Yeah, I’m going to go ahead and say no one who’s read your posts on them of late has missed that point. Your points are more than fair, though I don’t expect that to change the nature of the conversation any further since neither of you is likely to convince the other at this point.
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Did you also lose the majority of a race to it with slow, painful deaths to civilians?
I don’t see how anyone could even remotely compare these 2.
You don’t seem to get the point of why the teldrassil event was so horrible at all.
His story start more then 10.000 years ago, there were no Elves except of Nelves and there were no factions called “Horde” and Alliance", good that you noticed it, probably Dath’remar is also an alliance character by your definition. Let’s not forget that he got his first spotlight by cooperating with Blood Elves and Naga, he’s 100% alliance for sure!
Yes, more spotlight. I want more Varian, more “A lil patience” scenarios, more “Malfurion my love” and more being a punching bag. Give me more of this stuff, how can someone not appreciate it? I don’t get it It’s not like it’s better to have no spotlight than bad spotlight.
And even here you’re wrong, unbelievable. The burning was the factor which is mostly responsible for the pissed attitude of the nelf fans nowadays. So no, it can be really be seen as a favor if you obviously suffer from it.
So it’s about their appearance and if you see things related to them or not, right? Dies it mean that Zandalari should appreciate BoD aswell and thank Blizzard that they hit them hard?
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This sentence is really funny to me, as Sylvanas had no clue what’s going on while Lordaeron was literally collapsing in front of her eyes. There is a book insert, once Arthas arrives, she is like “Omg, he can raise the dead!”
Talking about ignoring when a Ranger General of Quel’Thalas isn’t aware that their closest neighbor is drowning in a tidal wave of Zombies.
Ironically enough, the Forsaken still hold Tirisfal. It isn’t even contested.
I disagree, a lot of his points are replying to biased statements with biased statements, killing the point in the core.
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How could Dath’remar be Alliance? There wasn’t one. Nor was there a Horde. I’m not sure what you are reaching for there. If you are trying to make a parallel then it falls a bit flat, as Illidan is a Kaldorei, and whilst he only cares about himself, is of an Alliance race. Dath’remar -was-(As in we don’t ever see him in game, so its kinda redundant) a Quel’dorei, and whilst they were neutral at the time, is of an Alliance race. I mean High Elves are in the Alliance, that’s simple fact.
Both of which species were at the time a) Neutral, and b) working with the Alliance. Things went south afterwards, thanks to Garry, but neither Blood Elves or Naga had any Horde involvement.
Welcome to Horde Plot 101. Everything you do will be as dust, the Alliance will Win in the end. We promised you complexity, We Lied.
Tough. He’s dead 
Given the too frequent posts we see from Night Elf fans making outrageous demands, I think “A Little Patience” is actually a pretty accurate summary of what that fanbase needs.
That’s just crap writing, you can’t blame that on Sylvanas, your anger in that sense is misplaced.
Sorry, should I have put a disclaimer at the end of that sentence stating “This may be sarcasm, I do not generally condone genocide as a way of improving societal conditions for a species” (Unless they’re wasps, in which case Genocide is too good for 'em)
It is about their overexposure at the detriment of other Alliance races. Everything has to be about them, in some way or another, for good or ill. They’re like that mate at a party, you’ve listened to their sob story, you’ve consoled them, but they still want to tell you more about how miserable they are. You’re trying to be a good friend, you really are, but their constant whining is starting to get you down, they start repeating themselves, and claiming that the universe cares enough about them individually to have personally singled them out for this torment. You’re like “I’m sure its not that, bad things happened to Jimmy Human, he got ran over by a cart last week, paralysed from the neck down” “I know, but my house got burned down” “Yeah, yeah, it did, and that sucks, but remember, you hated that house, it was corrupt and had spooky shiz in it” “But my House was burned down!” "Yeah, I got that. “But my House was burned down” Yeah, you told me…quite a few times now. “Its not fair, the bad guys house didn’t get burned down” “Err, it did” “But -I- didn’t get to burn it down!” “Does that, really matter?” “YES!” “OK, lets reevaluate whether you are a good person or a bad person right now…”
Which book is that, as it may have been supplanted by more recent releases which kinda changed the timelines of the invasion of Lordaeron and Quel’thalas. I mean Sylvanas quite -obviously- knows Arthas can raise the dead. even as early as WCIII she knows it…
Then perhaps it is the argument that is flawed. Some people cannot accept that both sides were treated fairly evenly, it is all about Teldrassil, all about Darnassus, which was a horrible thing, but we have seen on this very forum, someone actually use the phrase “Who cares about Undercity, it doesn’t matter that the Horde lose that, the Kaldorei lose Darnassus”
I remember the use of language at the time, and thought “Oh boy, this is going to rumble on”
And I wasn’t wrong.
“Who cares if the -Horde- lose Undercity” (A Faction)
“The Kaldorei lose Darnassus” (A species within a Faction)
It is the bizarre self entitlement that some Kaldorei fans have, that puts my back up. Half of them don’t even know their own racial lore, they have no idea how horrible, how horrific and offensive Teldrassil is to the core beliefs of the Kaldorei. A few flying crocodiles going “Ehh, I guess its OK now that you live there” but the one who can see the freakin’ future going “Nope, nope, hells nope, this is as far from OK as you can get”
Can you honestly not see how annoying it is getting when we get people claiming as fact, that Blizzard hates Night Elves, that there is a special cabal working in shadowy cigar smoke filled rooms, plotting about how to screw over a bunch of pixels. How annoying it is when false facts are paraded out “90% of them are dead!” Nah mate, that’s the Blood Elves. “They were used as Punching Bags!” "Yes mate, if you have a force of reservists, your main army being decoyed elsewhere, and you are outnumbered eight to one by the enemy, then you are going to take a kicking, anyone sensible would realise that fact. The fact that the Kaldorei there -did- manage to stymie the Horde’s Plans is nothing short of miraculous. I mean this is proper ‘Battle of Thermopylae/300’ shiz, this is 300, the Battle of Britain and Stalingrad rolled into one. A vastly outnumbered force against the entirety of the enemy, and they heroically lose. I’m sorry, -What- about this makes them look weak?
They look hella strong and fierce, to be honest…
The Arthas one.
I mean, these points are fair. I believe that both the Horde and the Night Elves have been rekt by Blizzard, and that saying that one had it better or good while both sides are effectively getting torn apart is silly.
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Ah, yeah, that has been superceded, turns out Lordaeron took longer for Arthas to Quell/Convert than originally thought, Quel’thalas had sent rangers there,(If I remember rightly, Sylvanas actually led them, so would have known, I could be wrong) and were pretty aware of what he did by the time he marched on Quel’thalas. Their failing, was of course, that Douchecanoe Dar’khan Drathir. But hey, on the treason and perfidy of sole individuals great and noble houses may fall, I guess.
Know who Ironically is responsible (though only he knows this, and is perhaps why he is so determined to be a good leader now)
Lor’themar. He and Dark’han used to be good buddies, and he let slip to Dark’han how to bring down Ban’dinoriel.
Both sides are pretty much getting shredded, lorewise, it is very difficult RPing in the current setting: Am I a Horde Loyalist, or a Sylvanas Loyalist? Is there even a difference Yet? Do I know Saurfang is Alive? Do I know what is happening in Naz’jatar? The Regent Lord is presumably MIA, who runs Quel’thalas?
The irony is, that I am not biased,Darnassus was horrible, Brigante the character thinks it was an atrocious War Crime, and during the RPPvP campaign ran at the time the content was released, he and his Sun Hawks flew to aid in the evacuation of Darnassus of children, despite Alliance firing on us, and some Horde regarding us as traitors. So I don’t for a minute think that Darnassus was justified, or nice, or fair. I’m just getting sick of hearing about it constantly, as if any of us here are surprised that the Horde did a nasty, and can do anything about it.
I don’t really remember reading these parts. From where is that?
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My point was less the validity of those statement and more so about the fairness of the argument, I’m not vouching for it in any way, but I would still recommend everyone take a step back and have a breath. This expansion has turned us all quite sour, there are no real winners in this, even Blizzard while thinking themselves so clever are still losing in all this.
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Hear, hear!
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He isn’t even a Kaldorei anymore. He’s a Demon with wings and hooves. Next you will tell me that Kil’jaeden is alliance too.
Well, he was a Night Elf aswell, so only because Illidan didn’t had the opportunity to leave and was imprisoned i stead fir 10.000 years you put him in the same boat as the Night Elves?
Fun Fact, by your definition Illidan was also neutral to both factions at this point. Don’t forget that the alliance was sceptical towards Blood Elves because… they worked with Illidan and the Naga. How can they be sceptical if he worked with a alliance char? How?! Explain it to me please.
So sad that Lorthemar didn’t get lessons from Garrosh how to have patience, I’m sure you would love that aswell. So you think only cause a fans which you personally dislike deserved to get a bad spotlight for their favorite race? Why this schadenfreude. I also want your race get orced after reading your posts btw.
No, that’s just example of my collection of “spotlights” which the Nelves got
I don’t believe that it’s may be sarcasm if you said before that “A lil patience” is what the fanbase needs. Show me the improvement. Except of Malfurion who started to killed a few hordies I see no improvement so far.
Detriment, yeah, it’s definitely detriment. Let’s give gnomes some spotlight after 15 years… oh Mekkatorque is a ice block now…
This detriment… I feel it, how bad it have to be for other races to get ignored 
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Shes one of the only interesting characters left
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She’d be interesting if she wasn’t just written to be a monster that commits horrible atrocities over and over again without ever getting punished for her actions
Yes, however his -story- that we are forced to relive during Legion, is when he -was- a Kaldorei, I mean we even have to play as him. We’re revisiting it when Illidan -was- Kaldorei.
Kil’Jaeden however, never had such an arc. We know that he, Archimonde and Velen were all Eredar, but we don’t get exposed to Kil’jaeden’s backstory in the same way.
Go over what I said in full, who were the commanders on the Vindicaar, who was on the bridge? We’ll leave aside Romuul, he is definitely Alliance.
You have:
Illidan. Alliance race, but Neutral.
Khadgar. Alliance race, but Neutral.
Velen. Alliance Race (Though tolerant)
Turalyon. Alliance race, but Neutral/later Alliance.
Alleria. Alliance race, but Neutral/later Alliance.
Vereesa. Alliance race, not Neutral at all.
Where was the Horde investiture in that? Not a single character of a Horde Race, not even a Neutral One.
WHat colours were the crew of the Vindicaar wearing? Exodar Colours. Alliance Colours. Does that make sense? Absolutely, the Draenei built that ship (somehow), but does that -really- give off an air of Neutrality?
Dath’remar’s story ended when he was Exiled. We get no further info about him, never see him in game, and he has zero impact apart from being an unseen historical figure. Illidan however, is shoved down our throat all the time in Legion.
Yes he was, he was a Neutral of an Alliance race. at the time, so was Kael’thas, I mean the last allegiance Kael’thas had, was presumably under his father’s reign, so to the Alliance, hence he y’know, sides with the Alliance in WCIII. The Naga are, and have never been either Horde or Alliance, so don’t really come into it. I mean even after Garithos auditions for douche of the year, Kael’thas still works with the Alliance of Lordaeron, it is only Garithos’ actions that stop that continuing.
Probably because Garrosh himself rather famously lacked patience. I mean it is the other way around, Lor’themar has to school Garrosh in what the role of a Warchief is, during ‘Tides of War’.
You’re confusing me saying that Tyrande and the Night Elves need to learn patience, with me saying that the Night Elf player base need to learn patience. The reaction has been hysterical, and I mean that word in its truest sense, not as in it has been funny.
Never have I stated or intimated such.
Kudos for use of the word, but you’re using it wrong, there is no Schadenfreude at play here. I take no vicarious pleasure in what happened to the Night Elves. The correct word you are looking for is ‘Exasperation’. Not Schadenfreude.
Have you ever played on Horde side? -Everything- is all about the Orcs, or the Forsaken these days. I mean -Everything- Other races get brief spots to shine, but mostly, Orcs and Humans are where it is at, even when the narrative makes no sense for it to be so.
A Race in decline (a common theme for Elves by the way) who get shoehorned into every expansion possible. Perhaps they should have been ignored, like other Alliance Races, although I daresay we would then see continual threads about how the Kaldorei have been ignored. Pick your Poison.
It is Sarcasm. That is exactly how it works. “A Little Patience” as in the concept, not the Quest, is exactly what the Kaldorei fanbase needs. “Blizz have said we have had our vengeance and this is the end!” "No, Blizz have said there is no advancement of their story in -this- expansion. Have a little patience, other races had to wait far longer for their Vengeance, what makes the Kaldorei so Special that everyone has to drop everything and soothe their feelings?
Oh me, Oh my…right, I’ll show you the improvement of the Kaldorei situation, when you can show me the improvement of the Sin’dorei situation, or the Draenei situation? It is not -all about- the Kaldorei, the world does not revolve around them. You want improvement? Get in the Queue, some of us have been waiting for more than ten years.
Again, that’s bad Alliance writing. Nothing to do with Sylvanas. I mean literally, nothing to do with her. Gelbin Mekkatorque is a complete BAMF and I will fight anyone who says otherwise, and I don’t like that he is an ice block, but that has absolutely c*ck all to do with the Kaldorei situation, and this rabid, unthinking crusade to kill Sylvanas as if that is somehow punishment for killing something that was a violator of the planet.
Never watch the original Star Wars movies, you will be horribly disappointed. Not every story ends with an instant win for the Goodies.
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Oh noes, who would be Dath’remar at this time? Would he be a High Elf if he would be playable or just a Night Elf because there were only Nelves 10.000 years ago?
Ofc, just forget that the Draenei fought against Illidan back in BC because he wanted to rule over Outland… but he is still not worse than smelling Orc ofc! And Illidan himself was so alliance biased… I mean his council only contained… Belves! And let’s not forget that he even made a harem especially for them… not Nelves… and since when can I play a winged nelf with hooves?
Because the story 10.000 years ago isn’t nelf exclusive because it’s the history of all Elves. All your beloved belves were also nelves to this time ffs…
Do you know who also lacked patience? Varian “human Orc” Wrynn, but he still got it somehow.
That’s rather funny what you’re saying. So you consider that Night Elf players have a lack of patience and aren’t just butthurt after getting bad attention the time. And for what exactly do I need patience? For the big picture which Blizz promised or the answer why exactly Nelves joined the Forsaken (ofc they have no time to speak about it)
Orcs are some problem right but they don’t downplay other races they show them that they have “no honor” per their definition in the worst case. Forsaken also have it bad at the time because Sylvanas is in a position where the many fans don’t want to see her and let’s not forget and let’s not forget the Golden retcon that Forsaken are only the minions of Sylvanas and aren’t even able to clap even if they can be monk somehow.
Rather no treatment than bad treatment. Only cause a few people are loud doesn’t mean that everybody thinks so.
M8, Nelf fans wait since Cata for good treatment, isn’t it enough… I mean it are 10 years already. How long should they wait? I see attention only as one of the factors which can cause it.
Mister, you started the argument about improvement but how Belves and Draenei don’t got improvement already? Btw. Nelf fans are also waiting for 10 years so stay quiet please. I also don’t think that the game will survive another 10 years so…
SHOW ME A QUOTE WHERE I STATED THAT IT’S ALL SYLVANAS’ FAULT. I’M WAITING.
You speak about how the nelf steals the spotlight. Well, that’s how the spotlight looks mostly because it’s
Feel free to get more of it if you want, the nelves don’t need it. My point is that this attention is a 
worth, because it’s attention.
Are you kidding me right now? You know that the majority of them were Highborne and that the leader of the nelves were the reason why the legion didn’t conquered Azeroth, right? You also know that the decents of these Highborne are mostly in the Horde now, right?
Not an instant win, but usually an eventual one. Getting told by the devs that it’s over already makes night elf fans kinda sad, you know
At least it’s an acknowledged loss. Most of the Horde stuff is waved with a ‘suck it up, you deserve it coz you evul’.
But yeah, unsatisfying plots it is.
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