No, we don't want RDF! We really don't want that 🤯

[Nikkyblond-firemaw]

Exactly, the arguments you dont understand and therefor dont pay any attention to them.

[Nikkyblond-firemaw]

You have real life proof of it. You just never noticed because you have been playing Pservers your entire WoW career.

[Bizmark-gehennas]

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

Which ones? The 85% more people that liked my post than the OP? You have to be delusional if you think people are mostly in favour of this change.

Link me something real. All these words and claims, and it’s all hot air. You’ve got zero evidence and, apparently, not even a level 70 character.

[Urbngtrld-mirage-raceway]

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

You have to be delusional if you think people are mostly in favour of this change.

And what change is that? You KNOW for a FACT that it is not a change but still you call it a change. I would call THAT delusional.

It’s actually the definition of that word:
“believing things that are not true”

I can show you right here and right now that it is not a change:

https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_3.3.0
Cross-Realm Dungeon Finder
The Dungeon Finder is now available

As you can see CROSS-REALM RDF was added in patch 3.3.0. So nothing have changed. Calling this demonstrable NON-CHANGE a change is by definition delusional.

[Dottie-thunderhorn (Dottie)]

I want RDF (Random Dungeon Finder), come at me bro!

[Scarekraaw-mograine]

@Triva-theradras

In the end it comes down to one question: who is the target audience? Is it the vanilla fans that are fed up with vanilla, or the wotlk fans, that the expansion was designed for originally?

Very true, like I’ve said before.

If we use Blizzards “design pillars” as a guideline (which is the “blueprint” to how they are thinking when implementing changes or adjustments), it perhaps becomes a bit more clear which people are the target audiance and which are not.
However, the people who arent that audiance then calls Blizzard out for being “crazy” or “out of touch” and here we have this thread where people want Classic to be whatever fits them, not how Blizzard had a vision it would be.

“You are wrong becuase you like this”
“But Blizzard apperently also agrees since they are changing it”
“Well then Blizzard are wrong aswell”

Reminds me of a joke.
A man drives down the highway when the radio announcement says: “Warning everybody on Highway X, a car is driving in the wrong direction!”.
The man looks concerned and says to himself “One car? There are hundreds!”

[Djansoul-chogall]

@Nikkyblond-firemaw

You have real life proof of it. You just never noticed because you have been playing Pservers WOTLK your entire WoW career.

And that’s why i know the reality while you don’t.

[Bigbazz-tarren-mill (Bigbazz)]

How is it not a change to remove a feature and replace it with another feature? They aren’t planning on adding LFD with ICC, they are planning to leave it out and replace it with an update to the LFG tool, something like retail has for M+.

This is a big change.

[Bigbazz-tarren-mill (Bigbazz)]

Nothing is ever enough for you? Every bit of evidence that has been pointed out that shows players are against this and you say “yeah show me something real bro”… Sitting there with your eyes closed and your hands over your ears shouting “la la la la la I’m not listening” is not changing the reality for you here.

If you choose not to accept it then fine, but it doesn’t change anything and you having these opinions does not sway the situation one way or another.

[Djansoul-chogall]

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

How is it not a change to remove a feature and replace it with another feature? They aren’t planning on adding LFD with ICC, they are planning to leave it out and replace it with an update to the LFG tool, something like retail has for M+.

This is a big change.

And apparently a big bad change if we read some post on the US forum, the LFG tools is not exactly from retail and pretty bad.

[Bizmark-gehennas]

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

Every bit of evidence that has been pointed out that shows players are against this and you say "yeah show me something real bro

You’ve posted zero, 0, nil, nada, none, neit, NOTHING that constitutes evidence.

Are you going for the Flat-Earther approach? just speak a lot and hope people listen? Never actually backup claims with evidence.

Dude, literally just go back to whatever you were doing before WOTLK was announced. I think everyone, you included, will be happier.

[Bigbazz-tarren-mill (Bigbazz)]

@Bizmark-gehennas

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

Every bit of evidence that has been pointed out that shows players are against this and you say "yeah show me something real bro

Dude, literally just go back to whatever you were doing before WOTLK was announced. I think everyone, you included, will be happier.

Yeah stop having opinions on the internet, that’s some advice you could do with following too! And lol at the “flat earther” comparison while you sit there in imagination land pretending you can’t see or hear anything going on around you.

[Bizmark-gehennas]

@Bigbazz-tarren-mill

Blah blah blah

Yet another post with no evidence in sight. Just attacking the person, not the position.

Evidence. Go. I’m open to discussion. Show me something we can discuss.

[Krutoj-lakeshire]

@Scarekraaw-mograine

Very true, like I’ve said before.

If we use Blizzards “design pillars” as a guideline (which is the “blueprint” to how they are thinking when implementing changes or adjustments), it perhaps becomes a bit more clear which people are the target audiance and which are not.
However, the people who arent that audiance then calls Blizzard out for being “crazy” or “out of touch” and here we have this thread where people want Classic to be whatever fits them, not how Blizzard had a vision it would be.

“You are wrong becuase you like this”
“But Blizzard apperently also agrees since they are changing it”
“Well then Blizzard are wrong aswell”

Reminds me of a joke.
A man drives down the highway when the radio announcement says: “Warning everybody on Highway X, a car is driving in the wrong direction!”.
The man looks concerned and says to himself “One car? There are hundreds!”

Then they should have made it clear from the beginning from WoW Classic, where they want to go for it. I wouldn’t have put any time or money in WoW Classic then.
The problem is, the design pillars of Blizzard are just some lazy PR excuse, for not adding the RDF for whatever the real reason is. Maybe it’s to earn more from boosts and realm transfers or because they have technical problems and are not able to implement the RDF.

For all of Classic Blizzard made decisions based on how to maximize profit. That’s why they never told us any long term plans. And that’s why they never tell us about big chages in advance. It’s because they don’t have a plan.
So we just show them, that there are paying customers, that are not happy with the way TBCC was and will not keep paying for the game unless Blizzard solves those problems.

Ultimately the decision is up to Blizzard. So they will go with what ever they think will earn the most money. If at some point they notice the subs will drop, they will be very eager to implement the RDF and will completely forget about any design pillars.

I personally think they will go on with their wayward and release WotLK Classic without RDF. And it will be very successful in the beginning, because unfortunately only a fraction of the people complaining about no RDF will really quit the game.
But at some point the same problems as in TBCC will arise and a lot of people will quit their sub and other people will have a hard time running dungeons. So people will start to demand the RDF and Blizzard will deliver.

Unfortunately at that point it’s already too late for me. Because if I’m not in from the start, I’m not in at all.

[Jazem-firemaw]

@Bizmark-gehennas

Evidence.

Yes, please show me your proof.

[Bizmark-gehennas]

I’m not claiming to have evidence, but everyone who’s for RDF seems to think they’re a majority. Show me.

[Scarekraaw-mograine]

@Krutoj-lakeshire

Then they should have made it clear from the beginning from WoW Classic

Like in the threads where they, Blizzard, have a PowerPoint saying “No Dungeon Finder”?

On the other hand you can feel free to show me a source where they ever said they would follow the content and mechanics 1:1 - If you want to hold that against them. As far as I know, they havent promised that ever (nore have they shown that intent).

You stepped on a bus that said “Station”. Then as it passed the Station you now claim “This buss used to drive to Down-Town” and it should do it again, even tho the bus company said that they are trying to avoid going down the road that crashed their previous bus - even specifically early during the trip saying “No Down-Town” to peoples cheers onboard.

[Triva-theradras]

@Bizmark-gehennas

I’m not claiming to have evidence, but everyone who’s for RDF seems to think they’re a majority. Show me.

The only numbers we have are polls like these:
strawpoll. com/polls/jVyGJaER1Z7 (posted on wowhead/mmo-champion/official forums)

Feel free to google for other polls. I have yet to see any other outcome that would favor not adding RDF. Not adding RDF in wotlk at all is a change, because it was part of the original game. Lets assume only players who care about the topic vote in polls. There is no proof that there is a majority that prefers the custom change to not add RDF at all. So why should there be a huge change like not adding an expansion defining feature, for a group of players, which have no proof of being the voice of the majority?

If you personally doubt any poll in favor of RDF, while providing nothing yourself, other than what you assume based on personal experience, there is nothing to argue about in the first place.

[Krutoj-lakeshire]

@Scarekraaw-mograine

Like in the threads where they, Blizzard, have a PowerPoint saying “No Dungeon Finder”?

Ok maybe I missed this, do you have a link for me? Because I can’t recall any long term statements from Blizzard about Classic.

@Scarekraaw-mograine

On the other hand you can feel free to show me a source where they ever said they would follow the content and mechanics 1:1 - If you want to hold that against them. As far as I know, they havent promised that ever (nore have they shown that intent).

That’s what they have been largely doing for the WoW Classic and TBC Classic. So it was only logical to assume they would keep doing this for WotLK too.

@Scarekraaw-mograine

You stepped on a bus that said “Station”. Then as it passed the Station you now claim “This buss used to drive to Down-Town” and it should do it again, even tho the bus company said that they are trying to avoid going down the road that crashed their previous bus - even specifically early during the trip saying “No Down-Town” to peoples cheers onboard.

Wait didn’t you already make such an bus argument in another threat, too or was out somebody else?
Do you work as a bus driver by chance?

But to the point you’ve made, I have to say, if the bus had station written on it from beginning, I must have missed it. As far as I know the bus hadn’t anything written on it, but it was the same bus that drove down town the last 2 days. But today it suddenly drives a different way and mid way the bus puts up the sign saying “Station”.

[Krutoj-lakeshire]

@Triva-theradras

The only numbers we have are polls like these:
strawpoll. com/polls/jVyGJaER1Z7 (posted on wowhead/mmo-champion/official forums)

Feel free to google for other polls. I have yet to see any other outcome that would favor not adding RDF. Not adding RDF in wotlk at all is a change, because it was part of the original game. Lets assume only players who care about the topic vote in polls. There is no proof that there is a majority that prefers the custom change to not add RDF at all. So why should there be a huge change like not adding an expansion defining feature, for a group of players, which have no proof of being the voice of the majority?

If you personally doubt any poll in favor of RDF, while providing nothing yourself, other than what you assume based on personal experience, there is nothing to argue about in the first place.

There is no use talking to him. He argues just to argue without having a point.

Before the WotLK announcement most people will just have expected that Blizzard will bring the RDF at some point in WotLK Classic and nobody posted on the forums about it and nobody made polls for Blizzard to exclude the RDF.
Plus those polls have been posted in most reddits and discords related to Classic. It’s delusional to say there is a majority, that direct doesn’t want the RDF and just didn’t know about the polls.

No matter how many arguments you make he will just keep making up nonsense to question your arguments.