So they nerf Dagger in the Dark

I mean, listen - they nerf Dagger in the Dark because they heard the community crying.

But at the same time they DO NOT nerf Convoke, The Hunt or Divine Toll damage.
They also don’t nerf Combustion or BM damage.
They also don’t nerf Windwalkers as a whole.
They only nerfed Dagger in the dark.

This is sadge af

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Out of all these, dagger in the dark is the only option that could oneshot certain specs without giving them time to react to the setup (which was done in stealth). As much as I wish we were getting more frequent balance changes, I can see why’d they prioritise this.

Idk I was getting 30k hp to 0 by ret in one global and it’s not much time to react either

At least they have to use 2 or 3 cooldowns before it starts rumbling, so that takes at least 3 seconds.

Rogues could just sit in stealth at 20 yards, wait, wait, wait, bam, kill you within 0,3s on their own.

Completely different ballpark.

On the other hand, most of my times of playing with a one shot rogue, they were getting found almost every time so it wasn’t that great in poor player’s hands :stuck_out_tongue:

The only reason why they nerfed it is, because it was able to oneshot anyone with 40k HP.
stacking all buffs could result between 25k - 40k CRIT. unavoidable.

Could they not just revert that stupid buff to the legendary. Noone is gonna use it now anyways with dagger in the dark nerfed.

Sub Rogues wont have any pvp talents options now, its always gonna be the same 3. Cold Blood, Smoke bomb and Shadowy duel.

The legendary itself without Dagger in the dark would be fine.

The build also would still be problematic without the Buff to The Rotten.

Dagger in the dark is the problem that best should still be removed.

But imagine nerfing it from “OP AF / Broken” to “Absolutely useless”

Its not useless.

I would think if you would be able to equip 2 Legendaries The Rotten would be the 2nd one and healthy without Dagger in the Dark.

The problem child is Master Assassin that took away any chance of a healthy balancing because it made the 0.3375% case, 3 back to back Crits 100%.

The “what if everything aligns” just got the base line. No room for anything.

The rogues likely just didn’t realise how large the range of that talent was. It’s supposed to be larger than most AoE.

Its obvious the pvp devs don’t watch their own AWC. If they think sub is that big of an offender then they’re clearly trolling by this point more than anything.

Then again why would you play rogue in WoW? The devs don’t give the class anywhere near the attention it needs, it just makes people angry at the rogue player for having to resort to the same age old set ups.

the fact theres stronger bursts with less set up required actively running rampant clearly shows it was just the community dictatorship at it again.

Dagger in the dark is currently the HARDEST hitting ability in the game. I have seen crits over 40K close to 50K. … makes it balanced!

What are you on about? What was hard about dagger in the dark? Waiting stacks or pressing macro?

yeah, but it’s counterable, you see seraphim divine toll, you know what’s going to happen next so you can react, with rogues u had zero chances, same with convoke, whole game is about to leave trinket interupt / cc for convoke and than you have 2 minutes till next go

If it was as “easy” to execute and reliably competitive enough to see play, we would be seeing it in the AWC no? I haven’t seen it and I’ve been keenly watching just for the sake of class representation and from what I recall theres not been a singular game where that talent has seen play, though I’ve seen fire mage / dh doing some very interesting “one-shots” so by all means humour me, I know its a unhealthy talent. You don’t need to tell me that, but its kind of a joke by this point how they target the rogues explicitly again, no other changes.

I mean if its a tank, then yeah. Cause tanks take 50% increased damage, I’ve not seen shadowstrike hit a geared player for anything more than 23-25k which is childs play given you can only pull those high numbers the once per every 2 minutes or so.

the only reason this nerf is coming through is cause low geared players who aren’t duelist / glad geared are getting clapped by glads using it and slapping them with 233 weapons.

My point is, theres alot of irony how rogues have been actively targetted with nerfs in SL. Even having a entire convenant made redundant. But things like the hunt have been untouched, it really says alot on the double standards being offered currently.

So that’s how you justify everything in this game? If you don’t see it in awc it means that nothing is to worry about? You act like they haven’t touched divine toll or convoke this expansion at all. Yes maybe nerfs where not enough, but they still were addressed and they are still less braindead than dagger in the dark. This oneshots were happening to awc players and there are clips, just because you didn’t see it in actual awc, doesn’t mean that it was fine to exist.
P.S oh you have it talented, you probably were one of those who were abusing it. Explains a lot at this point.

I’m aware they’ve touched it, has it really impacted covenant choice or lowered play rate, to a lesser extent for some people (maybe). Though the general damage they put out hasn’t really changed, you can still die in 1-2 globals from 100 to 0 by a ret, convenant ability nerfs or not as it didn’t address the core issue with why they’re doing such crazy damage. Just like how the un-fun counter play of UA over lapping with Mind games is unlikely to be addressed.

The way they changed those covenant abilities were 10 times more humane however compared to a flat 50% damage nerf to both the conduit for the covenant spell and the covenant spell also being separately nerfed by 50% I can tell you no class has received nerfs to their covenant ability to that extreme in PVP where its genuinely a safer play to just roll to a new covenant. Since even the mastery pelagos offered was a joke compared to Niyah.

Sure it sucks having full moon taken out of rotation, has it effected convoke? Not really, still being actively taken. Not like the other covenant abilities are bad either for druid.

Yes I’ve quite frankly enjoyed sitting in open world pvp, slapping people to death in 1-2 hits who refuse to use a defensive cool down. Still doesn’t 1 shot mythic item level players though, I’ve played with it, extensively used it for fun. Haven’t properly used it for rated however since I don’t play double dps or play with a disc to get dark arch, I look forward to banking the legendary since it’ll never see any use again in the forseeable future most likely given how much cheese it took for it to see use to begin with, its a niché legendary and will never see play even when you can equip two legendaries since rogue universally has very strong legendaries which can be used across all specs.

I’m aware its unhealthy, though its definitely a case of double standards being thrown around anyway very clearly still, like it or not. As out of all the things to be gutted, its the rogues stuff.

Its the one which the community is pushing youtubers and streamers to make an uproar about. I look forward to going back to being able to play normally, knowing I won’t have to trade my b-rez cloak for all of the rogues cds + vanish anymore to get a free win vs dagger in the dark cheese, doesn’t bother me that its being neutered, I’m more disgusted that they’re only addressing rogues again and nothing else for the second or third time (?)

It might still work with double rogue / rogue mage in 2’s but we’ll have to wait and see how the numbers look after tuning rolls out. Baffles me how people are ignorant to how much utility and cds you throw at the guy with the cheese to begin with, given you can’t even vanish if it scuffs cause you use vanish too. But sure, I don’t expect this discussion to go anywhere either to be frank given that I’ve actively acknowledged it being unhealthy for the game in the prior post + pushed my gripe with them just slapping rogues on the wrist again, nothing else and been met with the “your guilty your exploiting it too” attitude.

it’s not any one thing that made it stupid, it’s the combination of everything. for example the build would not work if symbols didn’t make your next generator a guaranteed crit (or at least not reliably at all). but dagger in the dark was for sure the best thing to hit since it’s an awful talent that nobody ever uses other than this.

that’d be MA and shadowdust imo. third is kind of unclear to me, maybe rotten, deathly shadows, finality, orc sephuz.

MA has nothing to do with this build. i also don’t think MA is that far ahead of shadowdust. desync blind, 70s flag, reducing cloak/evasion, double kidney and even double kick if you want is super powerful. MA has a really high top-end in terms of effectiveness, but a lot of goes it does nothing. even when you get a re for a go you often only get like two globals since you’re usually spending the first globals stunning. it makes offensive vanishes very powerful, but so does deathly shadows to a lesser extent and shadowdust (with shadowdust also getting offensive value when you use it defensively).

MA is the only one that scales with meld though and it does so a lot. way more fair to run shadowdust as a human or an orc i think, or even orc sephuz necrolord if you wanna be immortal.

So assa rogues going to be the thing again huh?