Please can we end this truce, it's boring

Ah, but it IS!
You just don’t like the current lore, I suppose.
Ah well… I’m happy. :smiling_face:

Blizzard’s Heartlands novellas from a few months ago have some awesome conflicts. They also explain things like why there are Stromgarde footmen in Khaz Algar. It’s a shame that these things aren’t featured much in the game itself.

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Lok’tar, brother.

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Here’s a link where one can read all of the Heartlands novellas, in which the Alliance and Horde undergo a bitter conflict in the Arathi Highlands!

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I would like to see the rivalry kick up again between the two Faction, but they don’t need to go to war again!

Not yet anyway. Small skirmishes are fine.

No need .alliance and horde give flowers to each other now

Again, let me ask you, what rivalry?
In what, for what?
Land? Money? Natural resources after the what fourth of fifth end of the world scenario?
We are kind of past those things, especially when both sides are teams of near extinct races
I mean how many Night Elves survived the sudden mortality and vulnerability to diseases - and the wars and tree burning, and all?
Gnomes? Yeah who managed to escape their own little Chernobil meets Fallout disaster
Humans? You mean the Humans who populated the area ravaged by the Undead and then Demons then anything else?
A handfull of crashlanded tentackled aliens with the bad habit of dying?
Cursed survivors of a literally half sunken kingdom - other half ravaged by again, the undead?
In the alliance only the Dwarves are the only race who are mostly managed to keep their population above sea level

The Horde is not that better
The Tauren literally almost died out thanks to the Centaur
The Orcs? Those three-five ship of worth of depressed aliens?
A ship worth of Goblin slaves?
An even smaller number of Darkspear trolls who taged along when the Horde ran in to them and saved their sorry behind from ONE Naga seawitch and her murlocks…
Elves who had the Human treatment and barely escaped extinction by the hands of the undead?
The undead who claim they have no mean of reproduction and they will die out - but even in BFA Lilianna a rouge at best and not a necromancer prodigy just raised a guy as a Forsaken…?

These Races suddenly not recovered in the decades passed since WC3 - even in peacetime it would have been a miracle but again, the world was in constant state of war - then they jumped to each other’s throat…
At the moment on Azeroth popoulation wise the Pandaren are the only race who are in a good shape
Dwarves are close second
I would say the Vulpera are around the Dwarven level
The Dracthyr numbers are unknown but they were made to be an elite force, we not even sure they can reproduce and how many Dracthyr survived?
The Zandalari Empire had their own problem like the kingdom of Kul Tiras - they are I would say the Dwarven level, not really big landmasses with a small but stable population (befor they were dragged in to war…)
The Highmountian Tauren balanced at the edge, then Legion happened
Suramar probably outnumber Silvermoon but they had very heavy losses when Suramar became a Demon playground and a few family decided to go Felborne

Face it, neither the Horde nor the Alliance are in the shape to even have an argument over a plate of fried catfish, less to go to war over anything…
The only thing they could muster to have a rivalry is to have a competition who manage to save their skin and don’t go horribly inbred or outright extinct

Most people don’t think that far, they only think raw, war!!!

And in addition to the points mentioned above, there are also resources that are missing on both sides…
In order to wage war (and secure resources) you must first invest resources that are lacking.
And they don’t wake up on trees and become widely available.

This is a point that is often neglected.

Why did germany lose the war back then - because the allies simply outdid them in the war matrioal, the amias had almost inexhaustible resources and could produce thousands of tanks in one day, the shipyards also diligently pumped out warships, the amis quickly outdid the germans and japanese, and even the british.
While the Germans had to fight for every resource and in the end their war economy was paralyzed because they simply lacked everything, materials, fuel and raw materials.
Even the russians later outperformed the germans because they had access to huge resources that they could fully exploit, coupled with massive manpower (although manpower alone is useless - when the blindly run in human wave attacks against well-fortified positions with Mg nests).

For fun. Simple.

Lok’tar ogar.

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Fun.
youe bleive war is fun?

Then go into one, tehr are pelnty, lets see how much fun you get after a couple of hourse.

And i know crying for war in a virtuel game is easy but then change to a lore percpecitv, if our charakter woud be normal peole in that world (and not an Anime protagonist)
you wnd cry for warr because nobody woud have the motivation afer so many exhaustiung fight and world ending threats.

And liek mention above, the afction war story leads to nowehre, you cant repat taht over and oevr agin becuase it will alwasy a dead end- because no side can aculy win.

And aim aware the sitauion in the aufio novel but even that resolved very fast because no side wanted an full blown war and tehy tarfevld then together to khaz algar.

I too am a 10 foot tall green alien in real life.

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I like to do war crimes :slight_smile:

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The same things its been in the past, the Horde needs lumber & Ashenvale is full of it. The Zandalari aren’t too pleased that the rightful monarch that’s ruled for 300 years was murdered, and neither is his daughter that succeeded him, the Kaldorei didn’t hear no bell, the Tauren are fuming that Dwarves are in Bael Modan given their track record of massacring Taurajo village & being so close to Mulgore.

There are countless examples on why x race wouldn’t be happy with y race given the circumstances they find themselves in.

Implying that the world hasn’t changed in the slightest since classic, some races mature a lot quicker than others, Orcs are an example of this - reaching maturity at what other races would consider a young teen. There’s also bastions of these populations everywhere all over the world, surely you’re not implying that every single settlement suffered insane losses & irreversible damage. The loreful implications we were given were only the one’s in Stormwind from a cutscene. If you remember, the Horde were winning the fourth war by a good margin until the sudden Danuserism occured that made the Horde yet again split.

I don’t think anyone put forward the point of having an all out war again, just that not everybody would be okay with this cease fire. Its actually more of an alien response to simply forget everything that happened and let bygones be bygones instantly, it makes much more sense from a character perspective to go “actually im not okay with this, my entire family was murdered” and to be against it. From what I can recall, only Tyrande & Talanji weren’t pleased about the truce but since then both of them have been silenced because Blizzard are scared to upset anyone. Even the Sunreavers completely forgot that Jaina went around Dalaran on a murder spree. The contention & disparity between differing opinions is a driving force that isn’t being utilized to push story arcs forward & cultivate new stories. It is utterly devoid of emotion and personality to simply say “yep we’re friends now doesn’t matter about the past”.

Please stop comparing everything in WoW to 1940’s Germany. It is a fantasy setting and has absolutely nothing in common with real world events.

This is absolutely normal in said fantasy settings with bloodthirsty & savage races that thrive in war, this was the vision & the very structure of many races in WoW and the focal point of the story for many years. To disregard that is to say you don’t like WoW lore in too many words, in which case I would simply ask “why are you playing?”.

I don’t believe Zeepkist is saying that he himself enjoys war as we know it, simply that the character he portrays enjoys it, which again… is in no way similar to real life, nor should it be taken as such.

no you don’t, you love Calia.

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Kurst, I think you’re missing the point of why many players, myself included, want the faction conflict back.
It’s not about glorifying real-world war; it’s about what makes Warcraft, Warcraft. The Alliance vs. Horde dynamic is a core part of this game’s identity and has driven some of its best storylines (imo).
The current truce feels forced and undermines a lot of what makes this world compelling. OP is right, having content tailored to your faction added depth and replayability, it’s about wanting a return to a core element of the game that many of us feel is missing.
Do not treat the game as reality.

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like the zandalari cared?
The were plenty of attempf previus to the attack of the allaince because Rastakahn wast the most popuar.
And even talanji had later a hard time- rember there were two revolt right after she take over.

ah dig we tak topic up again, which was discusted to death.
Is was a legit military target:
" [Baine Bloodhoof called Camp Taurajo a legitimate military target and recognized that Hawthorne refused to slaughter civilians when he could have just given the order to massacre everyone."
source: wow wiki:

and instead of askin nicly, we need to take it by force, and tehn you were supides you were seen as the bad guys and get villian baited.

but teh world has changes since classic, and that mena even oevrcom old obstcle.

so, you admitt herby an horde bias? :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

because tehy cant let the hodre wind (and later teh allaince), because it woud mean remove one faction /make them unpalyable- which wourd not anger a lare part of teh comm, it woud cut their financil income- and even Blizzard enteratiment and steve danuser were that stupid.

i knwo you guy hat that comapison but you muist consider, ressouzces anr plenty and give a deep world building if tehy have struggle even for that, and not let tehm magical apper ebcuase plot demands…
It make the word more realictiv, because even in a fanatsy world pull of endless ressoruces is stupid.

yes, but still, WoW by standart even a lighter setting ( at least to have a lower age rating) but remember. teh people of azeroth overcum old struggle, liek so many times siad, we fight so many times together world ending theras together.
and adding anoterh stupid war / conflict because wome people wnat to woud change the story, it woud run eventuly in teh same dead end, and again, remmber how “well” recived" BFA was?

the truce stengehn was allaince and horde figt for: a permanet peace, not to turn teh waposn again at each oterh, overcum old grudes, and build a future together.
I know ist warcraft but warcraft donst mean world of Allaince vs Allianc farft, wararft is meant ambiguous.
And liek siad befor the horde vs allaicne story lead to nowehre, and even blizzard acknowlegd that.

Not sure a couple tents with hide walls could be considered a “legit military target” to the degree that tanks & plane are required to bomb it.

I’d rather the Horde be seen as villains in the Alliance’s eyes, yes. The Alliance’s opinion on what’s evil and what isn’t should be entirely irrelevant in the eyes of the Horde, opposing factions have never had each others best interests at heart.

That’s my point.

No, because according to lore the Horde lost the fourth war despite being so obviously ahead. A reminder that Darkshore is considered an Alliance victory despite the Horde sweeping through the entire forest & destroying a major Alliance settlement.

I agree, endless resources are bad. That’s why I said that its better to fight over them as it was intended from the start.

I don’t think this dynamic needed to change. The Horde & Alliance have always set aside their differences when Azeroth is threatened because it made sense, that doesn’t mean all the tension in the air & smaller conflicts instantly dissolve. There’s still disputes & problems in various areas, this much has been confirmed. As I stated previously, I don’t necessarily think that the factions need all out war again, but I do think that it needs to properly showcase the unresolved conflicts that are confirmed to still be happening… which in itself could appease both crowds if they toned down the peace-mongering.

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its really hard to answer this post without being flagged

erm…

so many ways to answer but its pretty obvious the Woke surge and lack of players in certain factions directly affected the “Tension” between horde vs alliance and the racial imbalances certain classes have

trying to make it an esport they need to make everyone as balanced as they can be

i hope you guys get what i mean

  • ( i too miss Red v Blue … that was PEAK WoW and immersion… hence the name WARcraft )

Imma say this , not trying to hate or anything don’t get me wrong. They really need to tidy up the story and put an end to it. ( idk maybe wow2 with time skip after main warcraft story ends ? or just wow2 but another timeline?)
Currently we are at a point of if they reignite a war it will feel artificial and we are about to deal with the main villain of the wow which sargeras had to create burning legion to be able to deal with it.
After this world soul trilogy i dont see an actual way of them writing an interesting story maybe they shouldn’t have followed the DBZ anime route to begin with ( enemies grow stronger each xpac etc. ).
Now we are in the weird space cosmos higher beings route i don’t see an interesting way of ally and horde conflicting again.
Btw don’t get me wrong i also think current situation is kinda lame but i dont really see a way that they can turn this. They shouldn’t have let Danuser touch the story tbf

But many other players, myself included, don’t want the faction conflict back. It used to be part of what made Warcraft, Warcraft, but that is no longer the case. Now it’s about fighting for the very survival of our entire world - on a galactic scale. Squabbling about petty things should not be anyone’s concern right now.

And that’s from a lore perspective. The player perspective is: They’ve done it long enough already. They’ve done actual wars enough already. None of them were good. None of them were fun. That is the perspective of many players, myself included.

So, in short: We will never agree because we simply like different things about Warcraft.

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Democrats and Republicans don’t kill each other in big wars afaik