PvE vs PvP Difficulty and Rewards

Community General Discussion
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So, I just finished a +15 Freehold key during tyrannical affix week for my weekly chest. It was the first time I ever stepped into that dungeon, we got a 2 chest and I didn’t even die once.

It basically took me 30min of jumping around and healing without knowing the mechanics to get my 475ilvl piece of gear in my weekly chest through pve.

But to get a 475ilvl piece of gear in your weekly chest through pvp you have to be in the top 1% bracket of the PvP playerbase, and spend 2 hours to cap conquest points.

This is just funny to me.

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On the one side its a bit too hard to gear by pvp. On the other hand, freehold isn’t a good example, short of egregious mess ups you shouldn’t wipe or die with your gear.

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and those 2% pvpers are mythic raiders xD

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M+ has always been too much rewarding, +15 are not hard enough to justify giving max level gear. I wish they made pvp and pve gear different again with resilience and pvp power so pvp gear would be good for pvp but bad for pve and the opposite for pve gear.
But this thread honestly smells like a classic childish " lul pve easy, pvp hard" thread.

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You are right. This is insane. In pvp you play vs players who usually have brain, who can use different tactics. In pve you play always the same things, even +1 is almost the same as + 15, you just need a better gear, NPC will never do anything unusual. But now wow completely a pve game, you can check even 2900-3000+ players and will see they all have almost only pve items and a few items they got for pvp, lol 3k is not enough for a good pvp gear. I can only imagine how it would be if someone switched it and for 1800 arena rating you would get 490 i lvl and for +15 keys 475 and for mythic raids 480. The forum would exploded, because “pve players matter” for blizzard unlike pvp players :frowning:

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Welcome to the world of mythic+ dude. This game basically gives 95% of your good stuff in mythic+ runs.

Now try getting 475 from mythic raiding. See how easy that is.

Spoiler alert: it isn’t.

But yea. Generally speaking, pvp gearing is harder than pve, even if there wasn’t mythic+ in it. Simply because most of your item gains are just shots in the dark and not actually the way it used to be with pvp vendors.

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Whilst i agree with you that part is a blantant lie.

Freehold in 470 gear already and on easy affixes pretty unfair assessment tbh .

I agree pvp needs a better gearing system . Try TD or WM on different affixes then say its easy.

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But the BiS trinkets, weapons and Azerite all come from raiding .

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The M+ gear printing press is ridiculous, and its even been nerfed from Legion too.
Realistically M+ should drop 1 piece of gear, per party, per run.

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You have titan residuum that comes exclusively from mythic+. So that solves your azerite issue. Specially since you get to choose what you want.

Weapons? Mythic+ weapons are fine.

But yea. The trinket is a thing. Hence 95%. And even those mostly drop from the first 2~3 bosses anyways. So no big deal. The overwhelmingly higher number of item drops from mythic+ allows for a better chance of corruption and sockets, which basically means, you have a better chance of BIS from mythic+ as well.

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Except the azerite pieces that drop on raid are BiS for all 3 slots for about 29/36 specs making TR useless .
Weapons wise for example nothing can touch the Skitra bow for BM or Ra Dens weapons for DH.

If you want the best gear with best stats ,traits and corruptions then raiding even though slower it still best way to gear .

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To be honest, freehold is pretty much a free key every week, especially this one where there is not really much going on.
And the average group with corruptions even if 460-465lvl, vastly outdps the content itself.
Ilvl doesn’t matter that much anymore, corruptions does, so a 475 from a +15 isn’t that big of a deal.

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Yeah, “a bit”. I agree, and then some.

Gearing in PvP is too hard to a ridiculous degree. Like it’s actually insanely, stupidly hard.

In order to hit the same level of rewards as M+ 15, you don’t just need to hit Duelist, you need to hit Elite. It’s Elite that drops a 475 in the chest. Duelist drops a 470.

Now, for most seasons in BfA, 2.4k has been the top 1% to top 0.5%. 2.7k is basically rank 1 territory; there are very few people up there.

2.1k is around the 3% mark.

So yeah, if we are to assume Blizzard believes that PvP and PvE are equally rewarding, Blizzard believes that under 1% of the PvE playerbase is capable of beating a M+ 15.

Which is completely absurd. It’s actually insane.

And not only that, but once you get to 2.4k, many of the rewards are actually worse than the PvE ones. For Feral, you want a particular weapon and trinket from Ny’alotha at least, and you want another trinket from Junkyard. Without these you don’t really stand much of a chance at hitting 2.4k in the first place, and there is no equivalent from PvP to these items.

So yeah, it’s a complete and utter joke. PvP reward rating requirements need to come down by 300. 475 items should drop from your chest from playing at 2.1k.

And don’t even get me started on the randomness. PvP has one consistent source of rewards, and that source just so happens to be dropping 460 level items towards the end of season. It’s a joke.

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I used Freehold as an example because it was the key that I had completed prior to my post, but same goes for any +15 key, they’re all insanely easy to complete, the reward is not linear with the difficulty of the content.

And you got it all wrong about corruptions being more important than ilvl. After the corruption vendor being added to the game, ilvl and secondary stats matter the most. Since you can now just buy the corruption that you want and add it on.

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I don’t think m+ rewards should require a higher key, I think pvp rewards should be lowered. Problem is with their new higher ilvl from last 2 bosses they cant make 485 gear drop without it instantly being BiS so are limited to 475.

Also unlike PvP, you can easily outgear m+.

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They’re easy because corruption boosted up the dmg with no effort.
Look at fire mages, the average guy moved from 50k to 100k in the spawn of a vendor rotation.

In general, yes.
In reality, the difference that a 5-10 ilvl on an item gives you compared to what a corruption do, it’s insane.
I mean, if i get an item with TD3 on, i’ll use it even if it’s 450.

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Even if you leave the whole difficulty of PvE vs difficulty of PvP debate aside, you can easily see that waaaaaaaay more people can complete their weekly 15 (you don’t even need to time it, mind you) compared to those who reach 2400 rating in a season. And those two levels produce equal rewards. The weekly +15 is more comparable to 2100 rating or maybe even 1800, in terms of difficulty and the effort it takes to get there.

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hm, yes it is not, but try to up 2400+, this is not easy - this is imposible for most players. if you want to close a mythic raid you need to be not lazy, if you want to take 2400+ not being lazy rly doesn’t help a lot.

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I’ve always found PvP to be far more demanding than PvE when it comes to any aspect of the game.

It’s not a gameplay I particularly enjoy but I have been forced into it at various points over many expansions. This is why I have a puny rating :rofl:

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FH is one the easiest dungeons and the affixes these week are super easy also, even with Tyranical, but I fully agree that high rated pvp vs a M+15 is a big difference for the same ivl reward, It’s silly, M+ is waaaaay easier.
thats why I think they should bring back PvP gear with PvP stats, that would kinda fix the problem.

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