Please Let Us Make Leveling Challenging Again — Optional Difficulty or Scaling Toggle

Community General Discussion
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Hi Blizzard Forums,

I’m 19 years old and have been playing World of Warcraft since Cataclysm. Over the years, I’ve grown to love the modern systems in Retail — the combat fluidity, transmog, class design, mounts, accessibility, and especially all the ways to express yourself through the game.

But there’s one thing that keeps pulling me back to Classic and Cataclysm Classic:

Leveling that feels meaningful.

In Retail, especially at lower levels, mobs die in 1-2 hits, there’s almost no risk of dying in the open world, and zone scaling makes it feel like I’m never truly growing stronger or exploring anything “too dangerous” or out of my league.

Oh, and if you say “That’s why Classic exists”. I already play and enjoy that. But my point is that I would want to play the same game Retail is, but with a optional toggle, etc, for players if they want the game to be harder, mobs hit harder, different scaling systems, etc. This wouldn’t hurt the playerbase, as it would be optional. I love the Retail mechanics, just would like to see a Retail where leveling matters, especially early.

I’m not asking to overhaul the game or make it harder for everyone — but I do wish there was an optional system, like a difficulty toggle, or a new NPC like Chromie, that lets us tune the leveling experience to something closer to Classic-style gameplay.

:bulb: Imagine:

  • A “Survival Mode” toggle at Chromie (or another NPC).
  • Disables zone scaling.
  • Increases mob HP/damage by 100–200%.
  • Optional permadeath flag (for Ironman/Hardcore players).
  • Maybe a title or cosmetic reward for hitting 70 under those conditions.

This wouldn’t affect players who enjoy fast leveling — but for players like me who enjoy challenge, immersion, and danger, it would make Retail’s leveling feel alive again.

Why This Matters:

  • It brings back risk and excitement for those who want it.
  • Encourages players to slow down and connect with the world again.
  • Gives veterans something to sink their teeth into without needing to go back to Classic servers.

I love Retail WoW. I just wish the journey to max level had some teeth again — and an option to experience the world as something wild and dangerous, not just a hallway to endgame.

Thanks for reading, and, I thank Blizzard for everything they’ve built. WoW means a lot to me — I just hope this idea sparks something.

— A loyal player since Cata

11 Likes
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I think this would be easy to manage to do a different scaling, while leveling

dont know 25-50% more dmg/hp from mobs :dracthyr_shrug:

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Yeah because I am the type of player that reads every quest text when I quest. And I understand; not all players wanna be like this. That’s why it should be a option, just like Chromie! Maybe reduce XP to more Classic-like standards, and the mob scaling system, damage, etc. Make the game a little harder if one wants to. This wouldn’t be bad for anybody, just a option that might even bring even more players into WoW Retail.

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I also support the idea of an optional harder overworld, but not with the same implementation.

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What are you thinking?

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If the only variable is the healthpool of the mob then thats not harder it just longer. If you want harder, real harder, you have to design levels to take consideration of the environment, densities, roaming mobs, different mob strengths, elites ad hazards. Also in Classic each mob location was designed around different classes so that say a a mage had space to kite and blast from a distance. All that was removed in the current game and every class was given a healthy stock of crowd control so that each class is expected to play toe to toe.

Just saying, lifting mob strengths isn’t harder its just longer and more boring. To be honest the game needs to redesign the combat system if you want fighting to be meaningful.

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Why wouldn’t mob damage and HP matter? Imagine there was a NPC like Chromie that cast a spell on you, permanent until turned off by that NPC where damage you take id increased by, say 50% by mobs so that players around not having this selected wont be affected. It will make encounters not turn into a 2 spell one shot mechanic. My ideas are not perfect, I am not a developer, but I am confident that if wanted, Blizzard can and would implement this the right way without ruining for others or the core gameplay. And, oh, XP gain reduction is also apart of what I’m thinking. In this mode or whatever, pulling too many mobs would be punishing due to the player taking too much DMG. I dont think this would require extensive combay reworks but I see your point.

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I’ve suggested multiple times that Blizz ought to officially introduce an Iron Man Challenge style leveling feature to the game, where it’ll apply debuffs and lock functions and what not depending on the selected Challenge.

And more challenges can get added… where they’ll reward a variety of cosmetics, titles, pets and mounts.

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Yes! I guess I could say my suggestion could tie into that. But be aware; in this mode, or however it would be implemented; I want the mobs to hit real numbers outside of starter zones, I want xp to be adjusted so that quests don’t turn green before even half the zone is done, but I do not want any gameplay restrictions (atleast for the normal ironman mode.) Additional other modes that add restrictions is fine, but a normal WoW tuned more towards slowing down the journey is what I am dreaming off. And maybe it would make sense to make grouping only possible between other players with the same challenge? But then, too many challenges shouldnt be added to make sure they are populated. It would be up to Blizz on how they implement this but I am confident its very possible and I think alot of people would like this as a gameplay option. Like you said, make it more attractive to do this by adding rewards when you hit max lvl with it.

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The idea itself is good, but a lot depends on the execution. However, the debuff-type solution wouldn’t work well psychologically. Mainly because when you go back to Classic on the Realms, everyone struggles with the same level of difficulty. Whether it’s an Elite quest or an instance. HP + DMG scaling would be a lazy solution. A complete redesign is needed, with a Classic mentality, which Blizzard won’t implement. They’ve removed everything that mattered and made the game hard. Instead, they’re trying to introduce clumsy solo features, which further reduce social interaction. Not to mention, we’re playing a game that’s allegedly called an MMO, but the MMO aspect is missing. The entire retail version is already messed up, and it needs a complete reboot, which would end up being a new game. The only positive aspect of retail is that it looks good, but the essence of what the game used to be is barely recognizable anymore. Now it’s all about cosmetics.

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I understand your point, but I still do not see why a simple Mobs do more damage, you are not gonna oneshot them solution would not work. Please beware; I am not trying to make Retail into Classic. I am trying to make a mode where XP gains is reduced and combat lasts more than 2 seconds. Its just debuffing the player with increased enemy incoming damage and maybe decreasing players damage, and, like I said, reduce incomming XP. It would be optional and players would be well aware of what it does, so new players or players who just dont want it will just ignore it. Doesnt have to get complicated.

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An optional difficulty mode that would be enabled only in capital cities like Warmode and which would have the following effects:

  • Reduced resource regeneration and out-of-combat hp regeneration. Purpose: HP/Mana breaks make a return
  • All non-rotational abilities have their cooldown increased massively. Purpose: No “Back to 100% hp” or “Get out of jail” abilities every 15 seconds.
  • Enemy aggro range increased. Patroling enemies increased. Purpose: Massive reduction of “I will go afk here because there is no enemy in sight” when adventuring and requiring strategic pulling and killing of enemies as well as strategic choice of where to stop for hp/mana break.
  • Daze replaced with Supercritical Strike: Receive 200% damage and an additional heal-absorb effect of equal amount. Purpose: Less attempts to just run through enemies.
  • Similar enemy groups buffed up. If more than 1 of the same enemy type are within 5 yards, each enemy gets a stacking buff of 10% increased damage and 10% reduced damage taken. So that grouping up everyone and then trying to AoE them down from afar becomes difficult.
  • …and a lot more that would make players approach the game as an adventure instead of a hack’n’slash or like Serious Sam. It should also encourage partying up for overworld tasks as well instead of going solo for absolutely everything except the World Boss

However, I lied about the “optional” part. In almost every suggestion I make, I try to compensate players who do not take the path of least resistance. So one would have to see how slower the game pace becomes under such changes, and increase every reward to match or be slightly ahead of the “normal” difficulty in terms of “payout per time spent”. In other words, if I needed 1 minute to complete a World Quest in normal difficulty and 5 minutes to complete in hardmode, then gold payout, currency payout etc. would be increased to 5x so that it’s equal to normal mode in terms of time spent.

Also however, I despise Ironman challenges. At the same time, there should not be a single achievement, pet, mount, appearance, etc. that would only be earned in the difficulty overworld mode. The game should be 100% completable on easy mode. Just give us the option to have a hard mode with equal payment in terms of reward-per-time-spent.

2 Likes
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Exactly. Does not have to be complicated, I am open to all forms of implementation of this idea. Just make leveling challenging again, if players want to, and reduce XP gains. Also, I do not like the level zone scaling system, but I have no suggestion towards that, in relation to this idea of a harder open world content mechanic.

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I don’t think it’s a solvable issue nowadays because of the current system of “Pick your own adventure”. The closest suggestion I have supported is one where you pick an expansion and then that expansion’s content becomes scaled from 10 to 70 in a sequential way. To provide an example:

  • Let’s say I pick The Burning Crusade. Then Hellfire Peninsula has enemies between level 10 and 20, with lower levels near the Dark Portal and higher levels near the borders with Zangarmarsh and Terrokar Forest. Zangarmarsh has level 20 to 30, similarly spread out. Terrokar has levels 30 to 40. Nagrand 40 to 50. Blade’s Edge 50 to 60. Netherstorm and Shadowmoon Valley 60 to 70.
  • Let’s say I pick Northrend. Then Borean Tundra has enemies between 10 and 25. Howling Fjord between 10 and 20. Grizzly Hills between 20 and 30. Dragonblight between 25 and 40. Zul’Drak between 40 and 50. Sholazar Basin between 50 and 60. Storm Peaks and Icecrown between 60 and 70.
  • Similarly for other expansions.
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Level scaling is personally for me a turn-off in Retail’s leveling system. It removes the sense of danger, growth, and progression that Classic WoW had. What if we had an optional Hard Mode that disabled zone scaling entirely, together with XP reductions to not speed through too fast, and revamped incoming damage and outgoing damage? This would restore the feeling of becoming stronger as you level—making lower zones trivial and higher zones deadly until you’re ready. The tech to support this already exists—look at dungeons. A level 23 and a level 34 can run the same dungeon because enemies scale individually for each player. The same could apply here: players who opt into Hard Mode experience fixed-level zones but can still group with others or queue for dungeons without issue. It’s a personal toggle and doesn’t affect others.

A solution to level scaling:

One concern with disabling zone scaling is how it fits into WoW’s current structure—max level is 70, period. With so many expansions and continents, how do we make this work? The answer is structured, bracketed progression—like Classic WoW, but adapted to Retail and The War Within.

Instead of universal scaling, the world is divided into fixed level brackets. Each zone keeps its original intended level range, and players progress naturally through a variety of expansion paths. You choose your route at every tier, with multiple options available. Here’s how it could work:

Level 1–49:
Includes all content from Vanilla, The Burning Crusade, Wrath of the Lich King, and Cataclysm. These expansions were originally designed to cover wide level ranges with natural progression. Players can choose freely among these expansions, progressing through fixed-level zones. Different parts of zones like Elwynn Forst would have different levels on the quests and mobs for the Hard Mode player, within the specified zone level.

Examples:

Elwynn Forest (Vanilla – Eastern Kingdoms): 5–10

Duskwood (Vanilla – Eastern Kingdoms): 20–30

Hellfire Peninsula (TBC – Outland): 20–30

Grizzly Hills (WotLK – Northrend): 40–45, etc

This ensures that players can choose all expansions before MoP as leveling options before lvl 50.

Level 50–60:
Players choose one full expansion from Mists of Pandaria, Warlords of Draenor, Legion, Battle for Azeroth, Shadowlands, or Dragonflight. The chosen expansion will have its continent set to fixed zone levels, with no scaling. Completing all zones naturally levels the character from 50 to 60.

Zones would differ from level to level, based on how expansion zones worked before, like Jade Forest 80-82. This would make sure you could not just skip to the last zone without facing big problems.

Examples:

Pandaria (MoP) fixed 50–60 progression

Draenor (WoD) fixed 50–60 progression

Broken Isles fixed (Legion) 50–60 progression

Kul Tiras or Zandalar (BFA) fixed 50–60 progression

Shadowlands zones (Shadowlands) fixed 50–60 progression

Dragon Isles (Dragonflight) fixed 50–60 progression

Level 60–70:
Hard Mode ends. Players enter The War Within with standard gameplay, systems, and scaling.

Hard Mode rules:

No Chromie Time, or only Chromie Time for level 50-60 to be able to enter wished content
No zone scaling
Reduced XP gain
Increased damage taken
Optional toggle per character can be turned off at any time
Automatically ends at level 60

This system preserves a sense of danger and achievement, allows every expansion to be meaningful again, and offers a true leveling challenge for players who want it—without affecting those who prefer modern scaling. Players can disable and enable this at any time, but if Blizzard makes it reward-based for reaching Lvl 60, disabling this after enabling it would remove eligibility for rewards on the character. This is something Blizz would put as a warning both before and after enabling it.

Please note, this is just me dreaming of how this would work. This is not perfect, I am not a developer, but this is just ONE idea on how to do a alternate gamemode for Retail Leveling. There are many other ways to do this, and I believe if other people also want the core idea of this, Blizz could invent this one way or another. Could be just like this, or a entirely different way of doing so.

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The problem is this game is an MMO, so more difficulty options are going to require more phasing. Just look at Diablo 3 for example (I mention it because I’m familiar with it), you can’t group hardcore and non hardcore characters, grouped characters share the same world difficulty.

Doing so would risk making the open world even more single player than it already is.

The only way I see this working is with a limited time event like remix, where everyone is funneled to the same zones and shares the same difficulty.

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That isnt a problem cuz the game will scale enemies to their appropiete levels for Non Hard Mode players. Phasing wont be needed. I appreciate your reply, but I think I mentioned this in my earlier chats, Blizz has the tech to seperate mob details from player to player, meaning that a lvl 15 player can still fight the same lvl 17 boar as a lvl 27, whereas the 27 character has the normal system and the boar for him is lvl 27. This tech is already in use in forexample dungeons.

2 Likes
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The problem is not the tech, the problem is the player experience. You can’t really have hardcore and non hardcore characters in the same phase, the non hardcore players won’t care that you’re hardcore and if they for example die and all the mobs leash to where a hardcore player is it will result in an untimely death.

Same if one character has 300% more health on mobs while others have it normal, you’re just going to get people that kill your mobs fast and make for a weird experience.

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This isnt about hardcore death = permanent mode. And this doesnt make sense, if every mob is adjusted to each players experience outside Hard Mode, that would work. All mobs leading to a player if another one dies, thats just wow game logic… of course your gonna have people kill it faster thats the point. Another solution is to make this hard mode exclusive to open world, where in dungeons you will have the same dmg output and HP on mobs as other players (although even this isnt the same anyway, depending on char level for players.)

In Open World this wouldnt be a problem as most players solo lvl anyway. I think Blizz could implement the features to fit without it being weird. We never thought they could make it not be weird with level scaling in dungeons, yet they made it work. So i think its posible.

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I am onboard for an optional slower more challenging leveling, but mana breaks, long CDs and whatever makes you take breaks outside of combat or make your combat slower/enter downtime just souns boring and annoying. The mob buffs when they are near each other, more dmg instead of dazw, and less “safe zones” are decent ideas though.

However the true challenge to implement this the roles. Blizzard are right, that the 3 roles need dofferent scaling rules, but yhe way they handled it was horible (tanks and healers just do more dmg in OW/mobs have less health). For tanks the ideal solution would be that they do more dmg in OW but they take more dmg as well, but idk what healer OW should look like.

1 Like