Rogues are Fine. As always

PVP Arenas
85

No this is not crit god scenario. No class should be able to

  1. Turn arena into a 1v1.
  2. CC their main target for 10secs if they have no trinket.
  3. CC the healer while CCing their main target for 10secs.
  4. Do 200k DPS while doing the above.

The DMG itself is crazy and should be nerfed, even if he got crit god RNG, no class should be able to do 100k+ DPS for 18secs straight (you think he had crit god RNG for all the 18secs?) while keeping both targets in CC, while the main target has the strongest defensives possible.

Like Barrier is -50% DMG taken or -40% in PvP (so many changes to it and it’s PvP talents that I have no idea what it is now) and Pain Supp is -40% DMG taken, additionally the feral was in bear form giving him higher armor and higher vers than he would normally have.

And let’s not act as if this requires crazy amount of skill, all you need is - Shadow Duel, know your rotation and 2-3 target macros to keep the healer in CC without even needing to target him.

The Feral + Disci team actually showed skill and still lost. The Druid prebeared knowing that there will be a go, the Disci pre shielded knowing there will be a go, the Disci used barrier to counter duel, the Disci even though he was in a CC chain was able to get another shield in between CC and put up pain supp after barrier ended. They predicted exactly everything the rogue would do and used all their skills properly to counter it and the rogue just kills anyway cause he knew his DPS rotation.

86

Rogues are beyond dumb. When are they getting nerfed!? Most broken class in WoW.

87

so the tldr is rogue can turn the game into a 1V1 or decide to enable affliction warlock who is totally dependant of his teammates to get online?

yeah we know, used to play with friends who didnt do it and once got a rls group in legion, the rogue did that and i finally got to play my class. felt amazing.

but im paying the same sub as every rogue player and i dont see why they should have an agenda where they can choose to solo the game or get me online. i dont understand why while they are having fun i am running like a total victim whenever a melee has decided i wont get to play the game.

the problem is that those conversations are always the same circle jerks, where part of the community know people to play with, while others are left in the dust, trying to find lfg people that dont view them as disposable meat, have no room to actually improve because they can’t even press 2 buttons whitout haviong their screens clusters with their opponents cool weapons and spell effects, let alone have fun.

rogue is one of those classes that has a big agenda and get to do pretty much whatever they want. even focused, your spells work, you defensives can nullify ennemie damage, you have good mobility, and you bring crazy cc to either peel yourself or decide if your teammate gets to play because today you were in a good mood.

im just a casual idiot who idles betwwen 1K7/1k8 - 2K/2K1, and class like rogues that make me afk for minutes straight are just not fun. the damage is just the cherry on top.

thats why when i saw that stoopz video i just laughed my akk off about the request for solo shuffle, anybody who tried to play a caster in lfg, desesperatly finding teammates and havign to go with sheetty comps in melee elo of 1K6-2k knew what was going to happen.
so solution for classes like rogue is simple, you either design the game as a multiplayer only game, or you keep solo shuffle which means every class needs to be able to function to a certain degree on their own AND not nullify completely an opponent wether through absurd ccs paired with crazy damage.

thats just logic, as long as solo shuffle is here, some kits need gutting, and rogue is definitely on the list.
or you remove solo shuffle and i need to man up and start to get battlenet invites going whenever i find like minded people to play with and i build it from there. but as long as this game mode is available, saying that a player has the right to decide wether his own randomnly designated teammate gets to play the game based on their respective class kit choosen at the character creation menu, is an outrageous sentence.

(and yes, some r1 players push with aff locks or lock in general in shuffle gnagnagna. yes, those players who had years of practice where they got to play the game thanks to their teammates in past expansions and now know what to do. im fine being trash, but im not fine being denied the right to practice and improve in a super stess environment that feel like im getting a seizure. and if you want more healers in shuffle, more activity in pvp, people to care and stuff like that, make this game enjoyable for everybody to a certain degree before FINE TUNING things for higher end a little bit)

88

Isn’t dome just 20% damage reduction? And a ton of subs damage ignores armor.
If you come out of duel basically dead and then PS it wont do much if the Rogue still has damage left.

Have you actually uploaded or linked the video?

The problem with sub is kind of duel shouldn’t exist and their CDR is just dumb. If the CDR was removed it wouldn’t be too bad, except they wont remove CDR due to PvE :confused:

89

No, because it’s a total cap.
People on these forums don’t get killed through cooldowns. They just like to claim they do.

What’s more realistic: players’ fantasy that rogues can do like 300k+ dps into targets while simultaneously keeping them in stun every GO through defensives into prebear at 100% hp OR those players just being bad and trying to justify that fact in their specific way?

2 Likes
90

We have a video of it in the Druid subforum. 2v1 - Prebear + Shield into duel, into almost instant barrier that the druid was in during the whole duel, into new shield + pain right after duel ends into like 2-3 CC on healer, into frenzied regen + renewal with pain still up and druid dies. So nothing I said is a fantasy.

Dome is 100% stronger in PvP so it’s 40%, pain is also 40%, bear form gives +6% vers and a ton of heal + armor. The video is in the Druid subforum, one of the topics at the top something like “Druid needs survivability buffs!”. It’s not my video, I just saw it a few days ago when going through the forums.

EDIT: Here is the linkg to the topic Proof: Feral needs a defensive buff (PvP)

EDIT2:
Now that was amazing.
That was prebear at 90%.
That was with barrier at 70%.
That was with Pain Supp as soon as he got out.
He was in Barrier + Pain Sub for some time giving him at that time like 60% DMG reduction.
That was 2 or 3Shields from the Disc at only 20% dampening.
There was a random heal for 100k+ right after barrier.
That was also with a Frenzied Regen proc that went the full duration so it healed the full amount.
And last but not least he used Renewal + Typhoon to try to get the rogue off him, but rogues can just instantly reconnect with their 10 different mobility skills.

Every single defensive and heal used and that was still not enough to stop a sub rogue. Yes ferals need a defensive buffs badly, but sub also needs a 50% DMG nerf.

The rogue did 1.7mln DMG in 18secs, that is around 100k DPS, vs a target with high armor, high vers, with barrier and pain supp. His real DPS was like what 200k+?

4 Likes
91

Link to the video itself: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2030675584?t=4h24m26s

First of all, before we start, I don’t hear ferals complaining about the damage done by Feral, while singlehandedly stunning and CCing whole arena while being mobile af.

Priest has lost the game like 25 times despite being carried. I can’t believe he’s 3k+. Maybe he was just chilling, not caring at all, idk.

  1. Before Duel, during WHOLE duel, after Duel priest is sticking to his druid with his fear on CD. Priest has no trinket. Worst decision ever. Terrible positioning. Move away, so rogue is forced to chase you
  2. Dome is placed too late. 72% of druid’s HP, not 100% as claimed.
  3. Perfect cat form to die while your priest is CCed.

So let me get that straight: you wanted him to win with those plays? I mean, he’s high exp yada yada, but everyone makes mistakes.

Rogue’s damage is too much definitely, but good plays would not allow such scenario.

EDIT: I didn’t see you editing your post about Predome

92

Your right, Rogues are Busted, but you are wrong because the defenses where traded nontheless. A scenario like this should have been impossible to end this way. The amount of CDS that was thrown in this moment where absurd given the circumstances and yet endet in a kill. Ergo: Rogue is busted and Feral defensive is a joke

93

Also this Feral Druid is currently 2349 rating in 2v2 Rating so this ain’t a “bad player” he is probably one of the best feral players in 2v2. We have only 6 Ferals at 2400+ and 30 above 2200, so he’s one of the best 2v2 ferals in this season. So let’s not make up BS about “git gud you just suck”.

2v2 record - 2717 rating
3v3 record - 3198 rating
Solo shuffle last season - 2668

This ain’t just a rando that doesn’t know how to play the game and he played this game almost perfectly, that’s why he got the kill on the monk so quickly and that’s why he predicted and countered the go from the rogue with his priest almost perfectly, but the DMG is just broken and you can’t outplay it even with multiple CDs from both players.

EDIT: Just went through the rankings, BrothaBean is top 26 druid in 2v2, TOP 5 feral druid in 2v2. :smiley: He aint a rando so stop the

BS.

2 Likes
94

I literally explained how to win in that scenario:

Priest has thrown the game hard. Feral died because of him.

Priest is a unique healer and that’s why. Press before the damage or lose the game. PS on <50% hp does nothing with no healing to support druid.

Okay-okay, this clip is huge Rogue’s damage, I agree. But still TOTALLY winnable.

95

I mean the damage is dumb and its quite funny they lost but the feral basically trinketed air and if he had it, he would have lived and the Rogue popped duel, blades, flag, sepsis, shadow technique, badge aka literally every offensive CD he had whilst they both had no trinket as they played ultra aggro.

Kind of looks to me like they assumed the game was over since they both just stacked on top of each other.

Also noted that the ferals damage during his burst go was almost the same amount as the Rogues damage during his burst go.

I like bean, he’s a super chill guy.

96

That’s great result. It doesn’t nullify the fact his priest was playing terrible (even tho he’s high exp also)

97

No, a non-cd bear should be enough. And a dome. And actually IT WAS enough, it’s just they gave up the game for free while being afk after the Duel.

98

When was he supposed to PS lol? He did PS after duel, he can’t do that faster cause surprise surprise you can’t PS ppl in duel. The druid already had barrier which is a 40% DMG reduction. Barrier alone should have been enough to stop that go or Barrier + Regen + Renewal. At 50% HP Druid has not only PS he has BARRIER AND PS. He has Regen - 20% heal + Renewal 30% Heal. They used 4 major CDs vs one rogue, that should have stopped the rogue and nothing can justify that it did not. They used 3 shields + a random 100k heal after duel. They did PREBEAR. This would only be winnable if the priest PS the druid at 100% just before the duel.

So that would be prebear, pre PS, barrier, PS after duel, Renewal, Regen, 3 shields, 1-2 heals just to stop one go from the rogue. Don’t you think that is a little bit too much? Dont you think that even without a pre PS with everything they used they should have survived a single DPS hitting a bear? I think they used more than enough and played that almost perfectly and sub just is broken.

99

Or if he just used his movement keys and moved away.

Okay, whatever you say.
If that makes you feel better.

You win, sub is uncounterable imba teraa hyper ultra nonbeatable Astra Omega Anime.

100

Just watched it myself. He misused barkskin for nothing before the shadowblades/duel.
He has mass root which he didnt try to use.
Rogue didnt use evasion or cloak of shadows during the burst or didnt have it since he used cloak of shadows right before it.
Healer felt it was a good idea to be stuck ontop of feral knowing the rogue can just keep stunning instead of standing away to grip or anything rly.

There were quite some misplays there which obv can happen to anyone.

1 Like
101

And they popped double -40% DMG, 20% Heal, 30% Heal, 100k heal, triple shield. The monk did not have increased HP, increased armor, increased vers from being in bear form, he did not have two -40% DMG CDs on him, didn’t have 3 shields + 50% HP insta heal. I’d understand that DMG if the Druid and Priest didn’t pop every single CD that reduces DMG and heals, but Barrier + PS is like more than 60% DMG reduction. Come on. Let’s not compare a monk with nothing on him getting killed vs a Bear with every single CD the Disc has on him getting killed in a double CC chain.

102

Well I am surprised he died but still, vers/armor isn’t really a defensive as most go through. Would kind of expect dome+PS to be fine; still just kind of looks like they both zoned out. If they had any distance between each other, they’d also probably be fine. Happens.

The video doesn’t imo even show what’s busted about sub which is its CDR.

Also worth noting if they hadn’t put themselves in that position, they wouldn’t have to use all that. If I trinket before duel and the sub has CDs, I would probably be dead even with the dome.

Still surprising though, I’d be happy if sub got a damage nerf tbh.

103

Feral needs a good bunch of defensivs though ôô

104

Or just remove duel, it’s weird that you can turn a 2v2, 3v3, 2v1 into a 1v1 and sometimes oneshot someone. :smiley: Probably just removing duel would be ok, keep the DMG. CDR is a totally different issue that should be looked into, cause it makes SUB a super tank that can reset when he wants and get back all his major CDs. :smiley: