Really debatable? Im one of the few people here who take you seriously so try to take me seriously too. BFA is biggest pvp disaster in blizzard history. Only diablo 3 is close because they dont even put pvp into game like the were promising.
7 Likes
Not rly debatable. I got 2.4 three times this addon and never used more than 3 items from pvp.
Healers have to play voodoo totem since season 1.
Do you know how we won rmp? I stacked versa from pve gear with versa corruptions from pve with versa procs from pve azerite items so i could use a pve melee trinket as a healer (kek) to let rogues explode at 2.5k MMR.
Edit: i forgot to mention the 11 sockets from pve which gave versa equal to one extra ring.
11 Likes
The player base says otherwise. You’ll find a lot of people who take PvP seriously don’t give a monkeys about PvE, and vice versa.
The best thing they can do is give back resilience/PvP power, and put a base PvP ilevel in PvP, so freshly dinged/new players don’t get slaughtered.
1 Like
They tried so many new things for PvP already, in WoD the gear scaling (which was kind of good), the Templates in legion (which were horrible) and the scaling we have now (which is even more garbage).
I think it is time they are doing something that worked in the past for 95% of players without trying to re-invent the wheel.
My experience was that PvE players just don’t want to PvP much or at all, not even when they literally have a benefit over most PvP players.
if we would have every stat combinations on the vendor in SL the dragonslaysers would 100% complain about feeling ‘‘forced to do PvP’’ in order to be optimal.
there is only really two ways of handling this: either ilvl scaling how it was in WoD or just PvP stats like resilience or PvP power.
4 Likes
As much as Id like to have a pvp specific stat, I dont see it coming back. The reason was mentioned somwhere above. They want you to be able to play all contents with the gear from all contents.
Just adding all stats to the vendor will make the PvE-Community feel forced to pvp because you can aim for the correct items instead of hoping for RNG drops in Dungeons or Raids.
Setting PvP-Items from the Vendor on a higher iLvL in PvP-Content seems to be a more likely solution.
Would help but unfortunately this would still enable the use of pve set bonuses, trinkets and effects (legendarys).
Some kind of must have set bonus from the pvp gear is also needed - or disable pve effects.
Yeah, but when you continuously keep dumping on your players, and changing things that worked, the general subscriber count is gonna fall.
Can be, but it’s a very loose metric to see that whatever they were doing in the past worked for a lot of players.
1 Like
Actually Im not against Legendaries in Arenas. You will get them anyway as a PvP-Player as a part of Character progression. I like the idea to change my gear according to the situation as long as its tuned in a good way.
Any PvE related bonus or item shud either be tuned accordingly or truned off. I dont mind them beeing available in Arena as long as people having such PvE-Items are not stronker or weaker than someone without them. Another way to do that is to add a similar trinket / set bonus to pvp items which can be obtained at the vendor aswell.
No need for a PvP stat if they literally disable or cut the ilvl in half of all PvE gear in instanced rated content. There, problem solved for the OP. 
Also, designing games for people without time to play them erodes the core player audience. Which Jito is gonna bring back to the “doughnut model” concept they claim to be following, but the thing is, it isn’t a doughnut anymore when they skew it heavily towards one area of the game.
They are, seemingly intentionally, pushing PvPers to PvE against their will, while at the same time making PvP easier (as long as you’ve got the ilvl for it) which heavily favors PvEers much more than only PvPers. Especially the majority of PvPers who never achieves any high rating but is stuck in the low-middle to middle areas. So they’re seemingly wanting to reduce the meaning of rated gameplay.
At the same time, that whole “dad gamer” consumer base which everyone claims “are the only people left” in here, is also inherently a false assumption. Look at Classic and how much players have dumped hours into that. And that crap isn’t even rated!
Yet it still sees a stronger core audience than refail PvP does, and have done, for a long time now.
Who knew filling the anonymous group “finder” up with casual folk with no time to play wasn’t enough to get people to play together, eh? Minmax, bro. Minmax! It’s a thing even with the ones who can only play twice a month.
2 Likes
The problem is pretty well understood I think. Resilience meant stats were lower on pvp gear so could never be better than pve gear whilst also giving you choice. No pvp stat and the fact Blizzard don’t care if pvpers have to pve but do care if pvers have to pvp means that the solution will almost certainly screw over pvpers.
From their suggestions, adding every ver combo and putting a bonus could work. If they imo put a double trinket bonus and a set bonus that could be OK. You will still have worse gear on weapons but afaik they don’t add set bonuses to weapons generally.
Ilvl scaling just seems like something they wont do as well even though that could also be a trivial fix, but I guess would cause balance problems.
Reverse your argument and you see how everyone else feels
Blue answer quoted from mmo-champion:
We have been following the constructive feedback about the range of gear available on our PvP vendors, and we agree with the underlying concerns. While WoW is an interconnected ecosystem of different content and systems and we feel that the very strongest characters should be the ones who participate and excel in a wide range of activities, each individual progression path should offer the majority of the tools required for success in that path. The current PvP vendors fall short of that goal.
We are considering a few different solutions, such as reworking the stat coverage of the vendor gear and/or providing PvP-specific bonuses through those items. As soon as we’ve settled on a direction, we’ll share our plan for feedback, and get the changes up on Beta for testing.
Let’s hope they settle for PvP-specific bonuses. 
who says that? that was never the case until bfa.
5 Likes
Is it so bad that people get PvP vendors who offer say 190 base gear /no PvP stat/. Each peace could be obtained in some progression of BG/Arenas. After you obtain it, you can then upgrade it /benthic-like/ with the PvP currency at hand. This will allow players who want to gear only through PvP to not bother with PvE and gives you a sense of progression. That was the point of this whole post. With this system PvE players can enter arenas/BGs and not get roflstomped, because they dont have X stat /say resilience/.
I wanted to express my mind, not force my opinion onto anyone.
And I played Random Battlegrounds and Skirmish Arena throughout the expansion wearing low item level gear from PvE. And it worked fine.
So it’s not a case where the design has failed on all levels.
I’d say it’s been rather successful at the bottom end of PvP, and rather unsuccessful at the very top of PvP.
*and in the middle.
It’s more unsuccessful at the bottom end of PvP, if anything. A casual pvper has exactly 0 chance of ever acquiring gear that is semi-decent from doing casual pvp. Basically all the 0 to 1800 rating people are forced into PvE for easy gear, whether they like it or not, or otherwise face their entire playtime to consist of being completely useless in pvp while wearing the gear their pvp time provided.
6 Likes
I will be honest like the majority here. I dont care for casual pvp. This is not considered end game content.
How do you even measure whats an okisch performance in casual pvp? The poeple in the general forum ask me why i need 5 gear sets, why i need specific stats. They dont understand and they dont care about min max. They are satisfied with purple pants no matter the stats.
Blizz should stop to cater for casuals.
Pvp stats would even help them. No casual will get mythic plus gear or raid gear. Give them resilence and they are save to go.
3 Likes
There is already a pvp specific stat, it’s called versatility. Most people already have different sets of gear from pvp and pve. BiS gear for pve should come from pvp, a raider doesn’t have to do arenas all the time to get BiS gear.
Well, Jito probably meant that “if your only goal is to play at the bottom, then you won’t care for success rate or rewards because you’ll be happy with just having played at all”. Basically, why would you need gear at the bottom of the unrated totem pole if you never intend to go beyond that to begin with? xD
But yeah, you definitely won’t be stomping anyone to the ground in PvP like that, that’s for sure.
So if you want to achieve anything in PvP, even in the middle (not just the “very top” like Jito claims), then you definitely get pushed towards PvE a hell of a lot more than to PvP.