Back when people actually had to worry about mana (and thus also now in classic), I think people have pulled big because the aoe dps were yelling at them to pull bigger so they don’t waste mana.
Source: I’m usually one of those, lol
well all i can say, that learning how to play is a key. There should be group matching according to your skill lvl.
Like for e.g. could be finishing proving grounds gold a then you are matched with same achievement people.
When i form m+, i only look at proving ground achievement if player achieved it in gold i accept rest i don’t care if you have 10k rio. bye.
- sorry, healing is fun and relaxing, doing dungeon faster is nothing but better for everyone.
Because:
a). People are selfish
and
b). People are selfish and stupid
and
c). People are selfish, stupid and impatient
It’s in every game now.
Dota 2 for example new players just jump right into ‘Ranked’ without even bothering to play a single game vs Bots or unranked with other players, nah they just jump into a team game where you need to understand your class, your position and the game otherwise you get caned and guess what? You get caned but because a team can limp by you’ve to slowly get caned for 30+ mins and thing is even if you do win this person has then been carried and will be included in match making at a new higher level! It’s insane and they don’t care, you can’t say anything to them because like some sort Super-Power they are immune to any form of criticism (constructive included) instead choosing to counter that with toxic aggression.
No one wants to read, no one wants to learn - why should they when they can just jump in and screw everything up?
2 Likes
I started playing in wrath, and levelled a load of DPS through dungeons as people would just steamroll them. For me at the time it was great, instant levels. That changed once Cata arrived, people went crazy because speed runs were impossible at the start due to the crowd control requirement, and then has been speed speed speed ever since. So I dont think this is due to M+ being a thing. I have a small social guild, where we just run for the fun. Someone will practice healing or tanking and the others support. If we have to LFG we tell them, most dont mind a slower.
People will just have to realise they can’t rush dungeons atm and adapt.
Then you have not played WoW long enough to remember it.
I don’t understand why they don’t add something like an invisible wall to the classic random dungeon finders after some section where you can go on the way to the boss. This would allow you to almost instantiate the area players have to go through and force players to stay in place more and pay attention to tactics. When a group was low on interrupt they would get some ridiculous debuff that, while it wouldn’t have an effect on the players, would for example turn them into some sort of thing or show some sort of shape over their head.
That way the new players would learn to play properly even between classes. Then they would have a heroic without restrictions where for example this debuff I was talking about would only be on a certain player to know who to prioritize when kicking out of the party and replacing.
And who would have more such warnings in a row would have a lock on 10 dungeons of the same type and would have to go 10 times the same dungeon on normal difficult.
I’ve played since the EU launch. Played a tank on an alt in vanilla. Mained a tank in TBC until MH/BT. Tanked naxxramas, parts of ulduar & totc. Not once was there any point where I could only pull 2-3 mobs in any group content.
sure but one was sheeped 
and you did not tank 3 from the front and 3 in the back like we do now
No, I didn’t specifically bring any CC classes in my runs. A lot of my runs were done with shadow priest, warrior and warlocks and a holy paladin or holy/disc priest as the healer. I was a feral druid, my survivability wasn’t an issue.
You don’t do that now either. If I don’t keep mobs in front of me as a DK tank, I’m going to die if I pull big because I’ll never parry anything. Likewise, paladins and warrior can’t block attacks from behind, so they need to keep them in front as well. Also can’t dodge attacks from behind, so all tanks need to keep them in front of them.
Like, in academy I’m pulling all the lashers in the area at the tree boss when I’m tanking on my DK in one pull. If I give even half of them my back, I’m as good as dead. I can survive the pull without a healer but I would die even with a healer if they’re behind me.
I think this is the biggest problem right now, we’re at the very start of the expansion.
Some tanks are still playing like they are in fated raid and m+ gear, and propped up by the many system in Shadowlands like Soulbinds.
Dungeon design is also vastly different, enemies are more dangerous, they need interrupting, they need to be positioned correctly, there are many AoE/Bladestorm abilities that need to be avoided etc.
There are orbs in a dungeon that cast a spell called ‘Expulsion’ which is basically massive party-wide AoE, it hits like a truck and there can be multiple of these orbs casting this spell. There are Protodrakes in this same dungeon that cast a breath ability that hits in a wide cone, this needs to be positioned correctly so the party does not get hit, again there can be multiple of these Protodrakes per pull.
There are mobs in a few of the dungeons that cast AoE fears, these MUST be dealt with. There are enemies in some of these dungeons that fixate on a random target and can be problematic in a big pull, it may be wise to limit the amount of these enemies you pull at any given time etc.
Lots of these minor things that when combined turn the run into chaos for your healer, unfortunately all of these things are often wilfully overlooked just for the sake of the GOGOGOGOGO mentality that dominates dungeons right now.
I don’t mind speed at all but even I have seen some of these issues.
Tanks pulling entire corridors, ignoring that they’ve just pulled multiple mobs with decent HP and an aoe fear together. Unless you can reliably interrupt all of those yourself that’s just annoying in an LFD group. (There generally seems to be a lack of interrupts atm, idk why but the stats look really sad when you look at them at the end of the dungeon.)
Tanks not announcing face pulls, resulting in mobs wandering off because some people can’t keep their fingers off their keyboards.
Or simply not understanding how to corner pull so we end up with a big clump of mobs at the end of the walkway and 4 caster mobs strewn across the entire area code. (and 0 interrupts)
No idea where this comes from because if these people plan on tanking M+ like that they’re going to do very little outside of slowing everything down.
Did the M0 dungeons with a group of friends and that was arguably way less stressful even though our pulls really weren’t that much smaller.
Well, this is kind of a direct consequence of how the M+ rating system works. Just raid tbh, if you have the time.
As a healer who spammed dozens of normal/heroics/M0 :
- The dungeons of this xpac are easy. There are 2-3 packs that can be dangerous and that’s it. Bosses are complete jokes when you learn their mechanics (they will only get challenging in M+).
- Tanks are currently godlike. They can solo 8+ mob packs and finish off bosses when the group wipe. In fact, I barely have to heal the tanks, because they rarely drop below 50% hp.
TL;DR : Tanks pull large amounts of mobs because they can.
True i saw DH what was able to solo almost whole dungeon.
Yes. Normally i dont run many dungeons but its the first time in an heroic ive seen the tank (dh) tankin the 3rd boss of bracken without healer and a dps dead AFTER 1 WEEK. The other 2 were me (bad) and an average shammy.
Dungeons are being crushed at this very moment though.
It’s almost impossible for my DK to die unless I screw up with the current dungeons available to us. The healer doesn’t need to heal me. The healer CAN’T heal me in some of the pulls I’m doing because they can’t do anywhere close to enough hps. It’s only on me whether I live the pulls I’m doing or not and the healer has no say in it at all.
Like, this is on the tree boss in mythic academy, people didn’t kill the adds:
I have 296k hp. There’s no shot the healer would’ve kept me alive when I’m death striking for almost 250k as the max and average being 78k. He can’t get my hp back up fast enough, only my death strikes can do that.
Then in a ruby life pools I had a holy paladin whose healing on me was almost only through beacon. I would have been fine even if he didn’t beacon me.
Don’t forget you can’t heal stupid, if they don’t die how will they learn to avoid stuff.
I’ve mained healers since legion and I totally agree with you. This expansion the tanks are on crack. I mean they usually do run through quick but this expansion has been extra quick.
I even started playing Holy priest for the first time ever (usually play disc), I told the tank straight away that it was my first ever run as holy. What did he do? Pulled 800 mobs and wiped the entire group. I’m sat tapping buttons that I have no idea what each one does 
.
Demon hunters are the worst as their mobility is insane. As a resto druid I require pre loading some hots onto the tank before they’re fully engaged. This is impossible as I’ll cause aggro while the tank just runs straight through 5 packs of mobs.
I do get the speed thing sometimes, though I do think they should start slightly slower to begin with, until they judge the speed of the healer.
Did the Centaur dungeon for the first time today.
I zone in and I say hello and that this is my first time doing this dungeon.
No one says anything and everyone is already gone. God knows where. The NPC has barely started the introduction speech. I scramble to get on my mount as the tank has already started pulling mobs in some unknown part of the dungeon.
What follows is a blitz experience of a Brewmaster Monk pulling left and right and not stopping for anything, bosses included. Looting, scenery, dialogue? What’s that?! On the mount and off to the next place!
It goes so fast. We end up with one wipe and a few extra deaths here and there. I say that it’s my first time and I’m not familiar with the mobs (some of them use fear), and the tank just keeps pulling and everyone just tags along.
I can’t say I enjoy it very much.
The playstyle is akin to Diablo. But WoW is not Diablo. The game experience is supposed to be a bit slower and more immersive. But the player approach is action-RPG and hack 'n slash all the way.
It’s quite depressive in a way. I spent hours going through the Centaur zone and the dungeon was sort of supposed to be the climax to the story. But it falls flat, because you don’t get the time to experience the story that you’re playing through, because it’s just gogogogogogog all the time.
I don’t like it.