Mythic+ Ruined WoW

Community General Discussion
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Am I the only one that thinks Mythic+ ruined WoW? Raids became pointless, PvP gearing went out the window. The item level difference from Mythic+ got way out of hand. You play the same content over and over and over. You have no choice but to do it…

I feel like raiding should feel worth while. Mythic+ should still be in the game for the competitive side but cap the gear at Mythic 10? Give cosmetic rewards for Mythic 15+, similar to challenge mode in MoP, give a tabard for 25+, and have title rewards for end of season for whoever has the best times.

For PvP have a simple gear system, and let the gear scale to a higher item level in PvP. Item level from honor gear should give the same as heroic gear, but scale up to mythic 6 in PvP, and conquest gear should start at mythic 6 and scale up to mythic 10 in PvP. Basically give people the option to farm 2 sets of gear again. There was nothing wrong with that. It certainly beats bfa and having bags full of different azerite gear.

Remove all over the top ‘borrowed power’ and bring back class strength. Have reasonable borrowed power in place such as class set bonuses. Make sets worth collecting again, for PvP and PvE. Apart from the traits and essences still been in the game, pre-patch has felt better without corruption. Its felt like my classes have been doing what I expect without having a random chance to get a proc for main source of damage. I really hope they don’t mess up conduits and soulbinds to be all your damage.

Everyone says ‘casual players should be at a disadvantage’ why? Because we don’t have the time to grind everything? The only advantage hardcore players should have is that they should technically be better/more skilled with how long they’ve played. As someone that’s played since Vanilla, I’m now 28. I have real life commitments and don’t have the time to grind, I can play maybe 15 hours a week. Even when I was younger in earlier expansions and I had loads of time to play, the gearing systems were much more reasonable, especially for PvP. You could have alts and not have to spend hours grinding reputation/renown just to play the aspect of the game that you wanted. The best part about WoW was never getting the gear, it was having the gear to be able to play and it seems like they are prolonging how long it takes for you to be able to play. Why does it make sense to run the same content over and over for a higher item level of the same piece of gear that youve already got? Mythic+ should open the gate to raiding, BGs should open the gate to Arenas/RBGs. If you want to compete it comes down to skill, not time played.

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I stopped reading at this. You have no idea.

In BFA raids had BIS azerite gear. They had BIS trinkets (sometimes spanning 2 patches even with a much lower ilvl). in 8.3 with corruption you had BY FAR BIS items from the raid (skitra bow, fist wep from ra-den, BIS azerite gears, +10 ilvl higher on last 2 bosses etc)

To perform at the top of your ability raiding was and has always been mandatory to get these items. Imagine being a fire mage in 8.3 without font to maximise your dps or a hunter without the Skitra bow.

Mythic + was always designed to be AN ALTERNATIVE to raiding and it did its job. Maybe a tad too well in BFA due to the amount of gear that dropped. It should STILL be an alternative to raid because you will ALWAYS have to raid to aim for your BIS items.

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Mythic+ dungeon loot got nerfed in SL. We already needed to raid for bis items, especially trinkets, but now also ilvl is nerfed to below heroic raid loot. And the amount of loot is also nerfed (to 1 per dungeon-run).

Raid or die in SL.

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Yes.

/10char

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M+ brought more players back then any feature in the game , the numbers prove it . Me and my guildies came back exactly for the m+ and a few arenas .

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Yeahhh mythic+ didn’t ruin anything. If anything it’s saved the game. Imagine being a PvPer or raider, and only getting gear from them. Back to classic times log in for raid twice a week for a couple hours, then nothing to do rest of work.

The logic of oh it’s spammable, so unfair! It’s an average of 1 item every hour. From an extremely large (over 200 items) list. To get ya BiS (m+, raiding loots better anyway on SL). Ya looking at 50+ hours of timing keys, more if you fail, which will happen alot. Every single 6 month major patch. I’d take a 2-3 hour heroic raid when it’s on farm, for better items anyday lol.

I certainly wouldn’t play if keys weren’t a thing. Purely because there’s no where near enough content to keep me busy.

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Above all, M+ made me find something to enjoy WoW because sadly i cant raid anymore.
M+ kinda filled that gap with something challenging to do and enjoy with a small amount of my guildies / ingame friends.

Gear is capped at M+ 15 / same as Mythic ilvl, or atleast from the weekly vault in SL.
Cosmetic rewards for anything above 15: check, the mount and title for all 10s in time.
And for the real competitive side of things, raiding is a necessity if you wanna run M+. Is raiding needed up to 18s or so, nah not at all.
You will find a small benefit with X trinket but for sure dont need it.

So it already follows your ‘‘desired’’ path.

Which isnt related to M+ at all, and doesnt fit your thread title. So maybe its just more of a general feedback post instead of bashing on M+?

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I played wow during Vanilla, TBC and Wotlk. I was in a raiding guild and was active in all areas of content.

But what I loved doing was 5 man dungeons. They were so exciting.

So when I returned to WOW at the tail of Legion and tried out this Mythic dungeons I had heard so much about I was finally playing the game the I wanted to play from the start.

So, no, M+ did not ruin WOW. M+ added a new way of playing WOW which works well for many players.

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Remove M+ and we’re basically back to Wod. I strongly disagree. And even as a raider, it gave me compensation for the loots I could not get in raid.

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But you don’t even have Curve, how do you know if M+ has ruined raiding or not? :thinking:

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Ruined it, no. I personally hate M+.

But it’s fine; there’s people who enjoy it.

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You’re entitled to your opinion, but I also think like most other posters here that you’re wrong.

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in SL Raids are high ilevel rewards. and in BFA Was the BiS Trinkets and Azerite traits for ALOT. it didnt become pointless

this isnt M+ Related… it was Just in the same expansion that removed PvP Gearing… that doesnt make it M+ Fault

again has been fixed in SL

no, u should be able to do a M+15 in the gear M+ Provides and u simply wouldnt be able to… its capped at 15. which is fine.

it always has been… just simply players who dont optimise dont know it. Raids offer the best Azerite gear. they also offer the best trinkets in alot of situations…

next expansion heroic raiding is above M+ Reward ilevel.

The iossue is ur asking for a game philosphy to change and its not simply gonna change. the reason it changedthe first time is due to the change of people running the game.

until that happens again in another 3ish expansions odd u wont see a Evolution in any direction.

you dont think its fair a PvPer has to PvE/Raid to PvP
yet you thionk its fair to push those requirements on M+.

it seems excrudiatingly bias to me in all honesty…

Either you want Content to funnel gear to the players doing that content or not.

If u wanna PvP for max rewards
M+ Also need to be able to compete for max rewards
so does Raiding.

If u want Raiding to be the final end goal.
then M+ and PvPing cant have Gear designs.

your argument goes against 1 Piece of content catering to its audience and saying the fact they can grind themselves to the top via that piece of content is Wrong.

but you want PvP to fulfill that exact desire.

Which then puts u on the side of “well why cant blizzard just let us do whatever we want and simply reward us for our time investment”. which fundamentally goes againsy your first argument.

Pick a Side of the fence u wanna be on… then argue your point. ur blaming M+ for the entire games Design… and thats Simply not true, ur pvP gear went out before M+ Came in. As M+ Wasnt in the game from Legion launch.

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the people who tend to hardcore that content ruined wow tbh … not mythic+ itself…

relying on things like raider i.o in order to get themselves carried cuts out a good 80% of the playerbase from ever progressing.

those people turned mythic+ and raids into a job.

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if a 2.2k player Refuses anyone under 2k. they’re not using RIO to carry them. they’re using RIO To dictate Players among the same skill level as themselves…

your stating untruths for the sake of a narrative and thats incorrect.

the problem is you expect players to carry you throgh content so u can “experience it”. and cant be bothered to put the work in to set up ur own keys to gain said experience.

RIO Doesnt get you carried, nor does it cut anyone out. It stops people getting into content with 0 experience… people with like 400 RIO (meaning they’ve likely never done a +10 Key.) Expect to be invited to a +17 and its just not the way the world works.

everyone in the game can get RIO. its not hard, just complete a Key and u get it, even if ur moving at 1 M+ a Day you’d still climb fairly high as its based on the key u complete not activity.

if u complete every dungeon on a +10 you will have 1200 RIO.

this character was 0 RIO Last week, its now 2470, its really not hard… if i can get a enhancement shaman into a +20 Key, then clearly not hard. and sure we can screech “Eh but its Prepatch”. And true but RIO and classes still get u rejected xD

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Yes. Thanks to mythic, the game went downhill, until we got to the pissing contest we have now.

I hope blizzard realizes they’re crapping on their own devs with this. Mythic just adds TERRIBLE ilvl/stat bloat.

Vanilla and 4 expansions came and went before we needed the first squish. The next squish came only after 2 expansions (WoD and Legion). Now BFA was a single expansion and we ALREADY needed another squish. Does that tell you nothing?

Blizzard is failing to balance anything, and it’s only making it harder since the difference between fresh max level secondary stats and last patch endgame stats is SEVEN TIMES. It’s not like these stats interact with one another in linear fashion. Some things will scale extremely well, some nearly not at all.

The old expansions had what, 3-4 tiers of gear? What did we have in BFA? like 70 tiers, thanks to mythic?

PS: Not everyone wants to run the same thing over and over again just adding difficulty to it.

At this point I’m just waiting for a SWITCH, like warmode is, that you tick off when you don’t want to bother doing the insanity that is mythic, so you’ll only be grouped up for activities with other non-mythic geared people, and be phased out for everyone that has mythic on, so you don’t get regularly griefed by people with 2-3x your HP and 2-3x your dps.

I get that you want to have an advantage over other people. But there are tens of thousands of people who don’t have time to play 15 hours a day every day or have reflexes of a teen and hand-eye coordination of a martial artist. And since someone who HAS that doesn’t have like 20% advantage like in the olde days but 200%+ one at any given time (except for the first few weeks at the start of expansion), it’s becoming a clownfest.

I’m 29, and I can’t in good conscience raid or do mythic+ anymore because my memory, reaction time and hand-eye coordination is nowhere near where it was 10 years ago and it’s only going to get worse. I actually admire people like Preach who can still do things in their ‘advanced age’, but then again he does that for a living, he didn’t ruin both his hands working in a factory.

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Sounds like a good change to me, mythic+ was too prominent over normal raiding.

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That is subjective :slight_smile: Raiding was always already giving the better loot, but now dungeon loot is even further down the line.

As an M+ players i would like to have seperate gear progression for the different types of content (dungeons, raiding, pvp). So players can choose the content they like, instead of getting forced into stuff they dont want to do.

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The ilvl bloat is coming from the 30 ilvls of heroic and mythic raiding every tier. M+ ilvl rewards are getting balanced around the raiding rewards.

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Why would a casual player need this kind of gear? I really do not understand why you’d want 475 (now 135 I guess) gear when you plan to do only (for example) normal mode? Isn’t it logical that you get more stuff if you play more?

Also, in 8.3 you could literally gear your character from freshly dinged 120 to fully decked out in what? 15 hours? 20 hours?

What I’m reading is that you feel entitled to everything a mythic raider/hardcore M+ player gets without any effort. No thank you.