Pet Project: Theism in Warcraft

Argent Dawn
101

I legitimately imagine Telaryn playing WoW from a dusty old library surrounded with worn, hardback copies of all of the Warcraft novels, manga and assorted printed works.

He then trawls through the forums, fact checking peoples comments on lore. He sees a comment that looks a bit off, and proceeds to open his trusty copy of Shadows the Horde for a citation that may prove or disprove the offending comment.

He’s also Deckard Cain in my mind for some reason.

https://www.heroesfan.cz/www/images/article-thumbnail/nxv2m8a427s3jan/default.jpg

5 Likes
102

That’s offensive.

You dare mix up Deckard Cain with an elf? >:|

103

Also in my headcanon, Aerilen is Leah. Don’t @ me.

104

@you, you terrible, terrible Tauren.

105

god i wish that were me

But instead it’s just
https://i.gyazo.com/4c53d445702a736cbacf481beb33532a.png

i’ve mastered the art of ctrl + f search for keywords

2 Likes
106

Well that’s the mystery ruined. It’s like finding out what the smoke monster from Lost was, I would rather not have known.

1 Like
107

Don’t get me wrong though, I remember (roughly) most of them by heart at this point so I know what citation to search for. I know some better than others ((shadow of the horde :heart_eyes:)))

108

Mimiron is cool.

1 Like
109

When I was a part of the Blackwind Marine Platoon guild, I remember Neptulon was a being that was at times spoken of with reverence and sometimes fear. The guild during some of its DM’d events had various run-ins with the Kvaldir, who are thought to acknowledge Neptulon as a significant force of the sea.

Neptulon is known to be worshiped by the Rockpool tribe of murlocs, who call him “father” and believe that he is the only one who truly rules the seas. He was also formerly worshiped by the Bloodwash naga before they turned their back on him and chose to worship only Queen Azshara. However, a few naga led by Skar’this the Heretic are known to still follow the Tidehunter, for which Skar’this was imprisoned. It seems that he is also worshiped by the Kvaldir, as Hagrim Hopebreaker says “Neptulon will rise and wash your kind from Azeroth!” to the Naga.

I suppose anyone who reveres the sea might think of Neptulon as worthy of worship and tribute. Perhaps there’s a small sect of Tidesages who primarily revere him as a custodian of the sea herself and worship him in conjunction with the sea.

110

Shadows of the Horde is a fantastic story, if you disagree I will fight you outside the local Tesco’s Carpark tonight, armed with a Stanley Knife and a bottle of Buckfast, We can even joust with Trolleys, if we bring a trusty Squire to push us. It is a well written story however, just like Illidan, by William King. I hate Illidan, I hate everything about his smug, punchable face, I hate that his whole schtick seems to be, my proto-girlfriend preferred my brother, so I turned into a colossal Pr!ck and almost damned -two worlds- just because I had jealousy issues. FFS Illidan, trying not to be crude here, but you have a right hand. Just saying.

Ahh, I must mock prophets of Alien races that I don’t really know, having only encountered alternate universe members of them.
“Illidan, what are you doing?”
“What must be done!”
“Do you have to punch out windows for no reason?”
“Sometimes the hand of fate must be forced!”
"Right, apart from how much of a sexual predator that makes you sound, is that the same as ‘Sometimes the hand of fate must do random shiz that makes no sense’
“Sometimes the hand of fa-”

“Right, you really are an idiot, aren’t you”
“I Wear a blindfold and can shoot laser’s from my eyes”
“Who are you, Thammaron? Come on, time for a little nap…”

But yeah, this is a cracking idea, especially if couched as an IC document, it would be really interesting.

111

Well yes, but actually no. “Gods” on Azeroth are strictly speaking a different definition to what we would consider. They are neither omnipotent nor omnipresent or omniscient. They may have one of the aforementioned traits however.

The only “God” by what your definition is (ie the traditional one we use in the real world) would be Elune, as she is transcendent, omnipresent and (potentially) omniscient. The Light and Void are fields of power less than actual entities, although they did collectively create the physical universe.

Structured organised religion is limited to a few races, namely those within the Alliance predominantly, mainly Humans, Night Elves and Draenei. While there is a Dwarven clergy as well, they seem to be less spiritual and more practical in their worship (which suits them as a race).

The Horde as a whole is less organised, scripture and commandment based and more personal, animistic and totemic related spirituality. The major exceptions being the Forsaken who have their own twisted reflection of the Church of Light in the Cult of Forgotten Shadow and to a lesser extent, the Blood Elves with their priesthood and Blood Knights.

In regards to the Trolls and their Loa, unlike the Night Elves who do not worship their ancients as such, rather revere and seek to emulate (Druids mainly) the Zandalari instead have dedicated priesthoods to their Loa, so they are more like an organised religion akin to the ancient Hellenic faith of the Greco-Roman world, even down to an appointed “High Priest of X Loa”.

Elemental Lords are akin to divinity, as they cannot be slain on the physical plane, although this is also a trait shared with Demons. As already mentioned Neptulon is held in high regard by many aquatic creatures like Murlocs. The “Cult of Ragnaros” is present and has a number of Dark Iron adherents as well.

But coming back to the point of religion, there is a difference between organised worship of a specific pantheon or individual beings considered worthy of such and veneration of ancestral spirits or the spirit of life itself. Dogmatic religion in Azeroth is actually not as common as our own world, even the Light has a lot of interpretive elements to it, despite two belief systems with their own codes of right and wrong and expectations coming from both Humans and Draenei being present.

1 Like
112

That’s not the definition of god that we use IRL. It’s the same as the one you’d use in warcraft. And dogmatic religion is also the exception, not the norm - the two biggest religions just happen to be those because dogmatic monotheism spreads faster and more efficiently than others.

Night elves also do worship the ancients. That’s nelf druids’ entire deal. They have totem ancients and everything, too. Trolls have organised religion, as do Forsaken (as you pointed out). Blood elves aren’t at all a lesser extent - their clergy is, as far as I can tell, organised in much the same way as that of Stormwind or Ironforge, with Liadrin being one of the major racial leaders under Lor’themar.

Tauren also have some degree of organised worship of the Earth Mother, with Hamuul Runetotem being a major leader because of his status as a druid.

As for dwarves, being “less spiritual” (idk where you get that idea from though) doesn’t mean they’re less religious. Religion can still very well be a major factor in their lives, even if it’s a more pragmatic approach to it - such as what the gnomes have with Mimiron, for example.

This isn’t really a thing by the way. People in the Greco-Roman sphere didn’t worship “Specific pantheons” but rather participated in one or two temple cults and didn’t pay heed to others - they didn’t have a concept of “These are the Greek gods, and those are the Roman ones”, case in point when they met the Isis cult in Egypt they identified her with Demeter and from that point they revered Isis in much the same way as they did Demeter before, even going as far as to adopt some Egyptian mannerisms in their temple cult.

2 Likes
113

Yeah, same. At least for my warrior it’s kind of still a thing. Same for the Tyr worshipping. I guess it’s total headcanon, but when I started playing him eons ago I figured there’d be more people in the now Tirisfal Glades area who have lived there for generations that have similar beliefs as my character.

He had a crisis of Faith during the Third War and can no longer call upon the Light like paladins/priests can, but his worship in essence hasn’t changed. Tyr’s a big deal to him, as is his warhorn and his sword.

114

Just a quick update, I had a bit of a CK2 binge over the weekend but I’m hoping to add more to the thread this week.

115

T I T A N S.

Seriously, though, there’s gotta be legit Titan worship around. Dwarves too, maybe?

1 Like
116

Durgan One-God from Traveler is a dwarf who exclusively worships Eonar. He admits that he is the only dwarf who practices monotheism though.

2 Likes
117

The old Warcraft RPG has something called the Mystery of the Makers. It’s less of a religion, more of a cultural fascination surrounding the origin of dwarves, the desire to understand why they came to be and exactly who made them.

But this is from before the demystification of Warcraft. Nowadays, we all know what the deal with the Titans is, IC and OOC. If the RPG was still canon, who knows what the Mystery of the Makers would have developed into.

3 Likes
118

I don’t think gnomes should be considered a religious race. The way they pay homage to Mimiron holds little substance (and has no relationship with a concept of the divine or faith at all) and, more importantly, lacks a defined and collective elements of worship: they don’t have rituals, sacred items, they do not project a concept of divine towards Mimiron, neither have faith that he may help them.

Rather, they are highly secularized, with Mimiron being reduced to, at best (I’d argue), folklore. Perhaps one may argue their idea of technology and innovations is almost sacred (“they can take our lives, but won’t take our INNOVATION!”), but again it seems a generic form of enthusiasm, broadly undefined, and more cultural than religious.

119

Personally I agree. Yes they have Priests, but Light Worship doesn’t really smack true with them, ‘Wrenchcalibur’ whilst also being a ridiculously jokey name doesn’t also seem to be a magic item, its just a name for a snacky bit of kit that Mekkatorque uses when the Dev’s remember he has it. It isn’t a Holy Relic, or even a magical weapon like, heh, Excalibur, or in WoW Shalamayne, Thas’dorah, the Ashbringer, etc etc

Again, I agree. Mimiron is more akin to Prometheus, Adam, Gilgamesh. A Progenitor figure who did something pretty awesome, but isn’t -actually- worshipped. Gnomes are, (To our understanding) one of the most developed people of Azeroth, They are the only ones who elect their leaders, and can remove said leaders by popular choice. Sure, some Gnomes might actually worship him, but it isn’t a racial thing.

1 Like
120

All of whom are products of religious mythology, btw. The gnomes (rightfully) consider Mimiron their creator, and they treat him as such, too. See the gnomes in Borean Tundra trying to “reverse the curse of flesh”, as well as the gnomes in Mechagon just now. Their relationship to Mimiron is that of a people longing to return to a mythological time of cosmos - before malevolent forces betrayed the cosmological order, as ordained by their creator-figure

While Aristion is correct in that there isn’t a well defined systemic religion centered around Mimiron, that’s also true for almost all other races and their deities, because Blizzard just isn’t that concerned with fleshing out the warcraft universe. Only races that are overtly religious (which the gnomes certainly aren’t) get any screen time for their spirituality (or equivalent thereof), but religion, as I previously laid out, doesn’t have to be overt to exist, and I feel, given what little we see of Gnome culture, if Blizz fleshed them out more, we’d see more signs of what I’d describe as gnomish religiosity.

12 Likes