Mace stun proc rate

[Austenite-ashbringer]

lol, that has nothing to do with it. Why do ppl keep bringing up arena ratings or parses in discussions like this? To me that just proves you’re not very bright… You’re also wrong, the proc was insane in original TBC too, I remember being surprised by how often it would proc back then.

@Gottwald-shazzrah

In general it around 10%+/- proc chance.

No, it’s not. The combined chance of the weapon proc + mace spec talent might be close to 10% tho. That’s mostly from the talent which procs very often (even that is still less than 10%) while the weapon procs nowhere nearly as often (1% sounds about right).

EDIT: I went and did a quick test:
From 200+ hits I got 3 procs from the weapon and 15 procs from the mace talent.
That puts the weapon at around 1-2% and the talent at around 7-8%.
You’re welcome.

[Gottwald-shazzrah]

@Ikillulol-gehennas

Ur flat out wrong about it being 10%

@Gottwald-shazzrah

In general its around 10%+/- proc chance

That means 10% plus or minus by what wow.tools is showing. If it was 1% then in your Esfand link he would get 1 proc exactly in 100 hits. He got… 2-3 procs in the first 50 hits. Then he ended up doing… 100 hits I think it was ? got 2. And after that he said like 250+ and got 1 I think. So if you look at it this way its clearly not 1%, its not a fix proc rate same as wow.tools is saying.

It also depends on if it has an internal proc cap, as an example Seal of Command for Paladins has I think 4 procs per min, and it does not matter how fast or slow your wep is thats what you will get (Unless it was changed in TBC, but doubt it). The mace could have the same thing or it could have just a flat % proc chance. In which case it could end up proccing 10 times in a row after 10 hits. But if you did 1000 hits then this flat % would show.

Again, I at least can happily say that I dont know the exact % and how the proc works.

@Austenite-ashbringer

From 200+ hits I got 3 procs from the weapon and 15 procs from the mace talent.
That puts the weapon at around 1-2% and the talent at around 7-8%.
You’re welcome.

Not how it works. Try the same thing with crit. In 200 hits you will once get a 30% crit outcome, and the next a 50% crit outcome. Tho crit does not have a limited cap like TD/SH could (And many other trinkets do).

I mean… honestly xD are you one of those guys that goes in front of a target dummy, pops cds and says “X is my dps, I dont need to simcraft”.

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

You can’t use spell data as any indication because for example Warglaives also show as a 100% proc chance, yet you’d commonly wait 5-15 seconds before a proc outside of the ICD… The wowhead spell data is not always reliably showing what happens in game.

And that I can agree with, and I have stated as well that wowhead is not always reliable, hence why I linked another much more reliable page. As well Warglaives are marked as a 100, thats not %, it also means the proc is calculated server side and is not a fix number always.

I dont have a problem saying it could be less then 10%, the very page I linked stated the same.

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

you can argue all day that it’s overpowered or whatever but welcome to TBC.

Its annoying, but I played TBC when it came out, I am very aware what I was walking into. I never complained about it, I was commenting on the proc originally.

Just so this does not keep dragging on into infinity, any of you have ANY actual proof outside of “Well I tested it, and I watched a streamer talk about it!” any links to actual numbers ? Id say something like id posted maybe ? Id be more willing to believe its a flat 1% if I saw normal reasoning behind it. Not just flaming… since that clearly always convinces people that you are in the right (Not aimed at Bigbazz).

[Ikillulol-gehennas]

Ur too dumb to argue with i guess or stubborn. Do you have a disorder and taking ur meds ?

[Xartt-shazzrah]

@Gottwald-shazzrah

Just so this does not keep dragging on into infinity, any of you have ANY actual proof outside of “Well I tested it, and I watched a streamer talk about it!” any links to actual numbers ?

Tooltip on wowhead is wrong. Even if somone commited and hit a mob 10000 times you would still say sample size not big enough. So no. No one has numbers Nd tooltip wrong. Have a Nice day.

P.s its about 1% proc rate for the mace.

[Austenite-ashbringer]

@Gottwald-shazzrah

Not how it works. Try the same thing with crit. In 200 hits you will once get a 30% crit outcome, and the next a 50% crit outcome. Tho crit does not have a limited cap like TD/SH could (And many other trinkets do).

I mean… honestly xD are you one of those guys that goes in front of a target dummy, pops cds and says “X is my dps, I dont need to simcraft”.

lol, yes that is literally how it works. There’s a very low chance to get 30% crit in 200 hits to then get 50% in 200 hits. So you are betting that my test was just a crazy fluke… That’s so ridiculous that you must not know how probability works (it can happen but it’s very unlikely). Over a larger and larger sample size (more and more hits) I would get closer and closer to the true value. It is extremely unlikely that I’m not close to the true value, even with only 200 hits. I might be 1-2 percent off for sure but it still basically proves your claim about 20% wrong. You can “disagree” but that just shows your ignorance, especially since other ppl also reported similar numbers to mine. Do your own test if you want but don’t come and tell me “It doesn’t work like that” again without anything to back up your own claims, I wont respond to any more nonsense like that from you.

Your analogy to the dps thing with CDs is pretty sad too since I obviously don’t have a CD that increases my stun proc. I had to try very hard to not insult your intelligence while writing this. Are you actually trolling?

Having about 8-10% chance to stun is still kind of OP tho. I’m not denying how strong it is, just how wrong your numbers (20%) are.

EDIT: I continued the test a little just because I find it interesting (and it took me like 15 minutes only) and this time I got slightly more stuns:
561 hits, 51 mace stun procs, 10 weapon stun procs.
Mace spec stun: Around 9%
Deep Thunder stun: Around 2%
Do you want me to keep going or is it starting to sink in?

[Narcind-ragnaros (Narcind)]

@Gottwald-shazzrah

Not how it works. Try the same thing with crit. In 200 hits you will once get a 30% crit outcome, and the next a 50% crit outcome.

Assuming you have a 30% chance to crit, the probability of you critting at least 100 out of 200 hits is less than 0.001%, or less than 1 in 100000

So yeah, that kinda is how it works

[Temuz-firemaw]

its true what you saying… its stunning way to much than it shud do. its so dam overpowered getting stunlocked to death like a rogue with warrior dmg

[Kawaiihd-mirage-raceway]

Nah I remember being stunned a lot by warriors back then.

[Justica-zandalar-tribe]

Random is Random and it can be so broken. I remember very well playing Stunherald warrior back in TBC arena, and I remember feeling a bit bad because even if the caster manages to fake cast to avoid interruption the stuns are way strong when the stars align.

[Zmug-doomhammer]

i hope people are taking into account that the warrior mace stun talent combined with Deep Thunder/Stunherald makes for a really good combo.
its not one or the other, its the combination of the two.
i like to meme around as enhancement using Deep Thunder, and i get maybe 1 stun every 10-12 swings. doesn’t feel OP at all.
for me, the mace either hits like a noodle or it destroys someone in a single hit due to WF.
i suppose people notice those times where it annihilates them a fair bit more often than the times their health bar barely goes down by 5% per swing.

[Gottwald-shazzrah]

Fair enough. I still think its more then 2%, but I do consed that it cant be 10%, I mean… prob can, but you would be extremely unlucky.

@Narcind-ragnaros

Assuming you have a 30% chance to crit, the probability of you critting at least 100 out of 200 hits is less than 0.001%, or less than 1 in 100000

What ? If I had a 30% crit chance and you tested 100 hits 100000 times over the law of averages dictates that you will get on average 30 critical hits. So some times you will get more, some times less, but again on average 30 out of 100 (Hence the 30%).

So… maybe I misunderstood you but what you wrote made no sense to me.

[Cuteprinces-firemaw]

mace stun proc in the attack works separately for each hit, the system doesn’t built up more chances if success was zero after multiple hits, So if you have 5%chance (rogue talent) that would be having 100x numbers & on each hit system will /roll 1~100 if you hit 1 of the 5x numbers which proc stun? it will be a stun. take example…

-stun numbers are 10-20-30-40-50, and this will feels it’s impossible trying to hit 1 of those 5x numbers when ever you /roll 1~100, So most games company either use base higher chances than what the tooltip claims Or boost the chance % every time it fail to take place.

-now let’s say the actual mace stun effect is 18% which is (5-10-15-20-25-30-35-40-45-50-55-60-65-70-75-85-90-95) on every hit the system will roll from 1 to 100, if the number was one of those? the stun will occur! but since it’s totally random, you might /roll 10x times without getting any of them, But you also might roll 10times and get 2x or 3xtimes of those numbers in row. out of the 10rolls.

-if you tested that on thousands of hits? you will always have actual proc chances higher than what the tooltip claims UNLESS there is a hidden CD between procs (hidden cd between proc is the only method to prevent multi procs in row! when you’ve boosted the proc chances) but in TBC? some things did not have the hidden cd such as sword extra hits talent / mace stun effect talent / DST (trinket), some enchants, therefore they are Sooooooooo over powered for being able to proc multi-times in a row! but for weapons with chance on hit to proc something? most has a cd which set the proc under control & make it a low proc rate.
-so it’s not the deepthunder to blame it’s the mace stun talent with unknown chance & without having cooldown between proc.

Note: Critical chance has a lot of factors to not break the limit due the whole attack table issues

note2: In mid of wotlk they add a hidden CD between all proc’s to stabilize the rate, there won’t be insane rng of proc’s like in Tbc!

[Roffejow-razorgore]

Yes, its math and you misunderstand.

He’s saying the likelihood of critting 100 our of 200 hits (aka probability) with 30% crit chance isn’t 30% (but I think he meant 100 out of 100).

Basically, each hit has 0.3 probability to crit, so critting twice in a row becomes 0.3 * 0.3 (0.09 or 9%) and so on.

[Sonicwave-antonidas]

Jesus Christ, this guy is calling out a rogue for his name and saying that he must have “a room temperature IQ” but on the other hand doesn’t understand basic statistics. Absolute comedy gold.

[Narcind-ragnaros (Narcind)]

@Gottwald-shazzrah

What ? If I had a 30% crit chance and you tested 100 hits 100000 times over the law of averages dictates that you will get on average 30 critical hits. So some times you will get more, some times less, but again on average 30 out of 100 (Hence the 30%).

Yes, I never argued against this.

The chance of this happening though:

@Gottwald-shazzrah

In 200 hits you will once get a 30% crit outcome, and the next a 50% crit outcome.

Assuming you have 30% crit, which is what the first 200 hits would roughly indicate, critting 50% of your next 200 hits is a 0.0000002596% chance, or roughly 1 in 385208012.

This is called binomial distribution if you’d like to look it up.