PvE gear should function properly in PvP. Change my mind!

So, I enjoy PvP, but I dislike PvE. Yet I have to grind PvE to be competitive in entry level PvP content.

You don’t see your own hypocrisy here?

We had good systems in the past. I don’t understand why those can’t be reintroduced. Why be stubborn and try to reinvent the wheel?

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thats not quite what i said though is it? nice cherry picking though.

Conquest gear should be BiS in PvP

PvE gear can function normally in PvP if it’s easiest to get gear through PvP and it has the highest ilvl and it functions 100% in PvE.

Otherwise stop trying to want to not do any serious PvP but still perform at the top in terms of gear by playing PvE.

It was actually EXACTLY what you said.

First of all, I want PvPers to be able to do PvE with the gear they earn from PvP as well… I am tired of repeating that statement again and again… So, I am not a hypocrite like you accuse me…

These systems were changed because they were not good and they got us where we are today… They did not change because devs tried to re-invent the wheel… They changed because back in the day someone was complaining like you do now…

^This statement, this one right here - coming from PvE players and with the addition of “I can kill a Mythic raidboss” too, is why PvP is a complete trainwreck. Nothing personal towards you, but the choir of PvE players with the very same statement.
These days regardless if you play PvE or PvP I think we can all agree on that PvP in general is sh*tshow. And it does bleed (PvP) player subs.

PvP USED to be good and pretty balanced with the occasional FOTM, but last time that happened was either because PvP gear or because of Templates that we saw in Legion, but templates wasn’t good enough for the PvE players… and now we have PvP as it is in BFA. So regardless how you twist and turn it, for PvP to be and feel great again, the PvE playerbase need to settle on either PvP gear or Templates with disabled borrowed powers like in Legion. Otherwise we will just have more of this… state.

I guess you can also turn it around: Why should PvP players be depending on what the PvE community wants and decides? How would you as a M+ player feel, if it was up to the OP PvP’ers to decide how hard tuned the affixes should be or how high you can reach with your PvE gear thus forcing you into spamming 3’s in order to get competetive gear? :stuck_out_tongue: I mean… that would make no sense.

This… community disagreement really should just end. Blizzard should either go back to impliment either PvP gear and make it BiS in PvP (my personal wish) or at the very least reimpliment templates - that everybody hated but its better than THIS… And stop listening to the cries of the PvE’ers.

I mean you chose to PvE from your own free will. PvP’ers want to be able to choose reaching for the stars in PvP without being forced into every other aspect of the game. I really cannot see why those two aspects of the game can’t live side by side as it used to?

People talk a lot about subs going down, imagine what good it could do to the game if PvP was allowed to be about… PvP. If it could be good and balanced and fun again, It could actually potentionally attract more players - and we want that… right?

I’m just like… argh… I KNOW that the PvE players equals the majority of the playerbase. I KNOW Blizzard want to cater to the majority, but at what cost. PvE players won’t budge on anything they try to do to balance, nothing is good enough. Now PvP as a whole is just left behind and they no longer care.

Whether or not you like it OP it is PvE players entitlement which has destroyed WoW PvP

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I’d say that most of them probably don’t care. Hell, many of the higher profile players were already doing PvE because they wanted that gear for PvP. It’s been going this way for god knows how long now. I don’t think its unfair of the PvP community to ask that the gear they earn through their main activity is also the best for it. PvE gear, again, doesn’t have to be useless. But it should never be better than PvP gear aquired at a similar level of play and the best PvP gear should always be better for PvP than the best PvE gear.

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The problem is how easy is to get gear in pve compared to pvp, thats something that needs to be fixed. I like that I can use the same item in both worlds, but I hate the fact that I have to spend 70% of the time doing pve to have a chance in pvp.
Right now in shadowlands u can buy only 197ilvl items for honor (someone did the math and you would have to do 380BG for full set), thats the same ilvl that drops from m+6, which u can do in 30 minutes, or you can spend days in battlegrounds for it. Doesnt seem fair.
And Im not even starting about chest rewards from pvp and pve.

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See??? You get it unlike many other folks here…

This is exactly what I advocate…

People who think I have no right to talk about PvP just because I am “PvEer” should remember I am not really a PvEer… I play both PvE and PvP ( and I am not the only one… ) I am a MMO-RPG player!

There shouldn’t be such distinction as “PvEer” and “PvPer” between players… It creates many problems, and one of them is that PvP will continue to be neglected… That’s the harsh reality…

But was always a core part of the game? :woman_shrugging: It has always been so since the very start, hence why we had PvP and PvE servers. Hence why there was elite sets for PvP, and Raid sets for PvE, hence why we got Battlegrounds.
It WAS that way, now it is no more. Now everybody is a PvE’er because you apparantly HAVE to if you wanna PvP.

The destinction IS completely removed… By PvE’ers and Blizzard catering to them, thats a fact. And that is why -again- PvP is in the state that it is, and it is what make people leave. Because whether or not you as a player in a group of greedy PvE’ers who wants the best of all worlds, there is a rather large amount of people who prefers to PvP, and nothing BUT PvP.

And all those people, could potentionally have had subs and played wow, but they don’t - they play other games to get their PvP now.
I personally held on to the PvP in WoW right up until BFA (I used to live a breathe PvP), now I too seek other games to get my PvP, and if PvP continues to stay as it is I might actually have to consider whether or not I wanna game this in the future :frowning:
And I too am not the only one… I too am a player - just saying

That’s what I talking about. I have job, some reponibilitie, and go to the game for relax . And What I get? I must spent 70-80% pf game time duing raids, looking for raids party also is a quest. So I won’t pay to blizard anymore. PvE’rs to much crying and blizard do everyting for them. But nothing to PvP’rs.

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Sure you can walk away anytime… Nothing holds you here…

You fail to understand that as long as PvP is treated as a completely disconnected game, there will be PvPers and PvEers… And Blizzard will cater to the group with the most numbers… Cry as much as you like… Call them “greedy”, “fil**y casuals” and whatnot but the reality is not going to change… PvErs beat you in numbers…

This is exactly why I want the complete unification of both PvP and PvE… If more people (not all) start to play both PvP and PvE there will be a backlass everytime ANY OF THE TWO is neglected… Right now, PvEers couldn’t care less about PvP and with PvPers leaving the game that means 90% of the budget will go to PvE content to keep the majority of the playerbase satisfied… Yes, there are many MMO-RPGs out there which treat PvP as end-game content and PvE is just a way to reach it (especially the asian ones), of course the hardcore PvP-only players will prefer those ones…

And here comes what I propose… Reduce the PvE loot, increase the PvP loot… Make the PvEers to give PvP a shot as they will need it to gear up faster… Turn them from PvEers/PvPers to players! But that will never happen if we revert back to seperate gear for PvE and PvP… Yes, I know that the “PvP only” folks here will not be satisfied… But I argue that this will revitalize the PvP content as well as more and more people will start PvPing again (yes PvEers used to PvP before Cata and MoP)

Don’t believe me? Take yourselves as an example… You had to do PvE this expansion, but you did not quit, you are still here after giving PvE a shot! Do you really think that none of the PvPers enjoyed the PvE they tried? What if you get more gear from PvP in SL while having the option to do SOME PvE content to gear up even faster?? Would it be that terrible?? Think about it…

Far from everyone sees the game the same way that you do. Doing PvE as well as PvP is not feasible for a lot of people due to time contraints. People just can’t afford to play 4+ hours a day to do both, you know.

It might sound ideal to you, it doesn’t at all to a whole lot of others.
This is something you have to understand, and due to the way that PvP is… its actually a great outlet for some short or inconsistent sessions (or both). And I don’t think its right to handicap those people in doing what they like to do.

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If you work hard for pvp gear then it should be just as good in pve also if I’m understanding you correctly. Oh wait it’s not, and should never be.

PVP gear for PVP
PVE gear for PVE

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Why exactly do you think its fair for either side to have to do conent they dont enjoy to get gear they need to be competative? it just doesn’t make sense?

We are simply not “giving PvE a shot” we are doing it as it makes us the most competative, some may give it a shot, granted. But for those who log in just to do arena’s because thats the only thing they enjoy why is it fair that they are forced to do something they dont enjoy just to enhance their experience?

Your talking like WoW is the first and only game that has two aspects of the game, PvE and PvP, as though its completely alien. Its like your trying to unify bodybuilders to strongmen, sure they go to the same gym and use the same equipment, but they train and compete in completely different worlds.

Source please. Blizzard makes changes for the worse quite often.

Even if the gear stats are unified, Blizzard will continue to cater to PvEers and give them the easiest gearing process. M+ spam all day, erryday, even with the nerf.

PvEers will throw a far greater hissy fit than we do over this. And Blizzard actually listens to the PvE crowd, so that would be a very short-lived change.
The second PvEers feel like they should do some PvP, things will turn extremely ugly.

I did quit. Several times. Then I came back to see if it was still terrible, and it was. I did not enjoy the PvE I tried. But I did participate, because I wanted to do arenas. And I don’t think I’m alone in this.

This actually wouldn’t be terrible. Getting SLIGHTLY ahead by doing some PvE isn’t something I’m against at all.
The current problem is the obligatory, no-choice PvE spamfest. So we agree here.

Such attitudes aren’t healthy imo. I don’t need to be a writer to recognize a bad book, I don’t need to be an actor to recognize bad acting, you don’t need 2.4K rating and be a multiglad to have an opinion on PvP.
Heck, I’m probably considered by many to be a casual, unskilled pleb unworthy of saying my piece as well because my rating is really bad.

We disagree on a lot of things, but I wouldn’t dream of denying you the right to have an opinion. Seeing perspectives from people outside an echo-chamber of likeminded people is important.

The problem is that they can’t be unified, not really. As long as the method of acquiring gear differs, one will come out on top, the other one at the bottom.
In a perfect world, Blizzard would balance things so that someone who does PvP of a certain level would gear up as fast as a PvEer who gears up doing comparably challenging PvE content, but Blizzard can’t do that. It would be a difficult feat for anyone, and an impossible feat for Blizz, who has a dirt-poor track record for these things.

Swapping to another gear set for PVP would be about the only interesting extra thing I would carry around in my bags. I would welcome having 2 gear sets. 3 in fact. One for tank spec, one for dps and pvp gear. Absolutely no problem with this at all. It gives the game meaningful depth.

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as someone who enjoys doing all content (on a more casual level) in wow, i feel safe in telling you your point is moot.

i had a set of gear for pvp, one for st, one for cleave and one for m+. that’s just for one spec alone.

i’d much rather prefer having 1 set for pvp that i can obtain while doing pvp and another for pve while doing you guessed it, pve.

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