No new city for Night elves - Bel'Ameth the Capital village

Community General Discussion
643

I do not understand this…

I think this whole fallacy of “taking from others” should be debunked here and now.
Long before we saw Quel’thalas in gaming and the blood elves became playable, the lore already established the night elves at the pinnacle of arcane casting and elven civilization :slight_smile:
This has always been part of their identity. That you saw the wood elf side in WC3 mainly, does not erase this as that origin was already in place, part of the WC3 manual and the War of the ancient trilogy books that were already been written during wc3 and wow’s development to tell that story.

The way I have noticed it, night elves have the the most extensive reservoir and knowledge base of the arcane by a long shot, as the high elves lost 90% of the knowledge which the Shen’dralar, Ancient trees and Nightborne still retain … furthermore, most of the things the high elves would have the night elven arcane users will have.

This is not “taking away” from blood elves.
Night elves having cities and elven civilization is not taking away from blood elves
Night elves having arcane magic is not taking away from blood elves

Any more than humans and gnomes having it is…

Let us examine how the game presents them.

High elves, Humans, Gnomes have a similar vein of magic, it’s derived from the original night elven one but is far more limited in scope, because as far as magic and the elves are concerned, we are living in a post-apocalypse world.
AS far as humans are concerned, the current age is the most advanced ever…

So night elven arcane and civilization can distinguish themselves form blood elves by having a higher volume and more advanced nature of a lo t of things.

I usually take the star/moon magic, that we see Nightborne mages use, and night elven ones, as well as night elf druids, and priests of Elune as perhaps the biggest example of the degree of advancement, this is really unique to them, like a lost level of magecraft or rather arcane usage. other examples would be greater works of the arcane.

None of this is taking away from anything, the blood elves owe much of their arcane mastery and knowledge to the night elves, because they descend form night elves and it’s that knowledge they pursue. it’s one of the reasons they have be-friended the Nightborne - the Archaeologists of the Reliquary bemoans the loss of knowledge in Legion, then launches you to steal arcane secrets from Suramar as a great treasure. Then we see Aethas hungry to learn the knowledge of the Nightborne elders his new student is tasked with procuring.

We shouldn’t be looking at night elves having standard arcane stuff and arcane advancements as stealing from blood elves in anyway shape or form. If the Nightborne have it, the night elves will have it in every area except the degree of development of chronomancy, this is the only magical distinguishing line we know, that and the unknown discoveries and advancements the Shen’dralar would have made in their 10,000 years of “furiously studying the arcnae.”

So, what do blood elves have that the Night group of elves do not have?

  1. The sun - being a nocturnal race of elves, neither group of night elves - Darnassians or Shalassians woudl I expect to be as conversant in this area as the blood elves. Shen’dralar were scrying on everyone and adding to their knowledge form others, but again, this is day time, based magic - it wouldn’t interest them as much.

  2. Blood arcane - this is specific to the blood elves - not even the high elves would e conversant in this, nor woudl the night elves, this is stuff gained during TBC, with the blood crystals, Draenei tech etc… now as far as draenei knowledge would come, I suspect high elves would have access to knowledge by virtue of being friendly with draenei, and later void elves who come from blood elves, would also have carried some of those advancements - except void elves aren’t interested in blood magic, but void magic augmentation with the arcane. So, blood magic is a blood elf and Troll thing. The Isle of Thunder shows you the acquisition of blood golems, and demonstrates blood elven determination to learn and gain as much magic as possible.

  3. Day vs night - being diurnal would have significant magical distinctions especially that can play not differences

  4. Religion - Elune worship vs just the Holy Light is also a massive magical distinction. Blood elf priests don’t use arcane magic in their spells, nor worship an entity, what they are similar in is their high degrees of devotion and fanaticism. Although as with the arcnae and nature, the night elven lot just seem more intense. Almost like the blood elves a bit more humanised versions of them… which I thin k was the intention

In Warcraft there are many overlaps within the races, and some few instances they distinguish.

Within the same people group, like Elves, humans, Trolls - you’d have far more similarities than differences. There are also regional similarities and historical ones that will force similarities. Humans live close enough to high elves and were taught by them, so being in the same geo political sphere would have similarities in their magic and styles, but there will be differences too.

Night elves and Nightborne are in a different geopolitical sphere and regional area too, plus they are a very different historical one which they share with themselves, however high elves share a historical connection with night elves and so we know the origin of the magical arts comes from this connection as well as the nature love, hence you woudl have similarities.

The academic hierarchy is nearly identical amongst night elves and high/blood elves as far as the mage class is concerned, even with the knowledge gap, however the political hierarchy is vastly different.

So when you say… do not take things away from others… what exactly is being taken?

Let’s use the lore as a basis of what night elves have, and we have indications of this in game too, but also in the novels.

Let’s also remember the share volume of shared stuff too., Why are we suddenly picky about night elves not having things - the lore says they do have, but

Finally - me, I am a high elf/blood elf race fan, and a night elf one, and I don’t get this. I am all for

644

No - the actual wording was “Their use of primal magic.” That wasn’t clear on what sort of magic it was. “Primal” could easily sound like Shamanistic type magic. It wasn’t clear, whatsoever.

Their is no evidence of that. This is baseless speculation.

This is problematic, because the blood elves don’t owe the night elves anything of the sort. The Night Elves exiled them and then let in the Shen’dralar, despite still upholding the sin’dorei exile.

They owe their high elf ancestors who managed to escape the night elf society and forged their own destiny.

645

Same, and quite a few of us, actually originally most night elf fans were, they’ve either left the game or just gone ot other races, fed up, disgusted or just tired of no development. When it’s mostly the horde that is developed, what choice do they have?

Suramar and the nightborne are further evidence how popular the arcane side off the night elves are, but the faction rivalry in players exposes itself, when the horde blood elf fans often come demanding that if you want those things you need to play horde.

They used that argument for blood elves , when alliance fans were asking for high elves but don’t realise that, this is a different situation, blood elves were introduced into wow as horde, but night elves were introduced as alliance, . so expecting half the night elves ’ racial span to be o the horde is rubbish - what other race splits it’s racial identity giving one half on each faction? it’s not what allied races are for. Nightborne are not meant to replace night elf mages, or night elf Highborne [originally they were going to be all wiped out and the Nightfallen regain their night elven appearance from the Arcan’dor], nor do Nightborne “steal” night elven civilization, the civilization is still night elven and nightborne have it also because they are night elven stock… just like Lightforged Draenei have Eredar identity and the light enhancements and other racial parts from Draenei, they are just a community of night elves with a story of their own. Same with Highmountain, same with Lightforged and basically all the allied races. And yes they are given slightly different appearances, but not all of them necessarily have it. Look at Kul’tiran s, yes the ones you play are big, but that’s not all Kul’tirans, same with nightborne, they are skinnier because they starved, but not all their ears have tips that curve upwards, look at Elisande and Aluriel, and some of them in the cinematics, and all the nightborne females had their night elf ears in beta, it’s the males that had the upturned tips.

And yet, some will tell you that this is not for night elves, it’s the horde’s only -

The solution is in the portrayal. the lore has it right, the in-game portrayal is what is messed up.

none of the really good stuff for the night elves is show in in game on the alliance side. And Until legion I would have said the very best of the night elves was not visible in game. But you would read about it in the novels.

Druidism is not supposed to be some devolved state, it is supposed to be the balancing half of the arcane. the pure nature to the highly advanced civilization, the humility to the pride, the natural beauty tot he artificial, the primal to the nuovo. And it is is supposed to be part of a whole, not the whole thing. It makes no sense for purple elves with silver eyes, (all arcane things) born from an arcane well, with an arcane essence to only be nature orientated… but then off course they are not, they are arcane and nature, but you don’t see it in game anywhere near as much as you read it.

The druids are supposed to be former Highborne and Moonguard males (mostly), joining Malfurion after the sundering because they decided to stop using the arcane for spells to stop the legion returning , some of which have a natural calling to nature, but not all. They’ve been helping Ysera guide the evolution of the world, they may seem primitive, but they are anything but. And this is the only reason why most of those night elves have lived without the arcnae, it’s not because this is somehow the only state or place of them - but players not aware of the lore, or reading the books, just see forests only and ruins mostly and thing … ah…these are the nature elves - most of those players don’t paly night elves, they paly other races, and only experience night elves form what non-night elf races would do.

This is not easy to capture in game - because most players just see living in barrow dens as living in caves, and living forests as something that is primitive, and have no idea the distinction between the night elf druid and a primitive race… because the game doesn’t show all the other great things about the night elves.

Like the advanced civilization, and the powerful arcane magics, and the great knowledge they have - as we see no ne of it translates to awesome and really cool victories against much younger races with a fraction of their knowledge and experience.

If you could see night elves living in Suramar like they once did, and then you went to visit druids in the forests, and found out actually those druids are the most respected of all the high flying mage yes, and many of once lived in the cities, you won’t think of them as primitives. but rather like modern day monks and naturists who are highly educated, university degrees, doctrates, that are studying nature and living within it purely.

the problem is when that’s all they show of night elves, that all you see are ruins and forests, and you don’t see powerful mages, cities like they have in their lore or powerful sentinels etc.

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646

So, in that respect - Void Elves shouldn’t be here to take away the old Blood Elf Shadow/Void stuff that was apart of Quel’Thalas and the Sunfury.

No. It was a time when Blizzard wanted to expand Highborne lore…it wasn’t through demand, far from it.

Blizzard will take characters and groups and develop their lore when they want to. I remember a young man at Blizzcon asked about Tyrande’s lore back in 2013 and Chris Metzen was very open and said, “We just haven’t got to her yet.”

EDIT:
In fact, at the time of Legion’s announcement, Blizzard spent more time talking about the Illidari than they did about the Broken Isles.

647

what did you expect from a Barbie girl dev team ?

:slight_smile:

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648

These are what you saw done in Suramar, Suramar was a city with the full night elf architecture but upgraded to what you saw.

Compare the ruins of Zin’Azshari in Azshara zone versus those in Naz’jatar - to get an example of what I mean.

Structures like the Temples of hte moon etc all got upgrades both for pristine and ruined versions, as well as the rural architecture you e in villages like Auberdine, Astrannar and Feathermoon Stronghold (including Aldrassil in shadowglen), you saw upgrades for those in Val’sharah.

This off course is night elf architecture, what I am disappointed is the lack of hte more impressive night elf architecture we saw in legion, evidenced in Suramar,the Cathedral of Etenral Night, Warden Vault, Black Rook Hold and Moonguard stronghold - these were all unique buildings nad have signnificant and historical importance to the night elf lore for anyone who knows it.

Those who think that Suramar is some new thing that is only related to Nightborne and has nothign to do with the Night elves are off course quite ignorant of their lore.

Night Elves, like all the major races in wow and most smaller races have both a rural architecutre style and one for cities as well as unique buildings for iimportnant lore areas.

And like a lot orfr aces, such as Draenei fro TBC to Warlods, humans and orcs (every few expansions) , Forsaken from classic to Cata- night elves also got an architectural upgrade in Legion which is why all the rural buldings, the ruins buildings and the pristine buildgins got upgrades -

Compare the Palace of Zin’Azshari for example in the instnace Well of Eternity, vs what you see in Warbringers Azshara in in Naz’jatar for Zin’Azshari - upgraded.

So when it comes ot Bel’Ameth and a night elf capital city, we expected what was in Darnsuss to be fully upgraded to the night elves original city of Suramar - if not quite the scale but similar spelndour.

they must decide whethe rit’s arrural setting or not. if r night elf forests are typically rural, they won’t have man y buildgins, because the ngiht elf philsophyfor forests is guided by durids who get their vision from the EMerald dream, full natural undistrubed byy snetient beings with thier houses. so the forests are typically not full of small towns , villages or manors l ike it is for humans - this is why it maeks sense that ngiht elves alwyas supported big cities for population centres so the forests would be largely undisturbed… and this is not new in the long vigil, this is a pre-sundering mindset, and an original kaldorie mindset.

Elves need cities, poeple need places to live and they devleop… this is what the night elves have alwyas doen. this was put on pause during the long vigil - not abandoned, not becuase night elves hate civilziaiton or have outgrown it, but because the Long Vigil was amilitary campaign , a long mission to protect hte world from the evil they the night elves brought.

So they abandoned restorring thier lives and re-developing and were constnatnly on the hunt for demons (kaldorie) or if part of the druid crowd, were busy working with the green flight and the Cenarians in the forest an d wilds, restoring much of the devastation.

So this is why post long vigil, when the legion returns, and hence no need to watch, or hunt endlessly for them or stopping people from calling them by using magic, night elves move out of isolation and start developing again. It makes sense for Darnassus to be built, for Eldre’thalas to be restored, as well as Night elves to welcome those they exiled from themselves for refusing to stop using magic (like the Shen’dralar) for that particular group of night elves we play with in WC3 to start training in arcane magic, which they still retain all the talent and innate affinity for… so those whose calling is the arcane can now use.

Failing to see this properly represented in game is what is troubling. I know they did a few things with the Shen’dralar, the night elf mages doing portals or fighting in assaults, you see them, but you don’t see them in the capacity the lore describes, them, this is the same for the sentinels and druids to, they all seem so weak and lacklustre relatively speaking where they should be epic… this is another beef.

You also don’t see the powerful and great style of their urban habitation only the ruins. Well we see Suramar, but it does nothing to inform people if night elves are not seen to live in places like that. And off course you cheat fans who have long desired the night elves stuff fin books to be seen in game from that, and worse when you give the only version of it to the horde.

This increases the dissatisfaction and desire for them to give the night elves their own, so giving a replacement Teldrassil without a replacement Darnassus, is disappointing, for all the beauty and wonder in Amirdrassil.

And for people like Ereviae who come on topics like this , saying night elves shouldn’t have cities or great cities or nice cities like Suramar only forests- well I mean, a Belf fan. - figures , and off course he has no intention of playing night elves who’ve largely been in forests and ruins - so him asking for them to stay there, and in places like that clearly shows they wish no improvement and no development for the race.

You have to remember, a fair few the fans of this race have read the books or Chronicles/Pedia entries, and know the lore and have expectations. and most players of this gmae, live in cities, cities are an important part of visualising a race, you can’t give the night elves settlements, when their lore boasts of cities. It is regression

649

I am saying that those who

Blood elves don’t lose the expertise they gain - however neiteher in the lore of the blood elves or high elves has the void been a big thing.

And the fel that was gained during the time with Illidan? Well that continues on in the Illidari representation which blood elves feature nearly as heavily as night elves and in the blood elf warlocks.

i.e. not the same.

Where is the display of kaldorei arcnae mastery so greatly told in the lore and novels - in game? We see nothing, why is the only kaldorei city in the sub-race group, why doens’t the main group have one?

For those who say the

Nah, Ngiht elves are marked by change… and there are more than one night elven communtiies.

You forget why druidism dominates the main playable community and you forget it isn’t he only community.

  1. Druidism is dominant because the arcane had to be suprressed, night elves don’t have to suppress the arcane any more, things will change.
  2. You forgot that icvilization and the arcane are ingrained naturally in the night elves, and their society was dominated bythis and it changed - but those night elves more importantly were willing to change it. Other night elves did not change from that and they’re still around too. Furthermore yet other nighte lves embraced the fel to destoryt he demons with their own power.
  3. You don’t factor in the disporportionate presentation in game versus lore. you speak of dominant druidism but ignore the lore stated dominant Elunism. It is Elunism that dominates the night elven culture of the main group, whose culture was only druidic primarily because arcane couldn’t be used (in order to keep the Legion away from Azeroth) and the Watch meant little or no desire or time to live again.

Those northern night elves call it the long vigil - at last our vigil is over… what do you think this means? It means they can go back to their lives or at least restart it - and at last with the legion’s destruction forgive themselves enough to continue living. Remember this is what Darth’remar wanted them to do 7,000 years ago, because that group refused, , they got exiled, they turned into high elves and started their own version of elven society - and it’s not kaldorei, it’s not nocturnal, it was different, it was less in scope, but they hoped to exceed and supercede it. What they started was better than the state of kaldorei civilization during the Legion invasion period.

the game isn’t showing the proportionate weight and value of what Elune, the arcane and demon hunter have on the night elf story - and this is not because the game is somehow more accurate than the lore, it’s because the in-game development was skewed heavily towards the horde, so the night elves got mostly ignored, and unloved, with only short patches and bursts.

Racial stories in classic were not continued, we have developer interviews telling us they were planned, but wow’s success changed a lot of things, and they went with pushing more raids, and then the expansion switching focus to developing the horde… otherwise we would have seen greater night elven development, and wouldn’t have had to wait till cataclysm remake then Legion to see better visualisations.

650

But it became a relative practice amongst those of the Quel’Thalas Blood Elves, using void and shadow magic to dominate the minds of those who speak out against Lor’themar and then we have the Sunfury, who also returned to Quel’Thalas society.

So therefore, the returned Sunfury void knowledge shouldn’t be thrown out for the Blood Elves. Void Elves just give a slice of an old high elf mage traitor; whereas Blood Elves continue with the Sunfury knowledge of the Void.

Blood Elves have their own branch of Shadow Priests called “Dusk Priests” which I think are far more interesting than Void Elves myself. (I hate void elves anyway, so I will admit that I am always biased again them.) Void Elves are just void infused elves, whereas Blood Elf Shadow Priests are able to control the Void and not become corrupted and infused with it.

The main playable community are all that matters.

Time and time again; we are shown this. What have the legends that were the Shado-Pan done since MoP as an independent faction? Nothing; because they were neutral and made irrelevant the moment we left Pandaria.

The Court of Farondis is irrelevant the moment we left the Broken Isles and went to Argus. All neutral factions were irrelevant. Hell, even the Ebon Blade Knights were irrelevant until Legion and even then, they held the same relevance as the other classes…then Shadowlands came, where the Ebon Blade had a slightly bigger presence.

651

More…

Tbh, the only part of it that was nice was how lovely Amirdrassil looks. It’s beautiful… the zone I mean.

  1. Didn’t like that Tyrande was suddenly also nature queen. She’s a priestess of an arcane, divine/void powered goddess… I would have liked to see her come in that capacity alongside her husband who woudl do the majority heavy lifting.

  2. Also didn’t like the absentee Moon Priestesses, Highborne, Demon Hunters, Moonguard , Farondis - if youw ant to make tihis somehtign all the ngihte lf people are helping out we shoudl have seen them all contributing in their own way.

  • tired of seeing Moon priesetess without moon/star arcane powers - i mean shooting a bow is a sentinel level capcity, you mean WC3 is the only time they were calling down stars, and only the ghosts use their Eluen arcaen powers?
  1. Didn’t like how lillian Voss , the forsaken was in there, if you are going to invovle the horde races that murdered your people, then there needed to be much bigger reparation efforst. I woudl have seen the Nightborne send an army , to renew bonds of friendship and help the head of the Order and an important key to Azeroth’s health. I woudl have seen the blood elves show up to, and hte forskaen led by Light empowered Calia with lillian, saying look, last time some of.

It woudl have made all the other leaders that showed up at the end, and the neutrality of Amirdrassil a lot more palatable.

Then off course the first 3 points:#

  1. No city - that sucks, with Priests needing temples, Highborne and Ancients of wind/lore around - the kaldorei have the expertise, knowledge and power to rebuild a capital city. a nation needs it, and off course we wanna see that side of the kaldorei on the very playable kaldorei themselves, not just the Nightborne

  2. No empowerments - the aspects get empowered and rewarded, but the night elves do not - 10,000 years of vigil, countless sacrifice, given themselves to get this tree to bless Azeroth. No Immortality, no boosts to things like immunity to non-magical disease/poisons or natural elements.

  3. No incredible displays of power at all - lamest victory ever, it seemed everyone lese did the work for the night elves, including the aspects, then no show of power or strength either as no lands are reclaimed, no impressive battles fought and won., it’s part of a larger zone with no idea if the night elves will have access to any of their other lands and territories in both Kalimdor and the Broken Isles.

652

No, the holdings on Kalimdor are still there.

Portals networks are set up to Feralas, Val’Sharah, Darkshore and Hyjal.

No longer important. They are their own neutral faction and have no bearing on current night elf society.

653

You’re missing the point. Nightborne aren’t replacements for night elven mages or kaldorei civilization, nor is night elves having their stuff on their faction stealing away from nightborne or blood elves - that isn’t how it should be viewed, and if you view it hat way, it’ will be nightborne stealing away from night elves.

But that’s like saying void elves are stealing from blood elves. It makes no sense - the lore already establishes a hierarchy for the arcane and magecraft, and night elves have a prominent and popular role.

Them displaying it to great extents is not stealing form anyone it is establishing what they are written to have.

Blood elves do not have monopoly on elven magic, by a long shot, not according to the lore, nor should they, however they do have space in the arcane to make something predominantly their own. Arcane constructs isn’t one of them, because this is already been established as a thing form the kaldorei. There are other things - like more of the phoenix mages, and the blood mages to use , just like night elves have their own star/moon arcane magic wing, however it’s the arcane the vast majority of it will be shared, because it mostly comes form the night elves, 10% of the night elves knowledge made it to the high elves and the high elves hared a lot of that with the humans… same root.

You can focus on other aspects to say this is the blood elves’ - I won’t say night elves should have phoenix mages and blood mages or void mages, because those are the special domains of the blood elves and void elves - they can have some of them, I guess, but I’d be looking to the blood elves for that fantasy, same with chronomancy, I woudl be looking to the Nightborne for that fantasy, but pure arcane -? No one can be said the night elves are "stealing " from them, because they are the origin race of the discipline on Azeroth.

Again missing the point. When you play night elf, you can play from any of the available night elven groups. The player character is not exclusively a Darnassian from the Hyjallian group. Blizzard have said this outright, You can play as a Shen’dralar mage, or a Moonguard, and when you play a DK night elf, you are not part of the Darnassian faction , nor are you if you play a demon hunter… however your character can become part of it if you choose, because in the game progression Amirdrasil shows that some demon hunters, DKs and Dark Rangers have now returned to hanging out with the main group.

So you then have to look at it, that the main group is allying and accepting people from all the other splinter groups, whether it’s a full alliance like the Shen’dralar faction or ait’s opening up to individuals form the Ebon Blade, the Illidari , the cenarion Circle and others, as long as they are night elven.

And because they are night elven, you cannot assume the druid community is the only face of it, nor the priest community… because the night elf main community now has a Highborne face, a druid face, a priest order face, and now it seems to be getting an Ilidari face and a dark ranger face - making it now generally representing all the facets of the night elven factions.

What does this mean? It means they are all relevant - when you speak of night elves you have to remember it’s not just the druid and priest communities. And it never has been.

Tell that to the Starlance twins whose parents are amongst them, or to the Priestess of Elune who’s girlfriend is one of them, or the or mages who do the portals for the alliance in Stormwind to the crumbling Palace.

654

Best Highborne faction to date, blizzard woudl be crazy silly to leave these ones in the dust. They embody what the Highborne were originally before addiction and hubris soured their attitudes. And they are the only Highborne faction that is blameless in terms of actions against the Azshara and the legion - they woudl be the most respected to, and one that all the Darnassian branches would both respect and accept leadership from.

Also Prince Farondis was imo, the best new character in Legion. With such detail, they need to have this guy there.

If I were blizzard I woudl restore Farondis, and have him lead the civil society of the kaldorei wherever their capital ends up, Tyrande the high Priestess leader, Malfurion the druid leader, Illidan the Illidari leader, and it would be kinda awesome if we got Ravencrest back to be the DK/Dark Ranger leader. Maieve the Warden leader, Shandris the Sentinel leader, Mordant the Highborne leader, Lothrius the Moonguard leader and Jarod the army leader.

That would be the Night elf leadership.

655

All irrelevant. Kirin Tor, Broken Isles assigned character, created just for 1 small arc, which wasn’t part of the main questline anyway.

You can roleplay however you want and that applies to everything.

I can roleplay this character as an Elite Sunfury Blood Elf Ranger, who shot down more Night Elf Watchers than she cares to remember - doesn’t take away from the fact that you start out at a novice ranger or magister, as per the actual quest text from the first quest npcs.

It is one of them.

Arcane Golem do not appear on any lore pages for Night Elves. You need to accept that or your simply denying common lore. Arcane Golems are a pure Thalassian thing, and primarily a creation of the Blood Elves. You don’t like it because it’s a pure arcane thing and not a fire magic thing…and you’ve now got it into your head that all things purely of Arcane are just for Night Elves. It’s not.

Stop this nonsense headcanon and Learn2Lore about the race your waffling on about.

It seems I know more about Night Elves than you do because everything you’ve said is pure headcanon.
Some people might buy into your emotional manipulating victimhood comments, but I won’t let you get away with that. You are denying lore which is not acceptable, just because you want night elf mages to made more visible when Blizzard already are doing that in Bel’Ameth…but it’s to night elf standards, not Azeroth standards, which again - makes sense.

Shen’dralar are NOT a nation, anymore. They are a tiny faction of Highborne, with unique mage-craft traits. Arcane Golems is simply not one of those traits.
https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Arcane_golem

I suggest you read up on this (and perhaps refresh your knowledge on Shen’dralar lore), because I do know what I’m talking about and as you can see, night elves don’t factor into arcane golems and arcane golems don’t factor in to night elves. Darnassus, Bel’Ameth, Zin-Azshari, Suramar nor Eldre’Thalas are considered capitals for Arcane Golems.

Blood Elf Shadow Magic is still within the lore, as per the Dusk Priests of Quel’Thalas. Velfs are quite boring to be honest. So, back to your point about all the allied races - it’s not right for Velfs to take away and nor should it even be the case that the Shadow Magic of the Sin’dorei is removed because of Velfs.

EDIT:
I don’t do victimhood obsessed people.

656

Do you actually need me to link the picture of the Arcane construct in Azshara and Suramar?

Night elves do arcane constructs, they just don’t do blood golems

657

Arcane Construct that failed. Blew up. Blew up it’s own makers. Then, never seen again

And Suramar is irrelevant because the Construct their was only recently built by Elisande Loyalists.

The actual “race” for Arcane Constructs is “Arcane Golem.” And Arcane Golems as a whole, are not part of night elf society. They never have been, as per the lore page for them.
Lor’themar of Silvermoon and Khadgar of the Kirin Tor are the “leaders” of the Arcane Golems. Tyrande, Mordent, Azshara, Elisande and Thalyssra are not counted as “leaders for the Arcane Golems” because they’re all none factors to that part of the lore.

Arcane Golems are a primarily Blood Elf thing, with a bit of High Elf/Kirin Tor involvement. Overall, they are part of the pure Thalassian Elves (not velfs)

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They do do them though, and that one was hacked. Give her a breakk, she’d only been using the arcane for a few weeks after a 10k year break.

THe ones in Suramar were not hackable either. And those are night elven too.

You seem to forget those.

Were not discussing whether they are part of a society or not. Clearly they are part of Highborne and Nightborne society as they work as guards, just like they do in Silvermoon. the point we are making here is that night elves having them ain’t stealing off blood elves, blood elves have them because this is stuff night elves do, and they get their arcane knowledge and skills from their night elven heritage.

it’s not stealing when it’s something you already have.
There are other things and areas in the arcane that are already exclusively blood elven, Arcane constructs aren’t one of them. Look even Medivh has them in Karazhan.

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I do forget them because they are irrelevant.

One failed and blew everyone up, the other was made hastily by Elisande Loyalists.

Their is no evidence that Arcane Golems come from the highborne empire. Azshara is not listed as one of their former rulers.

I mean, we’re talking a lot of headcanon here. You wanted to dismiss the Shen’dralar lethargy and I proved you wrong. Now, High Elf/Blood Elf creations where they are the most powerful in Azeroth, is also not high elven or blood elven, despite the lore pointing to them.

Let me link you (again) the arcane golem lore.

https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Arcane_Guardian

First line:
Arcane golems are hulking, magically-powered robotic constructs found mainly in blood elf territories. They act as peacekeepers, defenders, and sometimes public announcers. The golems returned to prominence in Silvermoon some years after

First Line of their history:
https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Arcane_golem#History
Empowered by the Magisters, the arcane guardians serve the leadership of Quel’Thalas as sentries, peacekeepers, and tools of propaganda. Found mainly in the blood elven capital, Silvermoon City, they patrol it with fervor and serve as the city’s elite guard force while supplementing the Silvermoon City Guardians in their duties. They will periodically announce words of encouragement, sing praises to the blood elven regent Lor’themar Theron, urge the people of Silvermoon to remain strong in the wake of Kael’thas Sunstrider betrayal, and remind the citizens of Quel’Thalas to remain law-abiding.

These are, primarily in and created by Blood Elves; however the High Elves also used them.
Void Elves and Night Elves don’t use them and never have as far as we know; neither Umbric nor Mordent nor Azshara are stated as “Former Leaders” unlike Kael’thas.
The Nightborne Elisande Loyalists used them, hastily and they were easily removed. They haven’t been seen or used since.

You have no evidence that these Thalassian Creations go back to the highborne empire, least of all the Shen’dralar, whom we know don’t use them.

Don’t reply with “I feel that…” because I don’t care for feelings. I care about direct facts.

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Waht are you going on about, you didn’t prove anything.

You are claiming that arcane golems are a blood elf thing, but the night elves using them shows you they are not, it’s that simple.

There are other arcane related things that blood elves have and night elves do not. It’s not hard.

I mean you see the constructs in Suramar and in Azshara used by night elves, what more evidence do you want that they are not restricted to blood elves?

and FYI, everyone overcoming addiction experienced lethargy, all night elves did after the loss of the first well of eternity. If you read your novels.

The only headcanon here is thinking blood elves have some exclusive ownership to arcane golems when it is quite evident they do not.

That doesn’t mean they don’t have them, as both Suramar and the Azshara quest shows. You and i know very well by now, blizzard tends to show things in part, when they come back for a much more in depth portrayal they reveal a lot more.

But in this case, no assumption is necessary, they are seen in game = they are not exclusive to blood elves. And I woudl also say that j ust because you don’t see void elves and the high elves with them use them currently doesn’t mean that they only exist for blood elves.

Currently, blood elves have all the Thalassian assets that we know of, and we haven’t seen the development of the void elves portrayed in game, to assume they haven’t when they are capable of, and say that only blood elves can and do, is not a sensible assumption.

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It’s not headcanon. What’s headcanon is you thinking everything that starts with “arcane” is somehow night elf property. Your deluded if you think that.

And you clearly don’t know the lore for the night elves, if you think don’t believe in it being purposely stated that the Shen’dralar grew lethargic. The Shen’dralar Ancient herself, tells you that they grew lethargic. Now, who am I inclined to believe? A night elf fanatic who must spread lies and delusions that anything that starts with “arcane” is night elf property or Blizzard…? I’ll go with Blizzard.

I’ll also go with Blizzard when they say that the Shen’dralar needed saving from said, lethargy and this is where the Immol’thar came in.

Blown up and only used by Elisande Loyalists

Arcane Golems are a Thalassian Elf creation and only those pure Thalassian Elves, High Elves and Blood Elves, primarily used them. Their is no lore, beyond that of the Quel’Thalas Magisters, that tells us they were used by highborne or Azshara. If they were - the lore pages would tell us that Azshara and Elisande were also counted as former leaders. Shen’dralar lore doesn’t mention Arcane Golems, once…not once…not even a throw away part of lore (Azshara quests.)

I mean your the sort of night elf victim that would go as far to claim that Mana Bombs were actually made the night elves, when the lore tells us they are a blood elf creation. You’ve deluded yourself into believing anything that is “Mage” must belong to the night elves! “It must belong to us or REEEEEEEE!!!”

Learn2Lore, because your knowledge on Night Elves, Blood Elves, Shen’dralar, Mages and the Arcane is extremely lacking.

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https://youtu.be/gslAG2OEO1c?t=64 ← i miss when blizzard were men.