Moral story the humans are evil
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May I remind you that Orcs invaded a foreign planet under orders of literal cosmic evil, slaughtered entire populations of many towns including Darkshire, Moonbrook, Goldshire and a large portion of Stormwind population that Lothar (PBUH) didn’t lead away to Lordaeron.
Then they build a fleet and proceeded to try and do the same to Lordaeron, embarking on a literal genocidal campaign against all human residents of Eastern Kingdoms, untill factional infighting slowed them down and allowed the desperate humans to gain the upper hand.
When humans sent an expedition to Draenor to asses the threat of further invasions, the Orcs chose to blow up their own planet, like the genocidal terrorists they are.
The fact that humans then found enough mercy in their hearts to incarcerate remaining Orcs in internment camps instead of slaughtering them where they stood as was well within their right speaks volumes about the honor and integrity of the species, unlike the warped sense of “honor” that the Orcs beat their chests about so much.
And don’t even get me started on the Forsaken. They are planning a literal genocide of all living beings as of the events of Classic. The Scarlet Crusade, were it not for a corrupting influence of demon Balnazzar, would be the unequivocal heroes of the story. Just compare, humans under demonic influence become paranoid and somewhat totalitarian in their conduct, blurring the lines between friend and foe in their desperate quest to reclaim their homeland from literal zombie apocalypse.
Orcs under demonic influence become genicidal horde of bloodthirsty animals slaughtering everything in their way, first on their own world, and then invading another.
I think it’s clear who the bad guys are, is it not?
I’m not even going into the lore of later expansions, where they make the evil status of Horde even more evident.
Even your Green Jesus Thrall ordered the extermination of entire Kul-Tiran fleet under Proudmoore for “encroaching on the land Orcs claimed as their own”. The land they stole from local sentient races like Centaur, Quillboar and Harpies, such custodians of it as they were, mere few years before. He only spared “some” of the original Lordaeron survivors, his former allies against Archimonde, and even that under pleading from his “friend” Jaina.
Thrall is just a fraction less trigger happy than most of the orcs. Mind you, Proudmoore didn’t even intend to kill the orcs, once he found his daughter alive, but return them to internment for the safety of all the other inhabitants of Azeroth.
[Just go replay “Founding of Durotar”, you are absolutely playing the bad guys there.]
P.S.: Arthas, Garithos and Proudmoore did nothing wrong.
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Dude you clearly have 0 knowledge on the matter if you think they are the same. It works just fine here in Belgium, our country is even built on it. You give me a score, based on what? Go play haha.
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Ok and what more lies? Allys dont have gnomes to?
You belong in a cage, you green skinned ape. /spit
@OP: I’d much rather have a world of moral greys where both factions have people of questionable moral standing asking us to do very… shady things, rather than a neutered world of only good people just because otherwise it hurts your feelings. Plus, if both factions were made of nothing but good and pure people, how would you justify the fact they’re at war with each other, to begin with?
You have no idea of what you’re talking about. Maybe you should’ve spent time reading more than just Hayek and maybe a few token libertarians. To put things in perspective - people measuring economic freedom (like the Fraser institute) consider environmental laws as a limitation of economic freedom. That should tell you how flawed economic freedom, as a standalone concept, is.
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that is why alliance are capitalists but not capitalist in freedom form, don’t like their capitalist ideology play horde.
You are missing the moral point of entire existence of Edwin VanCleef and Defias Brotherhood in World of Warcraft.
He was wronged, that is for sure. Does that justify becoming terrorist, plotting to plant explosives and blow up Stormwind Walls to destroy his work because stonemasons didn’t received their payment? Heck no!
Also from what I learned from the lore, those nobles cheated them in way that they promised them reward they couldn’t pay because of expenses of previous wars. They never had the money to pay the Stonemasons for rebuilding Stormwind. You can blame the Stonemasons as well for not checking the financial situation before starting their work on Stormwind.
Conclusion is that neither side is right or wrong as noble court cheated Stonemasons by promising them reward they couldn’t pay and Edwin VanCleef becoming outlaw plotting to destroy Stormwind.
Also majority of Defias Brotherhood are not common people of working class but thieves and pirates, cutthroats with only goal, to assault Stormwind and rob everyone, they don’t care how many innocent people they murder as long as they get their loot. You can only argue if it is any different with actual players in this game.
isn’t the lady standing next to bolvar in SW, is the reason for whatever happend to VanCleef?!
humans are idiots, they have the enemy right next to their KING! “cough…Ony…”
This thread is a meme
Look who is talking.
Go ahead make fun of humans who were fooled by dragon in disguise whose plot didn’t last long while your entire race was fooled into summoning burning legion which led to corruption of your race and almost total destruction of your planet by demon lord possessed human.
hahahaha!
Well… i’m a Red Orc
I’ve accepted the Demon’s Blood with my own will in-order to slaughter you Humans!
Likwitsnake is just a moron, you know? It’s just another Trumper.
He’s praising free capitalism as an ideology that “somehow” allocates resources (as he put it) in a more efficient manner, which is actually not true. It leads to masters and servants, a larger segregation in societies, and “weeds out” the weak.
The US is a perfect example of that, where hospital bills aren’t covered by the state in an efficient manner. It leads to sick people dying unnescessarily, due to lack of access to medicine/surgery/treatment or just by being unable to work due to said illness(es) which leads to loss of health insurance.
There are some type 1 diabetics rationing their insulin over there because they can’t afford more, which leads to early deaths. Just one example out of many.
Then there are things like queues for health care, but again that’s just a misconception. Their capitalistic health care system just provides quicker access for the wealthy, and indirectly forcing the “less fortunate” people to either wait or skip procedures entirely, except it’s “voluntary” so it doesn’t show up in the statistics for queue times since they choose not to queue up before they get the money. It’s not uncommon in the US to wait with a procedure, like for example a surgery, because they need to earn enough money to pay for it first which can take year(s).
Funny enough, polls suggests only around a fifth of the population in the US identifies as a social democrat, but more than half of the US wants what socialism stands for, like for example government covering education fees, health care costs and so on. Student debt in the US is a big problem right now, the same as their hospital bills.
The word “socialism” is seen as identical to communism in the US by many, and this misunderstanding is spreading because of America’s influence in the world. Likwitsnake being a prime example of that nonsense.
Socialism and communism are not exactly the same. The difference is the extreme nature of communism. Left vs. the far-left. Communism is far-left.
Also, social capitalism is very common these days. Which is not the same as socialism. Although many social capitalists still claims to be socialists.
You are all missing the main point here.
The problem with this “quest” is that it implants dangerous ideas into easily impressed minds of the youth, as in things like these are ok and normal.
Lately there has been some betterment in the gaming industry to correct some of these issues, specially when it comes to gender equality and social structures in video games. But much work remains to be done.
I am sorry if I offend your feelings, but some of you are basically no different from outlaws of the old wild west who try to rebel against law and order. Only this time your wild west is the old mentality of the old video game industry and the law and order is guidance for video game industry. Know your place.
I understand some of you like this old game because of childhood nostalgia, but it only proves my point; You were easily impressed children back then and now you think things like these are acceptable and normal.
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By this logic you should ban all murder mysteries - we don’t want our youth to get the idea that murder is cool! 
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VanCleef did nothing wrong!
Except robbing/killing Westfall citizens huh.
It’s capitalism vs communism indeed. Both sides were real jerks, just as in real life.
Yeah I believe it is implied that Lady Katarina Prestor / Onyxia was the one behind the faction of nobles not paying VanCleef, and in fact the whole Defias rebellion plays perfectly into her plans of weakening the Alliance.
Just goes to show how easily corrupted human minds are, proving my point! But even in this case, the root of all evil was, once again, money! Ugh, Thanks for the spoilers by the way.
This is a perfect example of how currency-based economies are a dead-end and lead to nothing else but suffering and inequality. I can sense some people mocking communism in some of these threads, but have you actually even tried it? I have only good experiences of it in my close circles.
Why is there not a single faction in the game that does not rely so deeply on the copper/silver/gold transactions? I try to avoid the Auction House as much as possible to discourage the functionality of the in-game economy, for an example.
Now this, is epic.
Waiting for the in-depth blue post reply.
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OK Since this thread is apparently not about WoW lore but about capitalism vs communism, I’ll give you my thought about this.
Also since my reply got rather extensive, here is TL;DR:
Many countries might still be searching for the best course, but communism is certainly not the way.
Not sure what country are you from but my country which was named Czechoslovakia back then was among the most prospering in Europe and we had factories producing high-quality goods under our brands around the world before World War II.
What communist did after Soviet Russia “liberated” us? Did they helped us to get back to where we’ve been before?
No. They started to execute or otherwise dispatch of anyone who was considered wealthy and nationalize their belongings, farms and fields. Committing crimes for so called greater good.
Sad thing is that people who had nothing that could have been taken away from them were eager to join this cause and used the chaos after end of the war to murder their neighbors who managed to keep their wealth through the course of WWII or because they had German ancestors.
Many people were later willing to live only for the sake or work out of patriotism, with hopes that their work will make our country prosper again and entire working class will bear the fruits of their labor because that’s what communism is about right?
Then decades passed by and there were no prosperity, no technological advance, nothing. All the fruits of the working class labor didn’t come to their country, to the working class itself. All the fruits of their labor went to the Soviet Russia to fill their capital on arms race with the promise that they will protect us from the invasion of the evil capitalists from the west. Truly ridiculous isn’t it? Yet people apparently fell for it.
Eventually the sheltering and bad technological state of our country opened the way for smuggling and younger generations even from the working class were eager to spend their savings for high quality electronics and other goods not available on our market since all the quality goods were manufactured for export and market was filled with cheap imports available for everyone but of very low quality. Also lot of things like foreign music records i.e. were banned in our market as they were considered harmful to the socialistic community. Yet demand was so high that to reduce numbers of smuggled records and it’s copies many popular foreign songs got their lyrics in our language and were performed by local artists. Talk about copyright infringement.
When something as simple as high quality Stereo Receiver and audio records have to be smuggled in and you could get into lot of trouble for having those, you know that something is wrong.
My point is that I’m well aware that it is not right to buy smuggled goods but whose fault it was that it couldn’t have been purchased legally back then?
In the worst era of communism, lot of people became delator out of fear for their family as communist higher-ups could easily ruin their lives with repetitive arrest or even lawsuit with false charges. Worst cases were those who was already brainwashed and became snitch out of conviction they are doing the right thing as well as those who knew it’s morally wrong to delate someone who didn’t commit any serious crime, yet they became delator for selfish reasons or out of envy.
(Note that I’m talking about people whose only offense was minor transgression against ridiculous rules so they could improve their quality of life in difficult era to live, yet they could have been reported and exemplary punished if someone found out.)
From that comes the question: Is communism really that good if it depends on oppression of human rights and threatening?
Look what communism did in China, what leap they’ve made by opening to the western market, what remained of communist ideology in there and what is mainland China doing with Hong Kong these days and what influence it have on rest of the world. Look also what’s going on in North Korea.
I have so many things I would like to write down about communism here that it became hard to keep it well arranged.
From my point of view, the communist ideology is being used to brainwash people and leech on their work, promising them prosperity while they are being oppressed and threatened.
“Keep up the pace and your mouth shut and you can live in peace, step out of the line or demand more than we offer and you will be punished along with your family.” That is what communism became.
So once again, I don’t know what country you are from but we had our share of communism and most of the people is glad that it’s era is over and only ignorant and uneducated/uninformed person would be happy with communists as ruling party in our country politics.
Thus when I return to WoW lore, I have very little to none sympathy for Defias Brotherhood. It’s sad to what happened to VanCleef, but Defias Brotherhood had to be stopped.