M+ as "race against time" is bad concept - Ideas of Non-Timed M+ mode

Community General Discussion
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M+ is one of the 3 endgame gear progression options and it being designed around “how fast you can do it” is absolutely terrible design.
It ruins the fun not just M+ dungeons, its spreads everywhere into the game, breeds toxicity, favoritism, metas…
What happened to “bring the player, not the class” ?

there are MANY other options how to measure skill of players, knowledge of their class and how geared they are, throwing 5 randoms into timed event, stressing them for 30-40mins and rewards them 1-2 gear pieces. And it it fails, one of the degrades the key.

The insanity of the fact you have to run same 8 fungeons over and over for months/years is crazy already, but with all the stress and annoyances on top, its just killing the playerbase. Its a shame, as progression via dungeons always was the most accessible and popular way of gearing and socializing in the game…
Nowadays, chatting in M+ is gonna get you kicked

Couple of ideas how the system can be improved:
New M+ mode - Untimed run
- no time limit
-untimed run does not count towards M+ score
-key does not upgrade upon success, but neither degrade if the run is failed (key can be still manually degraded to reroll/decrease difficulty, but can only be upgraded in timed run. Key does reroll if the run is successful
-players are allowed to be replaced during the run
- untimed successful run drops 3 pieces of loot
-untimed mode can be available only to certain key level (+15 or so) so the competitive pro’s can’t abuse it to gear up (not sure if +20/+25 players rly care much about the gear, but whatever)

here you are, pro’s can keep doing what are they doing and be competitive and casuals can play, learn, gear up, get some confidence and maybe once day hop into timed scored scene

I would play the hell out of this mode. I don’t need difficulty to be different, i WANT TIME to explain to the guy who died in last pull what happened or what would be better option. Right now in M+, people die, people leave and most words you get from others is **** *** .

My very first BRD run took 7hrs. We replaced 2 guys who had to leave, we were waiting and hour for tank to pick up kids from school, and it was still be best dungeon run of my life and with 2 guys from that run i played the game for next 6 years. Why is it so hard to replicate situations like that nowadays? Did really players changed that much, are there any HUMAN beings left in this game?

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Didn’t realise it had to be randoms…

This just sounds like a pug issue and with most pug issues it can be solved by not pugging.

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of course its a pug issue, how do you think majority of players do raid/pvp/m+ content?

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In guilds mainly

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majority of players who are left, maybe, but still. No.

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Most play with friends, week in week out and have done for years.

If you can find me stats that say otherwise I’ll gladly listen to your pug whining.

Pugging is the 100% worst way to play WoW as it has a huge proportion of the socially inept who can’t invited back.

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of course, majority of players do M+ with guilds. You can move on, you solved it.

now i finally understand why LFG is so empty

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it’s like saying there are more premade bg’s than random bg’s.

please be realistic.

oh wait. exclusive content is assaulted and the ignorant backlash is coming.

you rather see the game die than open it up for the majority.

i’m sure blizzard have statistics. how many normal/heroics are run vs mythic.

though it will be a false narrative as mythic provide a upgrade system normals/heroics do not.

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average hate the “go go go” even in normals/heroic, there is dozens of threads about it.
Rush or leave mentality is all result of years of M+. Not a chance these guys would engage in M+ in current form.

as i said, the fact that saying anything in the chat in M+ run is considered bad behavior in a damn MMO game is ridiculous.

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If there was mythic LFG in addition to the premade mythic. Everyone true to themselves know which system would be more popular.

And it would bolster the premade mythic as then people are given a chance.

These “people” want to see the game die. They want to be relived of their misery which is also shown in the numerous complaints.

Contra people who want to play the game, but are met with…

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I love people who say just join a guild I did 6 months ago in SL and guess what ? The people doing keys with the same group of people in guild in SL … shock horror suprise are still only doing keys with those people.

I asked If i could join , our main tank in raid actually said sorry no I just do keys with these people I know they are reliable

So join a guild thing is bollocks. See the same thing happen in Legion , BFa and SL. Guild or guildless you will have to pug at some point.

Edit : In fact it’s just happened right now , tank , heal and his 2 buddies looking 1 dps to do a key i said i will go. His friend logs in sorry … we full mate. I was there 10 mins before hand saying I’m game and we are meant to be GUILDIES ?!

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There are more mythics runs then normal/hc runs, also you stated that wow is dead even if tjere are only 100.000 players playing that means its good.

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Don’t project your disillusion of what I said onto me.

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They should have kept the timer side of it as an esport only.

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Oh that does it then. You met a person that said that so “guilds” must be like that.

It takes time to get to know and be trusted by people. Who’d have thought?

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So you keep trying to join your main tanks grp… hmm… have you tried with the off tank…? Or some of the other people in your guild? Or do you only wanna join your main tanks runs because you know they do good or?

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Millions of players lost. And these “people” looking to lose more.

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“I like” the arguments like "most people play with friends " …but the other just as large part without them.

So let’s compromise and make the time limit an optional feature for people who want to measure …you know what…let’s make the reward for the time limit such that it doesn’t disadvantage the players without the time limit.

Not only will we achieve that over time those who play without a time limit will voluntarily enter the waters of you-know-what…but it will also help the community learn how to play such difficulty levels.

Big UP for this idea.

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I wish that they would remove the timer and just give limited amounts of deaths allowed before failing.

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Turn the u into an e and you have one third of the most trending hashtag this week plus a word that might have a different meaning but describes pugging perfectly nonetheless…