Add a permanent debuff with the amount of times you were the first to leave the party or didn’t move/interact with enemies in a m+ dungeon and make it so other players can see said debuff.
Easy, right?
So just sabotage the run by chain pulling everything, until the party decides to disband, or someone else leaves first?
It is much less likely that someone will waste their time doing that compared to
regular quitters which are everywhere.
Also leader can decide to kick that person, so that’s no issue.
Not if the other option is to be stuck with a group you want out of. 10 wipes in, and the group disbands. Faster than continuing (it’s super trivial to wipe any group, in any dungeon, very fast), and penalty avoided.
If you add punishments, people will work around it, simple as that.
But then the key is ruined, so the rest didn’t gain anything. And if you get a penalty for being kicked from a key, that’s just ripe for abuse.
Also doesn’t help if the leader is the one wanting to leave. It’s pretty common to give the tank lead for example, for marking; and for tanks, it’s easy to leave 'cos they find a new key in a few seconds. So this idea falls apart rapidly in this case, too.
A currency would actually be a good idea and solve a lot. You eighter get an item or 1/4 or something like that of an item as currency if you get nothing. If you not time the key you just have 1 more person with a 1/4 of an item. But everybody would always complete the key since they are always worth something
Make currency drop amount and itemlvl scale with M+ level.
Like 4 runs of a +5 will let you buy a random item (maybe you can choose the slot…so random gloves or belt for example) of +5 quality. But a +6 items would cost 12 +5 runs. And so forth so you could gear yourself with +2 runs in +15 gear but it would take literally forever…
Well alot of people in wow like to PUG, WoW is allready gated by Raiding when it comes to gear and progression, The m+ system was finaly a mode to log on and play with a couple of friends and try to progress, but it is now starting to be way to elitist, and the reward for doing “your ilvl” m+ does not even give upgrade, it is just punishing cous people leave all the time.
Wow is such a huge game and you need to feel progression without having a guild, like i said. i Play with 2 friends and we need 1-2 random people, and only one of the is enough to ruin a whole dungeon for just leaving, It would not be hard at all to prevent that with either some punishment for leaving or atleast no depletion on key, it is now only lazyness from blizz as they just want the Youtube/MDI community to matter.
2 Likes
What are you talking about there man?
If you play a healer tank duo you already have 2 of the 4 required votes to end the run.
If ‘someone’ decides they want to continue, that’s all good. That’s why it’s 4/5.
And this bs you’re spewing forth that a penalty system would be worse than what we have, man what game are you playing? How is having plebs quitting keys with no consequences more desirable than actually doing something about it?
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Add more people to your friend list. Had a good run? Add them. Need a few people later? Ask them. The more people you add, the more you can ask. You don’t need a guild, a set team, or a community, just a large network of friends.
There has to be some sort of control and punishment regardless if people find tricks to get around. If we follow your logic there shouldn’t be police, because malfeasants will still figure out how to get around.
Yes key is ruined and there’s nothing we can do about that, the same way nobody will revive if they get killed, but the assassin has to pay for the crime regardless, right?
So that’s where the debuff comes up, people constantly leaving and ruining mythic keys won’t be invited anymore to groups, which will not only prevent inviting quitters but also make people think twice before doing so.
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both dungeons and random bgs could profit from more penalties against leavers/afkers
But you need 4 votes. If two others vote to continue, you’re stuck.
I did something about it: for every good run I had, I added people to my friend list. Now I can run with people I trust. Simple as that.
As for the quitters: there are consequences. They wasted just as much time as everyone else. The ain’t plebs either, there’s always a reason behind someone leaving an instance, and most of the time, it’s a valid reason. If someone joins a key advertised as +15 timed, and the group keeps wiping before even reaching the first boss, there’s zero reason to continue.
If you introduce punishments, you will not finish more runs. You’ll waste more time, because people who do not want to finish an instance, will not finish one, and will find ways around any system you come up with. Many people will even stop pugging, because being wrongfully penalized is not worth the risk. Most people who play well, will just run with friends, guildies or a community. So not only will you end up with less groups, you will also end up with a considerably smaller pool of good players. Because everyone worth their salt will not use such a system.
If you find one people can’t work around, noone will use it. They’ll just go with people they trust. As they should, mind you, but everyone who makes a “LETS PUNISH LEAVERS!” thread completely ignores the best advice always given in these threads: you can avoid it, if you run with people you trust.
Build a network, problem solved.
Real life ain’t a game, though.
Not quite the same thing. Leaving a key is not a crime (and should not be, for all the reasons explained in this thread and the million others - please do your research). Murder, however, is.
Except people will find a way to avoid the debuff, so your solution achieved nothing of value.
Besides, there’s already a way to avoid quitters: run with people you trust. Guildies, communities, and/or a network of friends. You don’t have a network of friends? Start building one. You can quickly forget all about having to build a RIO score, or having people leave keys, or not doing mechanics properly.
A solution exists. All the complainers choose to ignore it for some odd reason.
Mate, but they don’t. You’re just not talking about the same thing.
This is a thread about pugging and how to improve it. The solution cannot be ‘stop pugging’, this should be self evident.
As you should be.
The real issue here is not how keys are advertised, though i do see your point and if the description says +15 timed it stands to reason people will vote to end if if there is no chance of timing it.
The real issue is the lack of respect people have for others and their time. Everyone thinks their own time is more valuable and their own goals trump those of others. In a group environment, this is purely toxic. In WoW, and in life.
3 Likes
If people weren’t playing bad, there wouldn’t be leavers. Nobody leaves a good run outside of emergencies.
Talking about respecting others and their time? Stop wasting my time by playing bad.
So they don’t vote to disband, then what? What are they going to do if I go AFK? They won’t get anywhere.
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Nor am I suggesting that. Playing with a random selection of friends is still pugging. You just have better tools to figure out who to take than rio or dice.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. You wish.
If it’s about respect, how about you respect the time of someone who decides finishing a run is not worth their time? Why are you putting your goals and desires over others’? Why are you trying to force your will upon them?
Noone controls other people’s time or goals. If they deem a run not worth their time and effort, it is in their right to leave. Does that hurt? Yeah, it does. But it’s their time, and their effort too. If you talk about respect, you should respect your team mates too, not only them respecting yours.
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Because you force your will upon them the moment you leave the key.
It’s not like they can finish it without you, can they?
That’s just…not true.
If you do that you don’t even need the finder. The very idea of pugs is that they are random people you don’t know.
And even if you do not agree with that definition, fine, but that’s not the scope of the discussion.
This is about deciding how to improve the experience when playing with randoms, and adding consequences is long overdue. People should be very clear from the start on what they want out of a key. Any abuse should be punished. It’s the only mature thing to do.
This whole idea of doing whatever you want, no matter the others, no consequences, no problem, in quite frankly childish.
And to put it bluntly, there is still nothing stopping you from leaving a key. Absolutely nothing. You can just leave, and take the penalty.
The improvement will be that there will be less people who tend to leave queueing, and while overall dungeons ‘started’ will go down, dungeons ‘finished’ relative to this number will go up.
Yes, let’s punish people who can’t dps and who can’t heal or don’t know the routes. I’d love that. Those people are why there’s leavers.
Unless this view changed Blizzard made m+ in mind with friends (guilds/communities) playing this together. They even created communities ingame for this purpose.
I hope Blizzard will never change this aspect. Now I’m not saying nobody ever should be able to pug m+ with complete strangers, what I’m saying is: this is simply the nature of this gamemode and we the players will have to accept it.
Get some ingame friends who also want to complete a +14 and work on it together. Why is this so hard to understand? Out of all the people that complain about rio and elitism, there must be a few that can group together and do this?
Or were you hoping to not have to do any work and go in with some overgeared players?
Aren’t they already ‘punished’ though?
They don’t time the key either.
They don’t get invited to groups as often as they don’t have high enough rio.
They may get kicked if they are such colossal failures.
They ain’t gettin gear.
I dunno guys, i was never the first one to leave a key no matter how badly it went. I just found it shameful. I get that it’s a waste of time sometimes and not ideal, but i also get that for the people who pushed that key, having to push it yet again just because of a bad pull or whatever is horrible.
I mean it’s just common courtesy at that point. If the leader decided to invite you and took a chance on you, no matter how good or bad you really are, you should at the very least ask him if he wants to continue or if it’s fine to leave.
It’s curious that most leavers are not the ones with the key, so that’s some food for thought right there
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dammit blizzard, get some better players ffs