Still doesnt exist when BE decided to drain magic for lives. (2003)
yes we are quiet living from the topic.
Leave humans, sister. They lie to you and they only want your bed like typical Human Male Paladins and Human Male Mages
It’s confirmed in the lore of the High Elves that they got to be near moonwells. Back from vanilla to WotLK, Quel’Lithien lodge had a moonwell with one of the High Elven NPC near the moonwell, having a flavor text saying that it makes things easier being near one.
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On topic:
Speculation/lore crafting
What I think we might see in Midnight, with the theme of reunification of the elven tribes, being that Vereesa no longer will just be the Silver Convenant leader but the actual leader of the remaining High Elves in general. It might explain her new model with the new tabard. So she goes from Silver Convenant to Quel’dorei leader. I can see an armistice coming into play, where family members of the elves finally reunite. But I feel that the High Elves will still keep their faction loyalty [insert reason here].
I genuinely hope, they won’t, with the reunification get rid of the separate “tribes”. But having them live together in a shared kingdom instead.
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That’s not entirely accurate in that they ‘got’ to be. Moonwells are strange things, but as far as I understand it they contain some of the waters of the well of eternity from below Nordrassil, which means there is probably an element of arcane magic contained within the liquid. It probably soothed that Elf’s addiction to a degree.
Also in broader new patch 11.2.7 has been announced containing the lorewalking regarding the Elves focusing on the origin of the Blood Elves and the Void Elves.
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That’s exciting and terrifying news. Do you think they might retcon things with it or just confirm the current established* lore?
Lodges or stayed with their alliance allies.
What culture did the BE come from? yep they are the OG.
Did not consume fel, aren’t traitors, exile from their homeland. Its quite a nice backstory for a race.
Keep checking it then, you are clearly missing some bits.
I think people focus too much on the line Elven reunification. As far as we know it was an off-hand comment from Metzen that could portend anything. But SHARING Quel’thalas is the LEAST likely outcome. Remember, that is a Horde kingdom and they’ve already gone on record recognising the sensitivity over merely opening Silvermoon up let alone ‘sharing’ the Kingdom.
Elven reunification could simply be the Blood Elves and the Void Elves deciding to come together to focus on the threat to Quel’thalas. The lorewalking focuses on how those two groups divided after all.
However it pans out, I think it would be a mistake to believe that Alliance High Elves will get an equal share of the narrative spotlight over the two playable groups. At best they will get a bit part, the equivalent of a narrative nod, which so far is what they have received. If there are any other Alliance High Elves other than Veressa who get much attention I will be quietly surprised.
And my own hope remains. Originally, the reason they took Illidan’s teachings was that the alternative was supposed to be death. Had they held fast to their original conception, there would be no Alliance High Elves. However, in what surely must be the most regretted retcon in WoW’s gaming history, they changed it so that withdrawal was survivable. Which is why Alliance High Elves, as tiny a group as they are, are still around. But with Void Elves replacing them as the foil for the Blood Elves in the Alliance, and a far more effective one, this is the best moment to retire them with some dignity rather than shoving them back into obscurity as will surely happen once we move past the Last Titan.
They’ll do what they did with other lorewalking, stitch together relevant questlines that already exist and create some new content to bridge the gaps.
I expect the section of the Blood Elf heritage armour questline where Sylvanas died, a brand new section where the Sunwell is fouled and Kel’Thuzad raised, a section where Umbric is exiled, Alleria nearly tainting the well and ending with the creation of the Void Elves in their allied race unlock. Most of that is already confirmed in their 11.2.7 notes, only the Umbric exile is my supposition.
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From a “crowd” to “everyone” is quite the jump.
So no we are not in agreement.
And for some it simply isn’t.
A possibility although unlikely.
Not a hail mary, but not a nail in the coffin. If anything the leaks so far show they are their own place in the story. eliminating them would eliminate part of the BE story as well.
A possibility, which again, I find unlikely. If anything the VE might get back into the fold, since they are Blood Elves.
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2 spots where there is 1 Night elfe wood house
Quel’danil : no named HE npc, led by a draenei girl
Quel’lithien : fentanyl elves, no more high elves
Allerian Stronghold : 5-6 npc including inkeeper food/repair random npc , 0 elven guards - only humans .
Farstriders lodge : 1 HE (the innkeeper)
Did not consume fel, aren’t traitors.
blood elves drain MAGIC from many sources, including fel. but not draining FEL
its like harvesting Ethanol from many sources like different fruits (these elves are nightborns hehe)
There are High Elven rangers on the walls.
You can find the list of names high elves npcs back here:
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Allerian_Stronghold
Three known surviving High Elves:
- Renthar Hawkspear
- Kirkian Dawnshield
- Kriss Goldenlight
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Its poor quality bait. Just Ignore.
Wow these look fantastic!
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I know, I’ll be actively farming them.
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as I said 6.
i know I roam everywhere is possible to find HE/BE/VE npc to add first names on my list
I took a trip to Allerian Stronghold for the first time in years literally as I write, one of my Alliance toons idling there.
The Alliance High Elves are outnumbered by Human residents, and there are only three Alliance High Elf Rangers manning the walls. It’s also only a small outpost…it has A population but it is also frozen in time…we know Auric Sunchaser returned to Azeroth and the rest probably did too.
Whether they survived the destruction of Theramore or Dalaran or perished in a battle or even became a Void Elf, who knows.
It’s been a week, but I’ve been away from my computer so I wasn’t in a capacity to respond.
Faction diversity. It’s been mentioned by people after this post that both factions are awash in neutral races. Pandaren were seen as a mistake during BFA, but apparently they’ve gone back, as the last two races and the next upcoming race are for both factions. Forgetting my previous point that you can’t tell the difference between a Void Elf and a Blood Elf from afar, the appearance of Pandaren/Dracthyr/Earthen and soon, Haranir further blurs the line between the factions. You may argue that the neutral races have their unique flavour (Huojin vs Tushui, Dark Talons vs Obsidian Warders) but aside from flavour text, it’s hard to argue that the neutral races don’t homogenise the factions.
Yes, vanilla had the issue that the alliance didn’t have access to bloodlust and the Horde couldn’t enjoy bubble hearthing, but the fact still remains that there was a clear faction identity during vanilla, and with trading the exclusive classes, it certainly made the development easier on the team, but that doesn’t change the fact that the factions started to be homogenised.
I’ve already made my arguments and have presented evidence that there are some allied races that are almost practically identical to their parent races, so I won’t retread that same ground again. If you think antlers and having a higher calorie count constitutes enough of a difference but being uncorrupted by fel magic/having tattoos isn’t, well, that’s an opinion of yours that I will have to respect, but nevertheless, disagree with.
Your quote from Night of the Dragon, which I have seen now a few times, lacks context
So when I present a quote from a source of lore, I’m lacking context, but…
We don’t need to ‘over-rely’ on the answer. The answer should be sufficient.
How can you reconcile the two arguments? On one hand you respond to a direct quote with scepticism but on the other you insist on a very select part of a developer response being holy writ: chapter, and verse. I can’t see the consistency.
Rommath mentions that, during the Pandaria campaign that the blood elves used fel crystals to enslave demons. This idea that blood elves only had fel crystals to rebuild the city while the remaining population didn’t use fel is intellectually dishonest and whitewashes the darker side of their story. And from what some of the quests I’ve seen from the alpha indicate, it seems that there are still plenty of Blood Elf fel users out there.
And ‘anything can happen’ is the standard Blizzard way of saying no, but saying no in such a way it isn’t used against them later as ‘you think you want it but you don’t’ is. What we have here is a classic case of not liking the answer you got and then trying to discredit it. You are using all the greatest hits! He’s just one man!
I once again state that many additions to WoW would not have been possible had it not been for fan persistence.
As for Maria Hamilton, the presence of Alliance High Elves does not equal them being added as a playable race, which is really what this is about. Nothing she said in any way contradicts what Ion has said on this matter.
Ion had the opportunity to simply take the mic and say “for the last time, blood elves are high elves” but simply allowed someone else to take the question.
your extremely narrow preferences.
Please don’t put words in my mouth nor cast aspersions as to what I prefer.
I’m happy with a High Elf AR, but I’d also be happy if we got an unlockable suite of high elven customisations for Void Elves. As for “breaking” racials, the Man’ari suite actually changes the appearance of Gift of the Naaru to something more fel themed, so I wouldn’t mind if the void elf racial for high elves gets changed to something arcane.
On Silverglade Refuge: And it’s a terrible response. The entire point of the ‘hidden elef settlement’ suggestion was to provide extra elves to beef up the Alliance High Elves lorewise. This isn’t a hidden settlement, it is a newly created outpost. It’s a nicer lodge in any words.
Hey! Please put that goalpost back where it belongs!
You previously argued that the idea of finding High elf settlements would be ludicrous and delusional, and yet we’ve got one. While you do argue that it doesn’t have evidence of “new” high elves, we can’t say for sure, since it’s alpha.
In case you weren’t aware, his answer in the interview alongside Lore was actually the second time he had been asked the question. He was asked during the aforementioned stream.
So Ion, in his infallibility, claimed in that stream that High Elves have all gone quietly into the night and have been absorbed into Blood Elf and Void Elf settlements. But, there is empirical evidence that contradicts this. Ignoring the continuous addition of High Elf NPCs in the expansion, you simply only need look at the previous paragraph to know that High Elves (i.e.: the loyalist faction of High Elves who are fiercely loyal to the alliance and are radically anti horde) are still very much a force. If what Ion said is correct, why isn’t Silverglade Refuge a void elf settlement like Windrunner Village?
Population doesn’t matter. FOR VOID ELVES. They transform other Elves and there are more than enough Blood Elves in the world to spare a few for the Void Elves
Firstly, yes, you are being selective, and deciding that population matters for one race but not for another, which is hypocritical. Population should either matter for everyone or no one. How many Lightforged Draenei can you realistically fit in the Xenedar? Do the Highmountain Tauren have a widespread empire of settlers beyond the Broken Isles?
You mention that Void Elves can simply just corrupt more Blood Elves to add to their number but so far there hasn’t been any canonical case where they have had a “recruitment drive”. You have a few scholars here and there, but unlike Sylvanas, who did concern herself with population during Cataclysm and tried to use the Valkyr to raise more people to undeath, the Void Elves haven’t actively prosletysed their lifestyle. But as always, maybe this maybe addressed with the voidstorm story.
Because remember, if not now then when?
Well, the Haranir weren’t added in War Within, and now they’re added in Midnight, and before you say “well the devs said their story fits Midnight” as far as the information available right now, Harandar is quite out of place in comparison to Quel’thalas, Zul’Aman, and the Voidstorm.
So, Last Titan, maybe?
I’d be more open to the idea they could add customisations to Void elves to approximate High Elves in the same way they are adding amani customisations to Darkspear Trolls
I want to end this post on a positive. Thank you for admitting that. Honestly, anything could happen but I’m starting to soften my stance on customisations. If we get an unlockable suite of high elf customisations as well as more class options like paladin, I’ll stop banging my drum on these forums and actually enjoy the game. 
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What should be the playable high elves dance ?
I vote for :
I must confess… I still believe…
On Faction Diversity: The Pandaren were indeed viewed as a mistake due to being introduced as neutral for a time. However we now have additional context from some recent interviews where it was revealed that new races are limited in that they have to be built using existing skeletons (to avoid contributing to the tech burden of having to ensure all armor fits every skeleton) and that they have to make narrative sense. Time and cost are clearly factors that have been weighing on the WoW team.
Yet each neutral race is specifically introduced as neutral and at the same time. They were not faction locked for two decades and then shared.
Arguing about the factions having a clearer faction identity in Vanilla due to classes is a bit of a red herring. Not only is it hard to sustain when seven of the nine classes were shared, but the gameplay downsides of that choice were actively hurting in the game in that it placed Shaman and Paladin class design in unnecessary conflict with each other. In other words, you are citing a gameplay mistake so egregious that there was no way it was going to be let stand and the cost to faction diversity by making them available to both sides massively outweighed that cost.
On your assertion you presented evidence regarding the closeness of some allied races to their parents, you fail to appreciate that the real problem is that proposed Alliance High Elves would be identical. Because they are the same race as Blood Elves, with the same culture, hooked up to the same magic source. So yes, multiple allied races are NEARLY the same. As stated previously I think most allied races would have worked as extra customisations for existing races. But NEARLY the same is not the same as identical. Furthermore, those races which are nearly the same to their parents are all on the same faction as their parent. In fact, the two allied races that are the most different from their parents are Void Elves and Nightborne, and it is not too hard to surmise that Blizzard put in the extra effort there given the parent races of those groups were core races on the other faction.
On the Night of the Dragon Quote vs the Ion quote: This is a false equivalence. You are quoting a book character, written by Richard A Knaak, who would have written that character with a certain point of view, certain biases and certain opinions. This is why I sought, and still seek, the necessary context. On the other hand, Ion is Game Director.
If you cannot see why I would value the words of the Game Director more than a quote you have given me which entirely lacks context (who, what, when, where why and page number would help) then I have to assume you think you had a gotcha moment to nail me for perceived hypocrisy but you don’t. These two things are not alike.
As for the answer from the developer, how is it a select quote? It was taken from a Q and A that covered many subjects. His answer was direct and to the point at the time. It’s not as if he was being coy or anything. This is an example of framing, you are attempting to imply the quote is not as strong as implied.
As for Fel Crystals, if he mentioned he used them for other acts of magic then that is what happened, but remember the point you are arguing for is that consumption of fel magic was direct and widespread among the entire population of Blood Elves as a means of differentiating them from Alliance High Elves. Having not played or paid attention to the alpha all that much I cannot comment as to how widespread Blood Elf use of the fel is in the present day, but the salient point is that consumption of the fel is not needed since Blood Elves and Alliance High Elves are both hooked up to the Sunwell. In other words, this fails as a point of differentiation.
On fan persistence: You are free to argue that, and of course there are many examples of when Blizzard has acceded. Yet on this particular matter we are closing in on two decades and still no movement. This is where the success of those other requests becomes malignant, you cite them as holding out the possibility of success yet the very fact they have not given it when they have given on so much else means that it is incredibly unlikely they are going to in retail. In reality the request probably died the moment they gave Void Elves the normal skin tones in much the same way Amani Troll hopes perished with the addition of Amani customisations to existing Trolls.
On the Maria Hamilton Quote: Except that wasn’t the question. The question was about whether Alliance High Elves or other Elven tribes would be present in the story and the answer was yes. Which we already knew was going to happen. Whether that involvement is greater than Veressa Windrunner uttering a line or two remains to be seen but given there was already confirmation that they won’t be dwelling on events such as the purge of Dalaran I think any hopes for a deeper, meaningful engagement involving the Alliance High Elves is probably wishful thinking. Likely they will be focusing on the thematic split between the Void Elves and the Blood Elves which mirrors that of the actual expansion itself. The new lorewalking also emphasises this divide, with attention given to how the Void Elves came to be yet no mention given to any references to Alliance High Elves, who may not feature in the quest chain at all.
On narrow preferences: You have a suite of high elf approximate customisations on Void Elves.
The Man’ari racial is still the same racial, I have to surmise based on the name and functionality that they have been blessed by the Naaru because they are repentant so it is a nice little lore flourish to reflect their past. Which is why your parallel doesn’t work, you would still have to be a Void Elf for the Void racials to make sense. That and you would still bleed purple.
On Silverglade Refuge: There is no moving of the goalposts. You were previously suggesting that there could hidden settlements out in the world we hadn’t found yet with the implication that they could be used to address the Alliance High Elves greatest lore deficiency, the fact they are extremely low population group. That was a ludicrous suggestion. New construction in a previously desolate area involving the few remaining Alliance High Elves does not fall under that discussion.
On Ion’s ‘infallibility’: Ion’s primary point has always been that Alliance High Elves aren’t playable because Blood Elves are High Elves are the same race and they aren’t adding the same race to the game a second time. As for Silverglade Refuge as I understand it the NPCs there have not been populated it yet. Let’s not make of this place a second Allerian Stronghold which is held up as a massive centre for Alliance High Elves by virtue of name alone when if you go there you find six named Alliance High Elf NPCs, three nameless Alliance High Elf guards and a lot more Humans.
As for where they came from, my own suspicion is that with the destruction of every other location thought of as a High Elf hub this is probably the last gasp of the Silver Covenant who had to find a new place to live.
On Population: I am not the one who decided population matters for one group and not another, Blizzard did that. As I believe you pointed out Void Elves were introduced as a crack squad at the Blizzcon BFA was announced at, yet as I have shown by linking the Jesse Cox stream at the same Blizzcon, Ion was quite happy to still dismiss Alliance High Elves partly on the grounds they just really aren’t around but of course mostly for faction diversity reasons.
As for your other examples, clearly more than Alliance High Elves. The Xenedar was the same size as the Exodar, the Botanica, the Mechanaar and the Arcatraz. Three of them were dungeons, one was a capital city. Just because we only saw a fraction of the city ship, which I have to remind you housed an entire army of ligthforged as well as their weaponry, does not mean there was no room for them.
The Highmountain Tauren didn’t need an Empire. There were multiple villages strewn about Highmountain, several tribes and a central capital.
Mechagnomes have a whole city and a whole zone.
Vulpera had several tribes and caravans wandering Vol’dun. Nightborne had a whole city. Kul Tirans their very own continent. Dark Iron Dwarves have an underground city and a civilization spread across several zones. Zandalari Trolls have a huge city and an Empire covering an entire continent. Earthen have a city. There were plenty of Dracthyr in several different hibernation chambers in the Forbidden Reach. The Haranir have the run of an entire zone.
And yes, the Void Elves can recruit from both Blood Elves and Alliance High Elves. Mass proselytising is not necessary. So long as they CAN offer the transformation then a pathway exists to create new Void Elves.
It is kind of curious how you are seemingly determined to go through every race in the game to find a group that you unimpeachably argue is equivalent in numbers to Alliance High Elves in an attempt to invalidate the population argument yet with each attempt all you do is confirm and reconfirm that the Alliance High Elves are exactly as described, the remnant of a remnant.
On the Haranir not being added TWW: That’s a reach. The Haranir were intended to be added in TWW, there is datamining and anecodatal evidence supporting this. Harandar was supposed to be the climax of our journey where we would finally meet Azeroth. Metzen’s return and the extension of the plot across three expansions put paid to that, and Harandar was shuffled into the following expansion. They are a victim of the narrative split Metzen’s decision caused. The Haranir still fit, as their role in the overarching saga has been extended to encompass three rather than just one expansions. Midnight however was conceived of as a part of the saga and built as such. Which does heavily emphasise, ‘if not now, when?’. Which is clearly a rhetorical question to a degree, as the answer is if they don’t do them now they are never doing them. Amani customisations remove the long proposed counterpart for them from the board as well.
On my openess to High Elf customisations on Void Elves: You did leave out that I pointed out Void Elves already got those customisations. I actually don’t think you need more, particularly when I find it objectionable that some wish to use Void Elves as a vector to realise their High Elf fantasy and that is grossly unfair to void elf players, many of whom want deeper void customisations. A void elf is, at the end of the day, a void elf. So I am afraid it is not as positive as you wish. I actually think that request is both selfish and greedy given it comes at the expense of Blood Elves (whose theme you want to encroach on) and Void Elves (whose theme you wish to water down). Void Elves already have enough High Elf customisations. This is why we know Amani Troll customisations are coming to Darkspear and why the Alliance isn’t getting an equivalent, because what the Alliance equivalent would be is already in the game. What you have now is probably all you are going to get. And what you got was extensive.
They consumed Fel tainted Arcane Magic. Not direct Fel itself. Well at least not most of them. Kael’thas After his crisis of faith in Outland and his most devoted followers did take on pure Fel. Even that it lasted only 4 years. Which is funny that you hold this as a important sign. As for the next point?
Traitors Of freaking What? Alliance? The kingdom of Quel’dalar withdrew from the Alliance after the Second War back when the entire race was called HIGH ELVES. It’s one of the reasons Garrithos hated Elves more than other races (don’t get me wrong he still was bigoted human supremacist)l believing other races exists only to secure Humanity’s interests). Even before that the Horde had to actually threathen them for the current king to provide more than token assistance. Considering that Second war lasted ONLY 3 Years that would mean the High Elves as an entirety were only Part of the Alliance for less time than the Blood Elves spent relying on Fel Tainted Arcane and Living beings for their magic addiction needs.
Yes I’m aware that for the two Living Windrunner Sisters do believe that Elves redemption = Alliance but honestly they’re not exactly unbiased considering they both hooked up with Human husbands.
As for the Exile. Yeah that happened. Ultimately under all of this Lor’themar was never cut to be a full on leader. He’s a Frontline General pushed into the office and the situation was dire. The Arcane Addiction was a real threat, the Scourge was relentless. To make matters worse the Prince left for Outlands after almost getting killed by Human leader of the Alliance. And Lor’themar had to ensure there was still a country by the time the Prince delivers the promised solution and takes his throne back. Exile wasn’t a good solution but what else was there to do?
HE brothers & sisters , my advise is :
Its better to play a blood elf model in the sin’dorei society but claiming you re politicaly different than wait for another 20~ years with hope to finally see another ugly new allied race instead of HE
https://ibb.co/Y77Q7mfL
High elves! High elves! I know high elves very well, believe me, the best elves, nobody knows them better than me, folks. Tremendous elves, really fantastic. But listen up, high elves, it’s time to make America—er, I mean, the blood elves—great again! We’ve got the best mounts, the hawkstriders, so strong, so beautiful, nobody rides better than us, okay?You high elves with your unicorns, very nice, very elegant, but let me tell you, they’re not winning any wars! We need you to join the blood elves—tremendous decision, the best decision. We’ll build a powerful alliance, folks, the likes of which you’ve never seen. I’ll negotiate the deal, the art of the deal, and you’ll be part of something huge, really huge. Come on, high elves, you’re smart, you’re classy, but you’re missing out! Join us, bring your magic, your unicorns, and we’ll make the blood elves unstoppable. Together, we’ll have the best empire, better than anyone, and we’ll win so much, you’ll get tired of winning! Let’s do this—join me, join the blood elves, now! Thank you, tremendous, thank you!
