The Scarlet Monastery has never fallen

Lore Story
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Sorry for this long post and hopefully its readable. Most will hate this idea/headcanon but it really is the only logical thing at this stage.

The Scarlet Monastery - In short Lets believe for one moment that the Monastery has been defended successfully or retaken by the Crusade every signal time it has been attacked. They may have lost leaders troops but in the end. Its the same result they remain, And if the PTR becomes a thing will mean that the DK class order failed in there task during legion and they were forced to retreat after the player left.

(incoming rocks thrown at me)

But think about it even before Vanilla the place was raided by the scourge in a event known as the “Summertide Assaults”.

Then Vanilla hits its raided again but still standing - people later just said it is because of whitemane ressing the fallen crusaders.

Burning Crusade Same thing - Must be because of whitemane.

Lich king - Same thing actually I think people were pushing that it was just gone even though later we frond out it wasn’t.

Cata - Its back and not only that the crusade has expanded to a new holdout known as the Scarlet Palisade - also a group of scarlet rebels shows up with support from the alliance. And on horde dark ranger velonara is there promising to end the scarlets once and for all.

MoP - They are back so the rebels must of been wiped out in the end and the horde forces pushed back. People then believed they were finally gone for good this time because Voss stabs whitemane with magic swords to stop her from coming back this time.

People believed ok 100% scarlets have to be gone from the monastery.

Warlords no updates ( but guess what scarlets at the monastery )

Legion - Scarlets back dks move in to raise Whitemane and only to find the crusade is still there under a new commander and we are told that they will not leave until all the crusaders are dead this time.

BFA - PTR showing scarlets still at the monastery

Now we the players have been fed the same sort of plot for every villain faction in the game we get hit by the big bad and then.

After that we butcher it weather its twilight/orcs/undead/demons you name it the big scary foe all of a sudden becomes almost of a joke which is a shame really that it always feels one sided.

We don’t really get to see what’s happening on the other side what are they doing on a day to day level I’ve seen people even mention or state what victory’s do the Crusade even have? And unless you have been around since Vanilla or have seen books sources ingame you really wont hear of them.

I mean in Legion we frond out they actually tired to make a new ashbringer or the fact back in cata they were training crazy op agents such as Voss? Even the fact that they were able to expand there holdouts to the Scarlet Palisade surely means something.

Or are we to believe the forsaken just stood back and allow the crusade to build such holdings without interfering? No way the Forsaken would allow it.

So surely there must of been so sort of fight battle etc, But do we the players hear of it? nope all we get to see is from a players perspective within the game using the Quest System.

I mean what is more logical to you? That yes there must be fights, battles we don’t hear of once the quest/film ends.

Or that new Scarlets members just pop up afterwards somehow making it past horde and alliance forces on there way to the monastery and simply occupy it.

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There’s a DK class order hall? :scream_cat: Coulda fooled me in this xpac :rofl:

Seriously though, It will be interesting to see the Scarlets return to become more prominent with the Void pressing down on Azeroth’s future, but I fear for any future Scarlet Crusade to be butchered in the writing.

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I fear your right - like that PTR giving no option to alliance players on weather or not they would want to help dark ranger velonara out or not.

All we know so far is Scarlet Halls will be used, and while its known that the crusade and alliance are now hostile to each other there has been examples in the past were goals have been every much in line as seen with the renegades

-This is a chance once more for blizzard to explore something more then simply

Quest go kill bad guys" Why not “Help crusade fight dark rangers”

Why would an alliance player do something like that? reasons pretty clear its a dark ranger for one and two there is a war on, as for the crusade there is very much a anti undeath theme going around more so now then ever before we have seen how zealous the lightforged draenei can be and with the Crusades leaders once again dead so far there is no one telling these scarlet members not to talk to this Elf or that Gnome etc

Because they have the plague or these other races threaten the sovereignty of are kingdom! etc there is a chance here to actually explore something more of what we saw in Cata with the renegades.

This doesn’t have to be a Scarlet joining the Alliance thing I for one like the Rogue element they don’t even have to be the good guys But simply be cool if from a alliance player perspective no way I am helping a Dark Ranger out and Sides with the Scarlets instead throw them a bone for once.

As for my first Post at the top - again if they come back as shown in the PTR its more logical to believe that the crusade have actually held the line all this time.

And yes I to am wondering what the Ebon blade storyline will lead to “Guessing more scarlet killing” although it would be fun to see more anti blade vs argents round two.

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To be honest, I would be surprised if there even is a Scarlet Crusade left at this point.

The Scarlet Crusade has been one of the biggest punching bags in all of fiction. A smaller faction that lives off seeping money, recruits and resources out of the remaining human kingdom that already has a manpower shortage, they have been perpetually beat down in almost every single WoW expansion by the Horde, the Alliance, the Scourge and the Legion - defeat after defeat after defeat.

Despite them being a bad guy faction, I can’t help but feel sorry for the one-sided stomping they have received.

While I liked the concept of the Scarlet Crusade as a faction, I do not see how they could ever do a return. Given their abysmal track record in war and constant denunciation in the kingdom of Stormwind, I would be impressed if they found a meaningful number of willing recruits, let alone any experienced personnel at all.

If you are a merchant or nobleman, you know based on the Crusade’s track record that investing or donating money to the Crusade is equivalent to throwing it down the well.
And if you think of signing up with the Scarlet Crusade to fight, well
 going by their track record, you know you’ll be shunned by your peers; your parents will likely disown you; and you’ll be signing up for certain death as a cannonfodder; unable to achieve any victory of significance; and very likely also suffer a cruel and degrading reanimation as undead for an indeterminate amount of time.

I would feel genuinely sorry for whoever took it upon themselves to try to restart the Scarlet Crusade with their current track record o.O

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And that’s my point given all the times we have gone out of our way to attack the crusade it only makes sense that there has been more going on, after the Curtins are closed and the quests are turned in.

I argue that the Monastery has never fallen, sure attacked loses of troops but in the end. The Crusade has only pushed each attack back as it is the only logical outcome at this stage. (If the PTR becomes a thing)

I mean really think about it, every time we hand in a quest about there down fall, it isn’t the player leaves only to find out later nope they are still there. The Player wins the battle but not the war if I am making sense.

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Don’t forget that they’re still in Northend. In Legion you had to recruit a woman from them as a priest.

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I guess this very old vid is still actual:

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It’s time to mana bomb the place.
Salt the earth and blight the ruins.

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I thought we were the good guys here? :stuck_out_tongue:

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Na everything you know is a lie! the crusade are the good guys.

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so there are like cockroaches no matter how many you kill there are alway more

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I mean it is not said fully out right but “It is also the only hierarchy left that originates from the kingdom of Lordaeron after its destruction by the Scourge.”

So If you think about it the crusade most likely would of held most of what was left of the living population of Lordaeron, besides who ever ran. away. People have been born and raised under the crusades care.

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ah yeah true, she was there as an emmisary at first then became a follower if I recall.

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However the thing is, the Scarlet Monastery -has- fallen. It is fallen. How is it possible that after countless times of having everyone killed there, after the Scarlets going mad, and a large chunk of them being risen as Undead, after living on Undercities doorstep, and the Ebon Blade murdering their way through everyone who lived there, that people do not think it has fallen?

Everyone knows that many of those older starting zones are not reflective of lore, I mean are the Blackrock still attacking Elwynn Forest? is Darnassus still a city? Did the Exodar crash yesterday, and is Dark’han Drathir still running around Deatholme?

No, so why do people think there are still happy camper Scarlets in Tirisfal, when the starting Forsaken Quest Experience has you go out and kill them?
For that matter why do people think that they exist in any large numbers anymore, given that every time we encounter them, we Kill them.

Those few that remain would be either those, like in the Legion class Hall, who repent of their Scarlet Wickedness, and rejoin the Priesthood of the Holy Light, or they are insane loners, or they are Forsaken ex- Scarlets, or, (My personal favourite) a rag-tag tiny band of survivalists, hated by all, Horde, Alliance, Ebons, Argents, the whole world is their enemy, so they must constantly stay on the move, fend for themselves, and repair their degrading armour and weapons, whilst still devoutly clinging to their ideal of warring against the Forsaken, supplies will run short, so they must steal or barter with those rare folk who will treat with them, life will be hard, especially in the winter months, it would be a bitter, gruelling existence. Anyone who has ever played the RPG ‘Twilight:2000’ will have an idea what I mean. Now -that’s- the kind of Scarlet story I would really find interesting


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And while yes I agree with you that should of been the outcome at least because of what was suggested yet again during the dk event in legion.

What has yet again shown up in the PTR scarlets still at the monastery even though the Ebon blade promised and I quote -

"However, the Scarlet Crusade has terrorized the people of Azeroth long enough. Therefore, our work here this day will not be done until every crusader has fallen, every stone has crumbled, and every banner burned. "

Well the place is still standing and crusaders still at the place as shown in the PTR we can say so far leaderless and the Blade did get whitemane but clearly they have failed in there task.

So what is the most logical reason right now then as to why the scarlets are still there I ask you because only three pop up.

  1. Somehow yet again the crusade managed to push back the invading force and retake the monastery after the player leaves.

  2. There is still other scarlet outposts in the area such as the Palisade which never suggested was wiped out fully in the past quests in the area only told you to kill 10 scarlets - not only that but in the update of tristful glades the Voss npc was removed from the area but not the scarlet npcs around her.

  3. New scarlet members showing up - now they can only come from one place right the alliance but many on the forum almost zealously in there writing say no way alliance members would join the crusade, not to mention how would they even get there with war zones going on.

“Everyone knows that many of those older starting zones are not reflective of lore, I mean are the Blackrock still attacking Elwynn Forest? is Darnassus still a city? Did the Exodar crash yesterday, and is Dark’han Drathir still running around Deatholme?”

A but you see there is a big difference the monastery HAS been updated to reflect almost every expansion that guess what the scarlets are still kicking despite well comments on the forums.

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I mean, consider this - the Scarlet Monastery has been raided more times than any other location on Azeroth and beyond. It’s the go-to dungeon for Blizzard to put re-used content and buy time.

Let’s face it - the monastery has been penetrated more times than an old sea port wench. And by more people, might I add.

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Despite opinions in the end the lore has to be accepted as blizzard puts it out. Like I don’t think any1 liked green Jesus chosen one thing during Cata or the ending of Warlords and so on, but every time the crusade once again shows up at the monastery it has to be accepted I just think at this stage we are going to be forced to look at it from a logical lore standpoint at this stage. And that is simply the crusade is not this easily “I can beat them with one hand tired behind my back” sort of mindset I think we all have developed.

Only time will tell with the PTR sure maybe it will even be explained to us on what’s going on. Although I wouldn’t bet on it.

Rather then make a new topic I noticed this from a player on Argent Dawn EU - I think it may be of interested to some.

Up until now the Ashbringer Comic was seen as canon because of this it made some events what happened ingame with the crusade none cannon however now with legion it seems events ingame with the crusade are cannon once again.

This may not be a big deal to some but it sorta is, Details like Balnazzar didn’t make the scarlet crusade it already was around before him.

The Crusade did have none human members within its ranks.

It was a force of good before Balnazzar infiltrated the crusade.

Argent Dawn came after the Crusade.

and the list goes on.

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