How can you say this with a stright face. This is just lying. You got no power from it? You didn’t notice your stats going up? Bit weird that.

We just going to ignore the fact that it was people who farmed frogs that’s been facerolling the raids for the last few days. Getting everything? Also this is simply true. What mobs you talking about critters? I’m talking about elites etc. I have 5 classes at 70 and none of them kills elites/rares and raid bosses like the frog characters. Are you being serious?

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SOME by their choice. People choose who to invite to their raids. Many even look specifically for frog farmers.

By “any power” I’m referring to 80k, 90k, 100k+ stamina cloaks.

Anyone who farmed frogs for only 1-2 hours wouldn’t have gotten more than 10-15k stamina on their cloaks from it.

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Still leads to an advantage to farm more through other means. You going to pretend 15k more stam and 1000 more stats isn’t much in wow?