One would think a game called World of WARCRAFT would give a little more importance to the WAR part of it. Especially with two factions.
Oh well.
I think we have pvp servers for that, or warmode these days.
We are currently at war with Xal’atath, so I don’t see your point.
Factions in a game dividing the playerbase just make RL racism / xenophoby fester, it’s positive WoW is slowly evolving beyond that.
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Racism against what? Orcs? Those drunken Dwarves? those filthy Gnomes?
Im sure they are very offended.
Whatever people like goes i guess, but personally i hate that games are getting increasingly “safe” and sterilized.
Every time an NPC calls me “Hero of the Light” i audibly cringe and wish i could shove my spear up their… You get the point.
Also, Human king guy, i am NOT your “friend”. (referencing TWW main quest)
I actively seek out games with two warring factions that give players an excuse to pvp. It makes things much more exciting.
but this is not the point of the thread. This is about M+ toddlers having a tantrum >:D
Horde players VS alliance players - groups at conventions pitted against each other and cursing each other. It’s awful.
And yes, even ingame it teaches that some ppl looking different are your enemy just because they look different. It’s not about the actual ingame races but the mannerism the game encourages.
That kind of thinking would’ve been all right if Horde stayed the “evil” faction and Horde players would have been aware that they are playing the “evil guys”, but that has no longer been the case for a long time if ever.
Oh for real? i didnt know that.
People not being able to separate in game politics from IRL are just mentally ill tbh.
OFC dont condone those messages. I just want an excuse to ambush people randomly >:D.
Couldn’t care less what they look like. Only that their name is red
But i digress.
My topics are just the best.
In other words you are talking about new players in a 20+ year old game that have yet to try mythic + and / or raiding.
Because very bad players with no keybindings etc. who have been around for lets say 10+ years cant possibly have their skill level based around 3 months old content - They can be bad, for sure, but delves are brand new content.
Point is the subject of this thread has been going on since m+ was born. Its just different flavours per expansion. People in keys who should not be there is known and will always be a case.
In 06/07 some knucklehead in my hometown beat up another guy in a nightclub for playing horde 
Difference, other then the obvious ones between dungeon vs raid, between a +10 and mythic raid is huge.
How many percent of people participating in m+ are pushing beyond 10 and how many are pushing really high? Not many.
The average “m+ player” (if you can call someone that since very few only do one type of content) is not skilled enough for mythic raiding - with mythic raiding meaning taking down the whole raid tier before a season ends.
If you are a 20 year old supertalented football player in the premier league being headhunted by the biggest clubs…
The other 20 year old with a decent talent playing in league 2 or 3 being scouted by clubs slightly better - is still also a football player. So is the 30 year old bench warmer in the same club who gets subbed in now and then.
And anything in between.
The average “m+ pusher” who does keys around +10 and slightly above is not a equivalent to the Mbappe/Haaland etc. type of player even though some think they are - For that you have to be amongst the few who competes for world first, maybe top 10-20 guilds in mythic raiding etc.
OR amongst the top players in m+ competitions.
Sentences that begin with “in other words” are usually bs and/or manipulative. An obvious attempt to put different words into someone’s mouth, usually followed by an argument against that self-created strawman. Have fun arguing with him. Let me know if he ever responded.
Don’t encourage them…
This is such a strange and weird thread.
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Not by intention from my part. There is always noice when communication occurs, add to that a language barrier since English is not my main language.
That being that, the subject of this thread: This has been a debate ever since they created and released m+. Trough hte xpacs people searches for different reasons for it, and connects it to expansion-specific (solo)-content,.
Thats a pretty natural conclusion to come to, but if you look at the big picture of the timeline since they released m+:
Borrowed power in legion, bfa, shadowlands, visions, torghast, delves, titanforging, and probably a lot more since i just returned to game a month a go after almost 3 years break…
What is the constant relevant to this subject that has been there all the time?
The players and subject referred to in this OP. They are going to be there regardless of what happens to delves, and / or if delves even exists or not.
The situation is completely different today. We have never had a super easy mode solo “dungeon like” experience in the game that provides enough gear to eventually lure those delvers directly into +8s, which are much harder than +8s in previous expansions, making the problem even worse. This is a new type of player called “delver” that is turning Mythic+ into a nightmare.
This has nothing to do with baddies in general playing m+ or other parts of the game. They will always be here and will always be the majority.
True enough - But more or less soloing yourself to decent itemlevel hasnt been exactly difficult in previous xpacs either, with the above mentioned borrowed power, legendaries and so on - but ofc, delves is something new and thus one could say something like this was expected.
so most of these will have a bad experience, where some will not return to m+ at all, some will realize they should start building up experience from m0 and then low keys, and some will repeat the same thing expecting different result - sounds a lot the story of this part of the game since 20 years ago - only in new versions.
it -should- adjust itself given time, i dont see tww getting a couple of million new subscribers over the night with no previous experience easymoding themselves to itemlevel 610-620 and leroy jenkins-in head first into a +8s.
Secondly you should based on your experiences by now be able to divide the 620 “delver” from the 620 with an adequate m+ rating for the content, applying to a group you are in or being part of an existing group if you are going to pug.
obv. +8 is not the same as last time i played m+ wich was shadowlands, what the equivalent for a +8 is in the past im not precisely sure of, at least +10 if not more (?)
Wait what how?
You know that trolls, orcs, undeads, gnomes, worgens, goblins, cows with humanlike intelligense and so on is pure fiction right?
“Currently at war with Xal`atath” - Yeah, wich will be killed in the last raid tier and replaced by another godlike villain that gods couldnt beat without the help of the heroes of azeroth and so on - and some expansions in the future when they are out of ideas this Xalatath character makes a return, she wasnt dead after all even though she was dead etc.
And when all that becomes legacy mode you go in an solo gods, planets, galaxies, sargeras and after that get killed by a pack of boars in current content.
Competition between factions is or was the very idea behind this game, but with all the romantic scenes of Thrall and Proudmore hugging into the sunset i dont see those times coming back.
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Just imagine Thrall hugging her and then as the sun sets he eats her face off with a big ol’ bite! >:D
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More like the nightmare of poorly designed m+ and class ballance.
hot damn, this is actually getting hilarious 
Imagine a not-even 620 who has never been m+ or even LFR is trying to flame someone who actually plays the game you are something else bud. First of all I wonder how did u figured out that I’m stuck somewhere, tell me pls. You are the one who seems stuck on fresh 80 forever secondly, I’m, unlike you, playing the game without demanding something extra I don’t deserve or need. I play for the things I desire and you can too. That’s how this always worked and it won’t change because a few bambies are unhappy with their own in-game capability.
Delve players do not need better rewards for delve content, that’s a fact. You especially. You don’t even play the damn game, your opinions are less than irrelevant.
you are all full of terms like “gatekeeping”, while failing to understand what problems would it cause if you actually get a better reward for solo content. NOBODY cares about what gear you personally run delves, and what content you play, but IF a delve reward is the same as for group content it would shift the meta and EVERYONE who cares about their character progression would be forced to play solo content. For literally no other reason than delvers greed.
Maybe you guys should think about a different game, this clearly is not made for you.
well, that is exactly what you guys are.
You personally admitted that you are a beginner. There is nothing against you sticking with the content you are confident playing. It amazes me how terms like “Delver” or “Casual” keep insulting you.
BTW: I want the new bike mount, but I won’t do that never-ending boring questline, I believe, m+/raid runners should have easier access to that world content mount too, without being forced to do the quests. And you know what, we are playing the same pixels calling a game after all, how about giving it for free to everyone, just send it by mail. And when you are on it, pls make raid reward m+ items as well, and vice versa. XOXO
Maybe, just maybe, it´s because they´re actively being presented AS insults, just like every other word in the past 1000 years that started out as a simple description and morphed into an insult, because that was clearly the intent behind the statements of those using it?
“Tryhard” was also not an insult until it was used to actively demean people that took the videogames more seriously than most people would consider healthy… this is merely the opposite side of the same coin. If it´s being actively used to offend, then wondering why it´s being taken offense to is at best ignorant…
It´s all just a question of context, becasuse sentences contain more than one word and the surrounding words can completely alter the message being delivered.
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