Addition context for this. They nerfed a build almost nobody was playing in serious keys, that was generally considered inferior because the damage loss to run it was huge, and the regular build was still just the best thing you could be doing and all the highest keys that season were still done with prot paladin that was the best choice by a mile.
According to the data of people not playing it well / the better players running fire instead because itâs a better choice everywhere but fortified Everbloom.
i dont understand how this justifies the spec underperforming. fotm is fire so frost players are just frost players
Imagine thinking heroic stats are somehow relevant to any serious discussion. No idea how can you be so delusional, but whatevs.
Also still frost mage is performing worst from all mage specs, with 1 week and with 2 timeframe, so guess still not the best raid spec? Should we wait more maybe?
For the 50 players who can time +30 this season? No thanks, better not balance around those people.
You have no idea how specs work (or balance for that matter). You should not balance for 0.1% of the playerbase (nor for 1%) , you should balance for the masses. Mages are usually good (mostly fire, but arcane as well) when you plan the dungeon with their cooldowns in mind. If you donât do that, and you wonât make giga pulls for every combustion, itâs simply lacks DPS. Average pugs (+20 and lower) and high end groups do dungeons entirely differently. Itâs possible for something to be good (aug is another great example) for very high keys, and bad for low keys.
Blizzard should not balance for high end play, because those people will reroll anyway and go for meta no matter how little gain it is.
Aug does not meaningfully interact with any DPS spec in keys more than any other. It just makes everything better by a flat % amount, meaning whatâs already strong gets stronger.
Most good mage players play whatever is best out of frost / fire at the time. Prior to the fire buffs frost was doing the highest keys in the world, those same people are just playing fire now instead.
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I love how you complain about mages having to click their defensives in m+, and just ignoring the fact that other classes have to do that too. Like, the damage doesnât come at random times in m+ you know? Even for +20 you should know when the damage comes. I donât know why are you arguing here like you know what you are talking about. Not knowing your frost mage rotation doesnât help it either, you donât know what they are capable of
Intresting that you stop at 100 here.
Using the 25 and up there is 1261 Frost mages there is 1208 Fire mages there is 271 Arcane mages.
There is 2663Demo warlocks there is 74Destruction warlocks there is 6Affliction warlocks using Unique class population.
1261+1208+271=2740 mages
2663+74+6=2743 warlocks
Intrestingly you are correct in that there is 3 more warlocks doing 25keys or higher.
Impressed that you got that correct considering how wrong you have been in the past when you have made claims like this.
In the top 500 runs though there is a total of 106runs WITHOUT a mage.
In the top 500 runs that means there is a mage in almost 4/5 runs.
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data on wclogs suggests that fire was better for the entire tier . you say this because top players did decide to play frost but that doeesnât reflect the reality as i said before. streamers, guide writers and top players donât represent the whole community nor they can be taken as the samples for tuning. there are streamers outdpsing fire mages with ele shaman. that doesnât mean the spec is op. i am giving you the data of frost performing worse than sp and balance right now and you say because players are bad.
i stopped at 100 because i counted them myselfâŚ
yet you guys think mage is way better than warlocks.
does that count the same teams over and over again ?if so thatâs totally normal isnât it ?.
i just donât understand demolock ruled first season and no one said anything but now mages can do the same damage and warlock are having meltdowns because of it .
+20 is the average key imo(we can talk about another level if you want) and frost mage is MID . asking for a nerf to a mid spec is so weird.
also,
this is not weird or interesting you guys just believe what you see on twitch is the reality. if i watch petko for 2 days iâll think shaman is great . or if i watch critcake for a while iâll come here and say warrior needs a nerf.
Then mage did NOT need a buff to the specs in raiding or m+ as it was PERFECTLY FINE at doing the content before the buffs.
It simply does not do that as it holds up doing the HIGHEST keys where you need MORE dps to do the keys.
if it was lacking dps for the lower keys they COULD NOT use it in the higher keys.
THE IRONY that you say this and then in the SAME post you say
Do you know how many % of the playerbase actually finishes mythic raiding?
The majority of the playerbase does not do mythic raiding at all as a hint.
because you can not know this if you think balancing for the 1% is not something you should even try to do.
But that is LITERALLY what the newest buff to mage was doing.
Just play Frost the easiest of the mage specs and you have damage without needing to to be pulled around and guess what FROST WAS USED IN THE HIGHEST keys before the buff.
then why donât people push +30s with frost now 
if itâs that OP people should prefer it over fire since fire is a bit more tricky.
the only op dps in the game is dh now
Play something higher than +9 and you will see for yourself. With your own eyes.
Funnily enough, +9 would also benefit from mages utility in affixes like last week. And ofc benefit from their buffs and bl :).
i do play +20s , not as a mage. and yet somehow iâve never seen an op mage in a +20 , saw lots of havocs tho
You have been SO WRONG in the past making the exact same claims about other classes i do not trust you to get 2+2 correct.
Have you COMPLETLY forgotten about Season 2 GOD COMP???
WRONG person to say that to i have not argued that EVER.
Eh as much as I agree people are undervaluing the hell out of frost mage because it happens to be worse than fire, youre not really in a good a position to argue about high end play either doing 22s. Hell Iâm not this season doing 26s, the only reason I feel comfortable talking on the matter is I personally know and talk with the players doing 30s right now as theyâre my friends and partners from previous seasons.
Yet, you saw more OP warlocks? In my experience in those brackets, average frost will do more damage than average demo
I can make guesses but it was buffed and it was ALREADY being used in 30s BEFORE the buffs.
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Demo ruled season 1 of DF? Are we even playing the same game?
S1 was Rogue Enh Boomie or Fire / Frost Shadow Havoc, if you wanted to play lock you could but your only option was destro (And it was very good). Demo was awful.
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Ah i see you do not actually understand why mage is strong now this makes sense.
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i know there was a god comp but i wasnât doing many keys in s2. i know about the god comp but that was also about fireâs tier set . which isnât a thing now .
tho i need to say this, i wouldnât be against fire getting some tuning . iâm just saying nerfin utility is the worst way to do things as mage would become non-viable after that.
the problem is people doing +30s should not be the basis of asking for nerfs, then the game absolutely would be evolving around top players. even now they already care so much about high keys when they nerf specs. as i said before the bracket with most players should be the basis of nerfs and buffs since it will be more convenient. the elitist tuning is awful for low-mid tier players which is a bigger piece of playerbase than 3 guilds racing for +32
asking for nerfs because you saw mages in top 10 of rio is not a way of logical thinking thatâs all i can say to you