oh lord ofcourse they are meaningful choices. you made a Decision which has decided that characters aesthetic Power Capabilities strengths and Weaknesses for a life time… that character will Never play another class.
Yes. but it is a Player decision to the class they create. its not something u can just alter or change… which means the choice was Impactful to all gameplay assiossated with that character.
Its irrelevent if a Priest with the Right convenant is still being refused, regardless of WHY ur being refused… ur being refused and if no decision in the game will change that status its completely irrelevent.
arguing on the back of PUGs isnt a valid argument.
its a Toxic pool to be in to begin with, u’ll be rejected for 10000 Different reasons.
No worries, i got all the healers on max level 
So far for a meaningfull choice. I choose all.
Now multiply that number by 4, and you’ll be able to always choose the “best” one in any situation. At the cost of having to keep up 20 characters geared at the same time 
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yes butr u could say that about convenants.
im not arguign its a good concept… or a fair balanced way to run a game… i simply said the idea is Interesting in concept… and i dont think hating the concept is realistically the problems with the system
its cool fundamentally… but we also all know human nature Wont adapt to this. its good Game design in theory, but it transforms into Bad gameplay in player hands.
Convenants having player power is super problematic… and do i think the community will be proven wrong on the fact. absolutely not.
You do realise the entire point of a meaningful choice is to limit you? That’s what makes the choice meaningful.
This game is an MMORPG, so this is not an alien concept to the game; in fact more choices like this would really bring back the RPG element to WoW.
I am still fighting that we choose the best. We choose the best in our fun-range. And not underperform. My M+ group also contains a ret pala and arms warrior. We just play what we like and have fun with. And more options can definitely be more fun.
I know, it was a joke, but some people probably would do it.
You think it is a joke, but i am leveling my 2nd pala and monk at the moment 
I think meaningful choice… isnt something widely known to what its susposed to be… WoW has ALOT of players who dont play the game for RPG Elements… remember its never really had many in Multiple years… which means ALOT of new players never loved this game for its RPG Feel.
it will always be a case of 50/50. Some want choice… some like the concept… i think we’ll all dislike thje gameplay though at the end of this if it isnt smooth.
the ability to be slightly different to one another… isnt a bad idea, alot of people liked this about the Priest classic Racials. but its just the simple case of
Can blizzard Really Muddy the waters Enough to reduce the impact of the Meta taking over… and the answer to that… would likely follow the same answer to Should they keep convenants having Player power.
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The difference here being that class is a 1-2% difference. Covenant difference can be massive
Really?!.. u seen the latest data?!
Mages and Warlocks are closer to 20% Stronger then other classes in raw DPS Lmfao. class Identity likely will also bring back god damn hybrid Tax… and alot of people say “balancing hasnt finished yet”
but u wanna shout coincendence that the DPS only Classes are Outperforming all hybrids?..
Yeah the numbers go wild at the moment 
And even in 1 class. A necrolod arcane mage is also 20% stronger than a necrolord fire mage.
I guess you don’t play WW monk:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/24#boss=2329
Yes it is truth. You have this weird ideologi and utopia that players will pick what they find fun and play with it. I have bad news for you. Thats not how most people play game. Most people will always sacrifice their fun to be optimal. It even mention in several Preach videos how is meta tricle down trough community and everybody ends up playing same builds.
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Most people again, right? What most players? Didnt most players never even visit any instance? or even reach max level?
oh im not proclaiming the balance is right xD im aware they are also causing problems… espically for people who play All speccs.
IMHO i think a compromise at the minimum should happen .
i think all Soulbinds should be open to all convenants… and only the ability itself being the only power gain from your convenant choice… i feel balancing around 4 Abilities to each class is WAY easier to uphold comparitively.
As if u break it down i doubt the mage ability is generating the majority of that dmg necrolord has a Really fancy end tier DPS Trait for one of the soulbinds that defintly impact massively.
but Also fire did get jacked over…
the convenant systems success will ride on the back of if blizzard can find a Suitable half way point between themselves and the playerbase.
if they can adjust and compromise the system will be fine… if they’re gonna go in rigid and it go sour it simply wont be.
That is true, but I still don’t see any downside to them implementing them even for people who don’t play for the story. This wouldn’t be as much an issue if Blizzard could balance these or better yet don’t tie main expansion features to choices. At least to begin with while Blizz are still testing the waters to see how the player base reacts to meaningful choices they should be of minor significance gameplay-wise, such as with the loyalist/rebel part of the lore campaign, except actually act on it rather than just assuming we all went with sodding Saurfang.
Sorry had to vent in that last bit, but I’m sure you get what I mean.
tbh… most Rational Posts on the matter simply are concerned to the impact meta wise this will have on classes espically ones with multiple speccs.
which i agree with… this could go really sour.
however i do conceptually like it… i think even alot of people do… even preach said the idea is really cool, his concern is with the gameplay its going to produce.
the game has always been super “nothing u do really matters long term” and it is kinda sad the game has reached this i fully agree… and tbh i hope blizzard can prove the playerbase wrong and this system really works
If they can pull it off and we can start seeing more impactful choices and differences from player to player i think it will grow the game in a very positive way. its just a simple case of if they can pull it off… but im willing to let blizzard give it a go
i think the Risks… are atleast worth trying in a Alpha/beta for a Expansion… Risks in games is good, the idea they’re willing to try and Push the boundaries is good.
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I’d rather have good gameplay than meaningful choices, but I’m sure there is a middle ground like the aforementioned loyalist/rebel arc. Stuff like that can really help the game feel alive IMO, but if that comes at the expense of balance (such as covenants seem to be risking) I’d rather not bother with them.
convenants do have alot of risks to em, i am curious to how they handle it…
In most cases they dont seem to be too bad… but as Psjohly said, in others they’re REALLY bad lol
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