PTR Spoiler/Discussion Thread (Part 2)

It isn’t that they’re “made to look cool” in-universe, it’s that there is no functional difference in the utility of a very ornate sword design and a ‘realistic’ one in WoW. It’s a fiction, and its world does not behave in accordance to the same logics as ours - which it shouldn’t. There’s far better things art can be than a simulacrum of reality.

I just struggle to think of what a more appropriate reaction to her situation would be. I mean, allow me to transcribe what is said and how the characters react to what is said:

Alleria approaches Khadgar and they greet each other warmly.

Khadgar: It’s been too long, old friend.

Alleria: Good to see you, Khadgar. Doing well?

Khadgar chuckles a little as he weighs how to respond to that question.

Khadgar: As well as can be expected. How’s the family?

Alleria’s good mood falters and she sighs as she provides her answer to Khadgar’s question.

Alleria: I haven’t… It’s better if I keep my distance.

Khadgar reacts rather awkwardly to the change of mood, before he tries to move on, not knowing how to reassure Alleria.

Khadgar: Ah, of course. The Void… That would be, um… Ahem. Actually, your connection to the Void is why I asked you here.

Khadgar: We still don’t know what this Dark Heart relic is capable of. We do that it’s in the hands of someone called… the Harbinger.

Khadgar turns to Alleria to gauge her reaction. There is a pensive pause before Khadgar continues.

Khadgar: Who they are and what they intend to do remains a mystery… Which is why I need your help.

Alleria tries to lighten the situation with a little laughter and a playful comment.

Alleria: … To hunt down a dangerous foe we know nothing about? Honestly, I could use the distraction.

Khadgar: Same old Alleria! Void or no Void.

Alleria only reacts to Khadgar’s comment with an expression of uncertainty as she glances off to the side. Khadgar soon realises his mistake.

Khadgar: Ah… I didn’t mean to…

Alleria: See you soon, Khadgar. Dark Heart in hand.

Alleria turns to depart abruptly, leaving Khadgar looking somewhat concerned.

So, instead of this, how should she react to the reality of not being able to see the family that she loves due to her corruption, or an old friend’s comment that she is still the same person, without that person truly understanding the corruption that she has to wrestle with?

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I don’t necessarily take issue with the dialogue, its some of the most natural we’ve had since the RTS games. I take issue with the entire characterisation leading to this point, and some good dialogue doesn’t erase 8 years of bad as I’m sure we can all attest with still feeling the lingering stench of Shadowlands in this setting.

You did seem to be criticising this particular situation as an instance of “surprise that Alleria shoved her head into a leopard’s mouth and it bit her,” so I was just wondering how it could have been done better.

In my opinion, she’s reacting to her situation in a sane and sensible fashion, all things considered, rather than with shock and horror. In this scenario, she just has to deal with a bumbling old fool of a friend who doesn’t realise that her connection to the Void is a sensitive and tender topic for her.

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Absolutely! My appreciation for the subtler character acting present has grown since last night, it’s just that line of dialogue itself makes me groan – which again, isn’t out of line with Khadgar quotes, it’s my overall preference for less contemporary wording/phrasing in fantasy.

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I just disagree about it undercutting the Void, if only because of Alleria’s reaction. After all, she’s not the same old Alleria, she has been changed by the Void, no matter how much Khadgar wants to assure her otherwise.

If there’s one bit of criticism about the cinematic that I think is valid, it’s that they are putting a lot of effort into characterising Khadgar as a bit of a doddery, silly grandpa. He seems to be intentionally written as being a lot weaker than he once was.

One of their racials since Vanilla is called Diplomacy, and Khadgar has been one of the leaders of one of the most accepting cities, Shattrath, since The Burning Crusade. He’s also friends with Alleria since the Second War.

Did you all like Warcraft’s vibe at any point in its history, or is this a last hurrah for le wow bad type likebaiting posts before The Worldsoul Saga comes out?

I don’t get where people are pulling this ‘Alleria is somehow surprised the Void has not been great for her’ thing from? Like, what parts give people that impression?

All I see is a conversation with an old friend where they’re both trying to keep the mood light, while not really able to ignore the elephant in the room.
Now the Legion is defeated, the entire reason afaik that Alleria used void powers to start with, having to continue dealing with the ‘we have to win, no matter the cost’ fallout seems really rather natural?

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I jest. I actually like a less xenophobic Azeroth, because it opens more potential for intermingling in RP. As long as the writers don’t go too jarringly overboard with it!

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Tbh its something I’ve noticed on these very forums more often. People read stuff into things where I am like “wtf, how do you even come up with this?”

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Is it just me or is it getting crazier out there?

Characters and factions realising the point they should have stopped was an expansion or two ago and having continued sums up an enormous amount of Warcraft lore.

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Literally me with anything now a days :frowning:

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“DEREK IS GONNA BETRAY THE ALLIANCE, THE DAGGER SHOT THE DAGGER SHOT

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Lol lmao. He kinda did, tho? Since he’s a (somehow) non-existant Horde character, & Nathanos replacement, now? :stuck_out_tongue:

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Welp :frowning:

Tbh, I think most people thought that, I know I did.

But my example is more along the lines of:

Me: Sees something , thinks nothing wrong with it

Someone else: Mentions how this very thing is a racist/sexist charicature

Me: HOW?! ( ofc sometimes after explanation I then see their pov but at times i am still like ‘how’)

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I say this as someone doing a double masters w/ honours in Political Social Science and Quantitative Methodology:
Some people read far too deeply into what is ignorance and not malice
Some people don’t read far enough and think what is malice is simply ignorance
The Internet vastly amplifies the voices of extremists on both sides of this spectrum.

Edit: You can apply this trend generally to the Internet as a whole as well but that’s a very large pandora’s box that’s already starting to cause a large breakdown in societal cohesion between citizens in their nations as it begins to leak into the real world but no-one wants to talk about that yet because we don’t really have a solution for it so it’s just going to keep getting worse until we reach an event-horizon which is both going to be incredibly interesting to observe for scientific purposes but also horrific from a breakdown in societal functions perpsective.

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Given that this is going a bit off-topic , ill just say:

I favor that as punishment, your internet connection can be taken away for a year if you say too much dumb/inflammatory/hateful stuff.

Anyway, back onto topic from here on, if we wish to discuss it further, we may want to take it to pet peeve thread.

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huh! Now you’re throwing around fancy words to scare us off, aren’t you?

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