[SPOILERS] Patch 8.3 Thread (Visions of N'zoth)

Argent Dawn
1125

Yep. Blizzard might want us to believe Orcs are victims or misunderstood and honorable, but they keep writing plots where the Orcs do horrible and evil things of their own free will and then make excuses after the fact.

‘Rise of the Horde’ made it clear, the Orcs didn’t even drink the demon blood until after 8 years of war and genocide against the Draenei, which while it was probably retconned somewhere because they keep shrinking the timeframe, was still written at a time when the Orcs were supposed to be seen as good guys in the main series.

The Iron Horde demonstrates that they don’t need any outside corruption to turn monstrously evil. The in-name-only Mag’har continue the practices of the Iron Horde, including the use of Void magic corrupting their Shadowmoon casters - presumably, Rulkan and the Shadowmoon Exiles must have sided with Yrel? - which makes the whole “uncorrupted” thing darkly ironic.

You can’t have it both ways, Blizzard. You tried to redeem the Orcs, but you couldn’t stick to it so just let it go already.

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1126

Takes about 10 years to make an adult warrior.

(well 12 for an orc to become an adult, but during war time people aren’t as picky; see 16 year olds fighting wars historically)

Orcs born in Orgrimmar at the end of WC3 are old enough to have children, and those children are halfway into puberty.

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Yet they don’t feel an inherited need to attack anything Nature- or Light- focussed. Humans embraced the Light. the Night Elves embraced Nature. Which are, according to the two playable Orcish races, are the most ultimate evils around.

We can’t blame them for their programming; but the least they could do is atleast admit they hate everything which is green; which would also explain their extreme hatred and tendency to invade the Night Elven lands; whic are focussed on, well their planet not becoming a planet devoid of life… :stuck_out_tongue:

(I’m seeing the red brigade(so I’m scared, as one of the few blue brigaders) typing in their defence; so let me already get ready for their onslaught about how the Orcs aren’t the only invasive species(while the Draenei did everything in their power to not be a bother to the natural world around them, unlike the Orcs, Ogre’s and what not :P)

1128

In our time, Maraad got manipulated by Gul’dan into wiping out one of the orc clans, and Gul’dan then killed all the survivors of Maraad’s attack to make sure no other clan learns the truth. He then pointed at Maraad as proof to the orcs that the draenei are out to kill them all, and that the ancestor visions were right (up until that point, the shaman had been skeptical about the visions). That’s how the Horde was founded, and the demon blood that sealed their fate came later when they realized that the Draenei aren’t simple push overs what with their incredible technology. They were driven to desperate measures after they were deceived into believing that their race’s survival is on the line due to Gul’dan’s schemes.

They were a spiritual people who were manipulated because they place their trust in prophets and seers.

And if you read the Hellscream story, you’ll find out that Garrosh manipulated Grom again by acting like a prophet. He showed him visions of the future and the doom of the orcs using the vision of time, but pulled him out of the vision and killed the shaman who saw the truth so that Grom had just enough context to be desperate and need Garrosh and his plan, but not enough context to realize he’s been lied to. Garrosh specifically made sure Grom doesn’t learn about Thrall and the redemption.

Or alternatively, they started to rely on it again out of desperation given it’s the antithesis to the Light that was trying to genocide them.

The problem with orcs is that at their heart, they’re a spiritual people who are easy to deceive because they – in their understanding of the universe – don’t need to second guess it when their ancestors and prophets show them visions of doom. It’s like if you had a race that worships the Light and has relied on it for survival for centuries and one day the Light told them to wipe out your neighbour before they become a real threat for your people’s existence–

Oh. Lightbound.

To say lmao they don’t even need to be corrupted anymore because of wod is just willfully ignoring the context that lead to the Iron Horde. It didn’t just pop into existence one day because orc bad

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1129

“Humans Wouldn’t do anything Evil” he says as the Humans and Elves killed Trolls, the true inhabitants of Azeroth.

“I’m not evil, I’m the good guy.” he says as Night Elves Lead the legion to the world, almost dooming the planet.

Yeah, Humans and Night elves are totally the “good guys”, whats next, is one of their princess going to unleash a force of death on the eastern kingdoms, oh wait.

Oh look, one man blue brigade is typing.

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1130

I think everyone is missing the point here… Vulpera might be able to be DK’s?

1131

Here we go; “The Trolls wouldn’t do anything evil” he says as the Trolls killed the Aqir and Elementals, the true inhabitants of Azeroth.

I’m not evil, i’m the good guy." as his faction waged war on everything living on Azeroth, willing to us titan technology alongside their Mogu-allies, willing to wipe out anything living aside from themselves and their allies.

Yea, the Horde and Trolls are totally the good guys and the races trying to survive on Azeroth. Whats next; they’re gonna start 6th War on everything living on Azeroth while making a pact with either another Old God or another Burning Legion Lord… Oh wait.

Ohh look, a Troll is defending the genocide they commited to rule the world, while condemning the genocide commited by their another-not their own) race.

1132

The majority of the Lightbound are Orcs.

1133

Why not? The Ebon Blade does not discriminate.

If gnomes and goblins qualify, why not vulpera?

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1134

You’re welcome, what, do you want to be ruled by the Black Empire?

To get rid of stains such as mutants and Defunct machines, one has to be thorough in their cleaning.

Not the World. OUR World.

1135

Genocide has five official definitions and only one of them involves mass killing. Cultural genocide as a term was rolled into an umbrella of genocide, which in turn is defined by the UN as

(a) Any action which has the aim or effect of depriving them of their integrity as distinct peoples, or of their cultural values or ethnic identities;

(b) Any action which has the aim or effect of dispossessing them of their lands, territories or resources;

(c) Any form of population transfer which has the aim or effect of violating or undermining any of their rights;

(d) Any form of assimilation or integration by other cultures or ways of life imposed on them by legislative, administrative or other measures;

(e) Any form of propaganda directed against them.

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Jaina: The Old God has been vanquished. The Alliance and Horde have ended hostilities.

Jaina: This should be a day of celebration, Anduin. Yet you wear your troubles like a crown.

Anduin: I’m so glad that after all you endured, you have found peace within your heart, Jaina. I can’t say the same about myself, though. Not yet.

Anduin: Sylvanas is out there somewhere. Until she’s brought to justice, I don’t think Tyrande or Genn will truly consider the war to be over.

Jaina: The Kul Tiran fleet is scouring the seas, and Shaw has spies searching every dark corner of Azeroth. She can’t hide for long.

Anduin: I don’t believe she will. Which is exactly what concerns me.

Anduin: I saw you speaking with a messenger from Kul Tiras, Jaina. Is everything alright?

Jaina: Nothing to worry about. It was a letter from a certain eager cadet asking to see Stormwind… and to learn more about her father.

Anduin: Taelia. Please tell her that this isn’t a good time for visitors.

Jaina: She deserves to hear the truth, Anduin. From you.

Anduin: Tirion Fordring himself made us swear that we would keep the secret of Bolvar’s fate. You made that vow just as I did.

Jaina: I remember your father once telling me that the hardest thing about a promise isn’t keeping it, but knowing when it’s right to break it.

Anduin: Bolvar was a noble man. To know that he sits frozen upon that accursed throne, devoting his very life to keeping the monsters at bay…

Anduin: It breaks my heart. I can’t bear to see it break Taelia’s, too.

Jaina: The decision is yours, Anduin. But if she learns that the truth was kept from her, it will hurt her all the more.

Wrath 2.0 next

4 Likes
1137

My rational side wants to agree with you… but on the other hand…

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A compelling argument I must admit.

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1139

Because Vulpera, unlike the 13x Pandaren, have not left Vol’dun. If they had the means to leave Vol’dun; I am certain Blizzard would’ve showed an Harbor, or backtracked(like the Monk-trainer) to show they were able to leave.

Obviously they might still do that; but up until now they showed neither the Lich-King showing up in uldum, nor showing up in Vol’dun, Zandalar, Stormsong nor Tirigarde Sounds; hence why none of those races show up as Death Knights… :stuck_out_tongue:

You;re welcome for us killing all 3 Troll Empires. Seeing how they are currently and how easily their empire fell 10,00 years ago, you wanted to be ruled by the Troll Kings/Emperors?

So the Trolls would have to kill themselves to, as they to are apparently defunct. Byebye Darkspear Clan. (I will give you the Zandalari for now since I don’t have Chronicles 1 with me at the moment, even though I doubt they aren’t defunct titanic machines)

Which you conquered by genociding the Aqir, and the Kaldorei ruled by genociding the Trolls. What goes around comes around, I suppose? :stuck_out_tongue:

1140

Because the Vulpera did not leave Vol’dun during the Lich Kings reign. nor did the Lich King invade Vol’dun…

1141

https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/screenshots/normal/874882.jpg

If that Cloud Serpent isn’t farmable (so, like Soundless), I swear to god I will scream.

1142

Goblins are literally everywhere. They’re like ants. It doesn’t take much to explain them.

1143

The Ebon Blade recruits to this day for all we know - we saw them doing so in Legion and I doubt they stopped.

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1144

I need the alpaca mount in my life

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