The Lightbound did nothing wrong and the Mag'har hypocrisy

Lore Story
61

I said they are brutish, dumb and unintelligent AND they are unable to form a society because of that,
not that they are because of not having a society.

The quote you used said that Orcs and Trolls were intelligent enough to form a society in contrast to Gronn.

So in a way you turned it around.
I said “They don’t have a society because they are to stupid.”
You made “They are stupid because they don’t have a society.” out of it.

I’m pretty sure there’s a difference between those two, but i may be mistaken because english is not my native language.

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Oh, we all know how orcs allow all the people they conquer and murder to “follow their own culture”.

Defending the abuser, blaming the victim.

Seriously, what?

Obviously, we need to allow orcs to murder everything left and right because for the Horde.

:heart::heart::heart::heart::heart::heart:

Just like Desolate Council were allowed to leave x)

And how Witherbark Trolls who were “driven out of Hinterlands” by the Horde and are now being wiped out because they wouldn’t join your monstrous faction x)

Ever heard of Bonechewer Clan?

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63

I thought it was a single argument, not a conclusion.

But if you didn’t mean it like that, fair enough. But we can never infer from the fact alone that they don’t a civilization that they’re unintelligent, that was my point.

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64

No but the Former Iron horde had likely spent years, fighting alongside the Draenei.
Yrel even called Grommash for her Friend.
Basically there was no hostility between the two factions afer the Legion was vanquished from Dreanor.

The world was at peace, the Iron Horde had reformed their ways.
But the Draenei as explained in the Scenario grew a new obsession with the light.
Some of the Mag’har embraced the light culture others did not.

War first began, after religion of light was being forced upon Orcs not willing to change their ways.
To the levels of mind Control through lightforging against their will Like xe’ra tried to do with Illidan.

When the abuser becomes the victim, and the victim the abuser.
You will need a code of moral.

Lest you will see things happening far more brutal and cruel than the Original abuse.

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Giving up the conquest and enslavement of the whole planet as well as creating portals to invade other planets seems like great distancing…
Slavery, genocide of the Draenei, and total disregard of the well being of the planet, gave room to an almost diametrically opposed approach (even if they kept most their values as a culture, because you know…they are still orcs).

Let alone their rejection for Fel, which predates the disbandment of the Iron Horde.
Last time someone dabbled with Fel, they were put in chains by those same clans and used as fuel by Grommash himself.

If you are to say the majority of a race is prone to certain stuff, I’d caution against comparing the population of a single garrison, with the one of an entire planet and say it’s a significant sample.

Specially when in that zone alone you are met with dissent regarding Fel.

Edit: And I consider that sidetracking the motives of the Lightbound actions as being related to some scenario about orcs embracing Fel, quite a pointless argument. We are given conclusive proof that the motivation for the Lightbound to attack them has nothing to do with said speculation.

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i feel like all this talk of lightbound and mag’har could’ve used a step-in expansion to tie WoD with.

would’ve been nice.

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Oh, really? Prove it.

Draenei say that orcs and their machinery are to blame! It’s a word against a word.

Prove that your beloved orcs are not guilty here.

You’ve got be kidding me right now. You outright said that the one who was a victim first is WORSE. I have no bloody idea how to comment that.

You better not be addressing me personally here. You’re defending abusive people and trying to claim moral highground? I just have no words.

What is this nonsense?! Says who? What is this rubbish? Is that a natural law or what? Who do you think you are to say such things?

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70

Okay, I think I should chip in here a little. Love you, Hala, but leaving Durlan to explain the perspective is probably gonna invite another headache. For you and me apparently.

First of:

He can’t. Unless there’s some other book or out-of-in-game produce that explains the events between the ending of WoD and the Mag’har recruitment. However, same goes to the Draenei/Lightbound in this case, apart from a biased view from Orcs.

Now, if we had an AU Lightbound chapter explaining things on the other hand…

I think what’s being put here is that if on the instance that the victim does the same to the abuser, it makes the victim worse in that regard. But such context doesn’t fit in this regard and falls into why using morals in a conflict scenario - heck - a conflict scenario where we barely know much is quite wrong and ineffective.

It’s in answer to the above, rather, I think.

Which means it’s an odd thing to apply still.

If this is still about the Lightbound, then he’s merely hyping up what happened to them than anything else.

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71

Where’s my ring :heart: ?

Yeah, I suppose it would.

Exactly.

He’s throwing around one perspective as an absolute truth because he likes it.

Highly debatable. Depends on the situation.

He’s throwing around conclussions about morality as if he were the guy in charge of it. He sounds like arrogance incarnate.

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72

Yeah, no, which is why it’s pointless to use morality as a weapon in any discussion of this context in my honest and most sincere opinion. That’s just a can of worms that helps no-one, not even the user.

As for your ring… it’s somewhere… out there…

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73

I’m a Sin’dorei of course I am in charge such affairs.

I’m going to save this and use it next time Morality gets used as an Argument.

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Go for it. Less people use that hot topic as a motion of debate, the better.

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75

So much for the love… :broken_heart:

76

;(

Anyway, keep up with the talk. Seems an interesting read ‘so far’.

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It’s allright Hala.
He can gift you with the Keys to the Vindicaar instead.
Retrieved from the cold dead hands of the Lightforged.

Now back to the topic and in the guts Bleedeing words of fat-panda Ninja overlord or as you know him:Taran Zhu.

“Every act of agression leads to a reprisal, and every reprisal is an act of agression itself”

When first this vicious cycle begins, it will no longer matter if you were the Victim once, you will have become the Abuser.

Not to mention, when you are the Victim are you then excused for your own actions?

To make it less headachish.
I get assaulted by a person, I defend myself but on top of that I apply henious injuries to my assaultsman.

And I am talking obvious ones that should be excused as self defense.
Shoumd I then not Stand Trial for my actions?

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You touch my lovely Lightbulbies and I’ll touch your face with my hoof.

We are not going to discuss such things here. Self defense is not an abuse and let’s just leave it at that.

I am now heartbroken after learning I am not getting my ring.

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79

Preach queen

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I dunno…

Am I the only one that actually feels ‘good’ that the Light is capable of doing this? In the case that what the Mag’har Orcs say about the Lightbound is true, I’m actually happy that they’re doing it like that.

'Cause it mainly gives a perspective that I felt died away when the Scarlets did. Not saying they ARE Scarlets, but being radical with the Light and doing your thing believing your own ideals is actually pretty damn nice story-wise.

81

Do you want to be my friend?

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82

In the Light we are one.

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