I’m unironically starting to think that all the people who are anti-flying are just bored trolls who do it for easy kicks. Never seen a single person yet make a decent case as to why flying is bad. They just namecall you and think they win that way. Strange.
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you keep mentioning these “easy fixs” but honestly lets break this down on Mentality.
if flight is in Normal mode, and No flight in WM… how many players would remain in WM?.. would this feature Kill WPVP because of player mentality YES. it would. People are not interested in Longevity, they’re looking for the fastest way to do their stuff per day. we all said this in BFA… no flight in WM Would kill the entire system.
Every Expansion has had Content Droughts, the People who rushed the game down sat in Orgrimmar/Stormwind every expansion shouting about how theres nothing for them to do and its a Dead expansion. its physically impossible to prevent a Content drought. thats why we have these stupid Infinite grinds now… becuase no Expansion has had No Content droughts in them.
in every expansion, u generally go as far as ur willing to into a tier waay before it ends. thats just how WoW has always worked… u get those that are slower and generally have content because they fall behind and those above the curve that suddenly hit content droughts.
as i said, the Wait in BFA was too long, I beleive the Open-world Was pretty dead Loong before they released Flight… and i also disagree with the Additional Rep grinds added last minute in the same patch for pathfinder 2 to unlock flying to also be horrific.
Imho, i think Simply Pathfinder 1, Revered with all Reps in the Expansion Release. 6 Months to get it done… Release the Flight to players, because after 6 months. this is when People are really, just travelling to do M+, Levelling Alts or Raiding. the majority have Passed through open world within the first 3-4 weeks of the expansion launch… so the delay Doesnt need a Year.
I dont agree with Pathfinder part 2, i dont agree with the Wait Enforced during BFA… and i hope both of these are re-evaluated by Ion…
im NGL the majority ditched WoD cause it was a Terrible Expansion 
I quit WoD in 2 weeks… Litterally that god damn bad. if the Anti-Flight group… Ditched WoW in WoD XD
but these changes mean, those that hate Flight can launch on Launch day, get revered by getting their main to 60 and doing a week of WQs, then Log off til Flights Launched, those that deal with it and arent too affected wait 6 months and can fly… 1 year is Alittle too long and the pathfinder 2 Requirements Pretty much Lock returning players out the feature.
they want Players to come back… but then Shoot them in the foot on entry as Punishment for taking a break i havent even unlocked flight so far tbh. i only just came back as i quit BFA about 3 weeks in.
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exactly. people were able to keep themselves busy during content droughts. i dont ever remember being bored during TBC or WotLK. or they just took short breaks but that was part of the expected cycle. its almost like the players now, are not the players from back then, though obviously people like me disprove that argument. i’ve just given up hope with everything, so, meh.
Your reasoning is flawed because we have already grinded for days and weeks and months, several times over. And Blizzard keeps taking away the thing we worked so hard to earn.
I understand that someone who didn’t play TBC and WotLK doesn’t see that. They don’t have the same experience as us old-timers.
But for us, who earned flying the hard way, being made to constantly have to earn it back over and over again, Pathfinder is a big eff you right in our faces.
World PvP was dead not because of flying but because of poor class design and PvP culture. In TBC and until about halfway through WotLK, it was thriving.
But over time, classes became awful to play in PvP and Blizzard messed too much with that aspect of the game. Blizzard also stopped supporting world PvP by diminishing the amount of world PvP content (such as the arenas in TBC), thereby reducing any actual gameplay incentive to engage in it.
And the PvP culture devolved massively, to the point where world PvP just wasn’t fun anymore.
If you weren’t sure you could take someone out, you would get ganked. And they would stalk you and keep ganking you over and over again until they got bored or you logged out. Often they’d bring friends!
Flight was a good way to escape people abusing the PvP flag as a method to legally harass people. For fun. It allowed those who weren’t able to keep up with the overgeared gankers to avoid them and do the content they wanted to do while still having the option of engaging in world PvP at their leisure.
To even suggest that flying is the reason why WPvP is bad shows you don’t fully understand the problem and suggests you weren’t around when world PvP was alive and well.
There is no one reason why it’s broken; there are loads. Flying really isn’t one of them.
Lolololollo nice joke
While i agree it feels rewarding, world quest rep grinding is bullcrap.
Biggest issue with pathfinder is it just plain isn’t fun… pretty sure that’s the whole purpose of the game.
Having skipped WoD and Legion, coming back to BfA I’m left with not one, but three steaming pathfinder turds to work my way through. At the very least they should be simplified for older content, removing rep requirements as a minimum.
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They should remove reputation requirements from all pathfinders
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You gonna pretend like pvp wasn’t thriving in BFA zones until flying was unlocked?
Congrats, you just described world pvp. I’m pretty sure it was optional?
You just explained why flying ruins warmode, it’s a get out of jail free card and makes all encounters optional, which destroys the spirit of world pvp. We’re not really at war when everyone is in bubble invincible mode high in the air. Flying killed warmode.
while im not a fan of pathfinder its still compromise between ppl who want flying and those who didnt,i think the only change which should be implemented is nerf of rep requirement
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It’s not a compromise at all, in fact it’s even WORSE than it was before because those of us who don’t do the grind to unlock flying because we prefer to play the game as Blizzard said it was designed are basically in gimp mode vs flyers with their god mode teleport button in warmode. It’s massively unfair. Either give everyone flying or give no one flying, not this stratified apartheid system.
w/e they will choose i know u will cry on forum about it so…
“Pretty sure it was optional”
Um…
I mean, if you started playing WoW for the first time in BfA then it makes sense why you’d make that statement, but in the long long ago, in what we call The Beforetime, there were servers where the PvP flag was mandatory. And a lot of players enjoyed playing on these servers, and also enjoyed ganking and not being ganked, and some of them even enjoyed being ganked.
The great thing about PvP servers was that you had a choice in which type of PvP you wanted to engage in. If you wanted to gank or be ganked, that was an option. If you did not want to be ganked, that was also an option. Everyone won!
And world PvP was NOT thriving in BfA. The only kind of PvP that happened in war mode was 40-man raids of a single faction invading one server and hunting the other faction, and usually that was Horde who did the hunting. That is… not world PvP lol.
I’m old enough to remember what world PvP used to be like. World PvP was fun and challenging, and had actual objectives that produced actual benefits for the faction that was currently controlling checkpoints and/or the zone. There were actual wars being fought over those checkpoints because of the resources that they provided, something which just doesn’t happen anymore.
There is no challenge in ganging up on 2-3 players with a filled raid. At that point it ceases to be WPvP and becomes harassment.
My suggestion would be to go to Classic! You have that option now, to relive the good old days when WPvP was at its best!
Also 100% agree with this. Give us all flying, or take it away for good. We do not deserve to have to constantly re-earn flying every frikking time when we have already put in a ton of work just to keep it over the years. It is unfair and infuriating and, frankly, insulting. And that is one of the things that ruin WPvP in this game atm, the whole haves and have-nots situation with PvP, where players who just want to do PvP are forced to do content they aren’t interested in just so that they can keep up with the rest.
That isn’t fun, and doesn’t create fun for anyone.
In my opinion, loremaster and explorer should be enough for flying unlock. The rep grind is like Ion begging for another month of sub for a trash game… you know when a game is trash when it needs to create time gates everywhere to try to extend your gameplay and your sub…
but for wow this seems to have opposite results so far, thats why subs continue decreasing every month and every year. What saves them so far is the sell of pets , tokens and mounts on store, that covers the loss of subs… when investors realize how crap the game designer is, it will be too late… if not already.
They need to slow things down to a crawl, if they speed things up too much they have to add meaningful content. And that costs money. Money they’re not prepared to spend on WoW any more.
I hate the approach they have to flying now. Flying should be a means of transportation and nothing more. And as such they should build around flying as that means of transportation, not lock it away. There’s so much good content they could have made with flying in mind, and I thought they were on a good track on it with Wrath and 2 entire zones build around flying.
Makes me wonder, where would the game have been hadn’t ActivisionBlizzard happened.
I wouldn’t mind the pathfinder if it would be changed. They want us to see the design from the ground, that’s understandable, but the leveling phase should be enough for that. Make us discover the Shadowlands fully, get friendly reputation in every zone, reach lvl 60 and then give us a quest that tells us something like “now that you proved yourself to all of us we we will be so kind that we won’t shoot you down from the skies” or something like that.
At this point, flying only takes away the frustration of having to run around carefully unless you want to get dazed and dismounted. We rarely meet anyone on the ground because of phasing and even if we do, most likely those two players are not going to talk to each other.
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Why would we even want to stop and talk to someone randomly running by? We all got grinds to do, places to go and limited time! xD.
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I would just like if we would get PF 2nd part faster.
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Same, maybe at the 6 month mark or there abouts rather than the 1 year mark.
It was people like you, who managed with their whining to put this pathfinder system in.
In the old days we could just buy the damn skill and be over with…
Everyone had the chance for it, now people drop out because of the pathfinder system.