The State of Horde RP

I’ve long boggled at Blizzard’s refusal, in the constraints of resources and development time, to engage in simple exposition. This black void of story progression and post-BFA worldbuilding for the Horde could be fixed by a 1800-word freshman essay released as a short story, or a character - ANY character, facing the camera and stiffly explaining the worldstate to us.

It doesn’t need a content patch, it doesn’t require actually updating the worldstate in terms of assets and zones, and it would walk a mile for the Horde’s place in the setting. Easiest thing in the world and they snub it for whatever reason.

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You’ll read another story about the offscreen wedding of Lorthemar and thalyssra and you’ll like it (for 49.99€)

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I met a bunch of PCU people 8 months ago and now im plotting server takeover WTF, the slippery slope is real.

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true i think

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as someone who rped as part of a grunt guild, unsubbed now rip, this was a large factor as to why - the enjoyment of the horde for me was that they were underdogs and banded together out of necessity, that they fit the perception of monsters by having some classic fantasy-monster races

and by the second expansion in wow the rag-tag monster theming left with blood elves, attempted to return with goblins but only brought capitalist jokes, and then was diminished even further with allied races

perhaps its just the great doomer in me but since df launched i’ve pretty staunchly believed factions just don’t matter anymore and will continue not to matter in the future, faction specific stories don’t exist anymore because an undead can aid in amirdrassil coming to azeroth and the reclamation of gilneas

even as a pretty big horde fan i feel bad for the alliance not mattering too

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Yeah true, I do all of that on the daily! :sunglasses:

Had this happen a few time to me. Just being out RPing somewhere then running into a group and getting asked if I wanted to attend an event since its in the area.

Damn, that’s eight whole PCU’s in one single post!

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Yeah, this was/is true, f’sure. It didn’t help that BFA became a bit of a joke of “Wait, which one is Honour again…?”

Which bugs the hell out of me as, with what should have been subtle Old God manipulation, BFA was the perfect time for the Alliances ‘yes, they can be Jerks too’ side to come to the fore.
What a waste :pensive:

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I feel like one of the main reasons why faction stories are not going to matter is because if you make an alliance story you should also have a horde story and making 2 stories takes longer then making 1 story and Blizzards recent design philosophy changed to having more recent content updates but I think the story team is simply not able to keep up so is forced to write only shared experiences everyone can engage in to adhere to their own goals in terms of delivering content

the issue is however that a lot of the content feels out of place as a result, imo warcraft is its factions, the factions should be its main focus regardless of wether its peace or war times, the factions are in my eyes this stories foundation. Not the cosmic lore that describes how the universe works but the actual factions and the races and their interactions and reasons for making the choices they do.

So tldr I don’t think blizzard is trying to intentionally make the story more homogenous and intentionally squeeze out the unique flavours that you get with the individual races and cultures within those factions, I think its just an unintended consequence of this need to keep pushing new content faster and faster; the story just can’t keep up

Otherwise yeah I agree, with or without conflict in the lore, the first decision we make in the game is what faction our character is going to join and the idea that neither will be a strong focus point is just a shame

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As I mentioned in other thread,

I think that a lack of conflict between the playable factions isn’t really what’s hurting Horde lore the most. If anything, the utterly butchered state they’ve left the entire setting since the end of Legion can be seen throughout every avenue the writers have touched ever since.

It just so happens that the Horde has been a topic they’ve touched up on quite a bit, then discarded like an used tissue and without warning in 8.2.5, leaving us in a cliffhanger on what the state of several major factions of the Horde are, with some lasting for over two years, and some others lasting to this very day (as of time of writing).

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I have zero problem with the PCU, I leave them to it and they pay their subs just like we all do, I just (Purely my opinion) think they bear some responsibility for damaging RP, however I didn’t ask for some of you to come derail the thread with passive aggressive sarcasm, so please, go make your own thread. Someone’s given their account and you’ve taken the piss, there’s just no need.

WoW’s creative team do have much of the brunt of the blame in terms of vague Horde lore post BfA, and honestly the upcoming expansions do not seem to remedy this, unless I suppose if you’re an elf in Midnight. - The game is very elf/human centric as it is, so I can get why people would be discouraged playing anything else.

I think I’ve self reflected through interactions on this thread and feel I’ve been harsh to some, and outright arrogant in other places. As said above it comes from a place of frustration and not malice however. All I can do is try to take some suggestions on board, throw some suggestions of my own out, and interact with those whom I’d previously seen as ‘lore breaking’ (Upon which I’ve been informed is probably not the case.) - I can hopefully move on and get some worthwhile roleplay out of it.

Again, I can only applaud your posts in this thread.

This is the linchpin of my doubt. I have been in every Church of the Holy Light discord since mid-legion. My RP with them has been sporadic and sparse, and has been diminished greatly in the seven years since this was relevant, but I still stick around, because I like to keep an eye on things. But seven years ago, I was more active, and I was even approached with the original browncloak pitch. At the time I said no, for various reasons, but I still saw the development. And if the PCU was involved, it has got to be the sneakiest involvement I have ever seen.

First of all, the timeline is wrong. If I have understood it correctly, the PCU did not start properly before BfA. The Church kerfuffle was late Legion, and it did not start with the void elves. They were very unpopular before that too, due to their somewhat conservative view of death knights and warlocks, and some interpretations of the lore. A lot of people had a chip on their shoulders against the Church, and when void elves were released, the Church was practically overrun with void elves going “Heehoo you can’t touch me I’m a part of the Alliance now”, to which I believe the only response was “Ma’am this is a place of prayer.”

Bottom line is, the actual ‘lynchings’ happened during the content drought, I believe. During BfA people had more important things to worry about.

The second point is that at no point did the PCU have any representation in any of the discords. If they did, they had secret channels in which they schemed and plotted, and the average guild member was not made aware. Perhaps not so weird that the average member did not find out, since the PCU was not created yet. You’d honestly be better off blaming Berach, he was at least in the discord server.

Anyways, all of this to say, this is the main issue with PCU critique. They are ascribed with a ton of crimes that they supposedly did, but without any evidence. How can I trust the rest of your post when I know you just said a falsehood? I don’t think you lied on purpose. I think you’ve heard it from someone you know, who heard it from someone they know, who heard it from someone they know, who misremembered it and conflated two groups of IC bigots into one.

The PCU truly has become some sort of boogeyman, where they are consistently made out to be the enemy of fun, who comes in just to harass and ridicule your RP. We saw this exact thing happen when Dark Rangers released, and you had two factions pointing at each other claiming “You are PCU, you want to destroy my fun!” whilst none of them were PCU.

Now, my history with the PCU hasn’t been all pleasant either. I had my own little clash with them during BFA, which I do think severely hampered my RP for a while. But also, I’ve come to the conclusion that that was six years ago. People change during that time. I am a completely different person to back then, and I imagine a lot of the PCU members are too. Even if they’re not, so much of the membership and leadership has rotated out. They are different people now. So, I have forgiven them and found out that most PCU members I meet today are generally pretty chill.

Yeah, that’s my ted talk.

To bring it back on topic to something a bit more constructive, I’m still interested in what Bulletchewer’s RP event outline looks like. Last I asked, I got a list of vague requirements, but that’s not an outline. That’s a goal. An outline would describe where it is, what the theme is, what the vibe is, who’s invited, that sort of thing. So, here’s to hoping it’ll be released soon.

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I, at no point, asked for an RP event, you asked what I’d do, and I wouldn’t know, I’ve never run one, a lot of them tend to be a guild/GMs vanity project from outward appearances anyway.

I think Horde RP would be helped by more organic, less turn up and force something once a week roleplay, but the server has neither the numbers or interest in the Horde to achieve that.

Though, sure. Orgrimmar, Socialising, Relaxed, anyone. Why does it HAVE to be an event, however?

I was gonna scroll up and see wtf you’re all talking about but

Do I need to, really, when pcu is mentioned

In all sincerity, Argent dawn is too large of a server, and has too diverse of a playerbase for any one player - or even any one group of players - to kill it. Perroy and the guilds associated with him didn’t kill Horde RP. Keti Whitefur, mother of two, didn’t kill Horde RP. Random RPers that nobody has ever heard of did not kill Horde RP.

I don’t even think you can make the arguement that Blizzard killed Horde RP because while yes, it’s diminished over the years, people still partake in it and want to partake in it. You can argue that it’s dying, diminishing, dormant, but it isn’t gone and nothing sort of Blizzard shutting the game down will ever truly kill it.

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You can be sincere and a pedant at the same time.

?
I’m genuinely not sure what you’re trying to say with that. I only posted that because my previous post was poking fun at the person who turned it into another “PCU ate my family” show.

The PCU had nothing to do with that and this Church of the Holy Light angle is hogwash. It was just people RPing peasants / commoners driven crazy by the Void/N’Zoth/K’thir/whatever (during 8.3 when N’zoth was invading Azeroth) and then went out to try and lynch Void Elves, who were arguably the easiest targets to label as potential cultist spies and agents while they were also the most knowledgeable when it came to dealing with the Void and Old Gods.

Your entire post is basically saying “Yeah, no one can kill RP, the servers too big, blizzard can’t do it no harm, it’s dying, dormant diminishing.”

With respect, this is wordplay and doesn’t add anything.