Yea. I mean… if you queue for rdf, you know theres a % chance you will meet fresh dinged chars. But these are heroic dungeons… no way to fail them. If you dont wanna carry(uhum), then just group up with the same gs people and run it!
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I know right, carries for WotLK 5 mans is just a ludicrous notion lmao. I’ve no idea what he’s on about there.
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So what is all this whining about 4K+ GS not attending to common heroics with 200 ilvl rewards in them? Why won’t they just find people of their own ilvl?
Because the tool is made of poop and old socks.
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Adding automation without emblems for carries to be interested in using it won’t make the wonder happen. Must I remind you that in Cataclysm RDF tool was from the start, yet it failed miserably as Blizzard was forced to nerf Cata heroics to the ground level. Why? Because all the “someone would carry my green geared fresh 85” mentality and lazyness of Pro RDF crowd.
Who in the ever living hell has remotely suggested doing this?
Because they were hilariously overtuned, particularly following WotLK, the expansion that we’re currently talking about so this whataboutism is pointless.
No, its because people didnt know how to interrupt mostly. Remember the interrupt needed on healing nagas, earth elemental in stonecore… could go on. Im sure it would be different now. It was also on heroic + level kinda with the gear we had at that point.
Most people with that gs are doing h+.
Fresh dinged chars are getting rejected because of the gs gatekeeping which is fine till some point imo. But they have very little % to find heroic dungeon groups to gear up. Rdf would def fix that issue. Emblems farm would still be there. You can go heroic + for the extra emblems or heroic.
Yea you can buy stuff on the ah, but is that your so called social pillar to this game? Why even play when you can just buy?
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Not to mention that they needed a day 1 patch anyway but since Blizzard threw Cataclysm out of the door and literally went on Christmas break that manifested much later leading people to this stupid conspiracy.
I am willing to bet 4 gold 57 silver that if blizz releases cata without any changes, people will still cry about heroics …
Maybe someone will be like “oh wait but we dont have RDF” …
“The difficulty at which we pegged our heroic dungeons and raids was controversial. They were designed to be about as tough as the dungeons were back in Burning Crusade, but the game has changed since then. Coming out of Lich King, we’d gotten the message loud and clear from players that they wanted tougher challenges. They liked the convenience of Dungeon Finder, but they missed using their crowd control and survival abilities and having to strategize about how to beat a given encounter. We designed the Cataclysm heroics with that in mind, and the players who wanted challenging content were thrilled.
The problem was that we had this whole group of players who felt like they couldn’t make any progress on their characters. Even if they wanted to end up raiding with their friends, they couldn’t earn the gear they needed to get into those raids (especially in the absence of Raid Finder). I don’t believe that the instances were too hard; it’s obvious there are players who enjoy that content. I believe the problem was that there were no alternatives. With such a diverse community, the goal is to have experiences that players from all over the spectrum can enjoy. We don’t want to shut anyone out. So, we’re addressing that with Challenge Modes in Mists. You’ll have normal and heroic mode dungeons, and then Challenge Modes, for players who are looking to prove their mettle. Likewise, you’ll have normal and heroic raids, and Raid Finder for players who don’t enjoy wiping on a boss week after week until they can master it.” Ghostcrawler 2012 (source (https://web.archive.org/web/20120310022540/http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/4519250/Cataclysm_Post_Mortem_--_Greg_%E2%80%9CGhostcrawler%E2%80%9D_Street-3_7_2012)
Its not a conspiracy its a stated fact from one of the at the time highest up people in the team
Part conspiracy, part that idiotic post ya. We’ve never had content releases in WoW that hasn’t needed a day 1-patch and Cataclysm was no exception.
It didn’t manifest till a month after release though.
Dont think so. If you wanted a challenge, you queued up for rdf hc in cata at start 
. Ofcourse, there will always be whiners… look at this forum, rejecting rdf because its a social pillar. Meanwhile you get retail features and crossrealm lfg thrown at you all over the place. And thats fine?
If there will be no rdf, people would be gatekeeping it with some certain ilvl def.
Like they do now with heroic+. Same situation, same problem for the fresh dinged chars.
I mean, we been there already. Look at the raids getting farmed and cleared already. Im sure it was like that back in the day aswell. Mmh?
So kinda like H+ now that people are, yanno, posting about.
People will 100% complain about the difficulty of Cataclysm heroics if they go into the game as they originally did.
The more I think of it the funnier the whole debacle seems to me.
You see the true nature of Titan Rune Dungeons isn’t being a challenge. Their mechanics are nothing more than time wasters. Their on hit nature means that unless you’re so strong you can delete mobs instantly you’ll need to slow down as triggering to many effects at once will kill you. The only two dungeons that somewhat avoid this scheme are troll ones as Blood of Loa doesn’t trigger on hit so a tank can technically manouver larger packs without much issues. Well technically Stratholme as well considering it’s gimmick is non issue most of the time.
People gatekeep them because they don’t like wasting time and getting better geared party improves the odds of smooth run, they skip bosses when possible so less time is wasted.
There’s fine line between Difficult and Tedious and Titan Rune falls squarely on the Tedious side.
And on this note, whomever came up with mirror images … there’s a person who needs a slapping.
RDF just creates culture of leeching and dependance on carries by players geared far above dungeon requirements. This lasted all late Wrath, basically from Ulduar till late 3.3.5.
Cataclysm normalised gear like any new expansion and carry potential was limited in first weeks heroics. Yes, the heroics were made harder than Wrath ones from the start, because people carved for harder TBC-like heroics, but the problem of their completion was that RDF couldn’t form balanced groups able to do em. Besides leeches stayed being leeches and didn’t wanted to learn, even if were given advices how to progress.
And Blizzard gave up and nerfed heroics, even more they created abomination caller LFR further catering to laziest players out there creating mini hype wave every patch, but decline of playerbase in the long run as noone desired to lear or progress in the raids.
Oh lord, you’re one of those.
No, it doesn’t. And the proof is all of classic.
Rdf was launched with icc patch right?
Leeching, really? Someone with fresh gear is auto leeching? So you basically want people to buy the AH to get into heroic +? Since heroics are not run that much anymore…
Im sure you are that guy that qqs about the 100 gs difference and calling others leechers for it. You dont need to do rdf tbh, just create your manual group if you are too good for it lol. But let fresh people have a chance to actually gear up without buying the ah or participating gdkp. You know… the same way you did when the exp was fresh. Or was it their own fault to start the game so late?
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You could sleepwalk through wotlk 5mans literally since start of wotlk … wtf leeching are you talking here about, this isnt mythic, this isnt raid, hell this isnt even TBC 5mans which at least some were “difficult” …
Cataclysm dungeons were garbage designed by bunch of muppets, nothing to do with RDF …
If anything, its this stupid design that brought the “bring a player not a class … as long as that class is currently fotm” idiotic mentality that ruined retail …
Lack of RDF only created stupid gatekeeping “culture” with pathetic pve dodos flexing on others in the crappiest type of content that can exist … and we are seeing this for the whole of TBC and at least like half of vanilla classic …
Not quite right. I do not consider fresh lvl 80 obliged to start buying Ulduar BoEs, however phase 1 preraid crafted gear, enchants and gems is a must. This is where leeching starts, fresh 80 just heads to heroics in his questing blues, doesn’t learn rotations, dungeon bosses mechanics, nothing. He just feels privileged to get a carry and most of the items, because some overgeared (for that dungeon requirement) player needs emblems from daily dungeon quest rather than 200 ilvl items.
This confidense only grew stronger in 3.3.0+ as the automated RDF system took care that at least 2…3/5 group members were carries.
However heroic+ is a bit challenging if someone ignores the mechanics and you need 4/5 players to be well geared to carry 1 undergeared player. This makes run slower and noone wants to deal with delays. In normal heroics 2…3 raid geared players could steamroll the instance, no matter how bad the rest of the group were playing, but now fresh 80 have to put effort just like players in September-October 2022 did if they have no friends or guild to carry em.