I don’t care about subjective points of view. And this is slowly detailing into some Sylvanas topic.
Going back to your initial claim, you argued against the premise that some leader (Sylvanas name came up), wasn’t motivated by her people’s safety or survival when she made a deal or meddled with some dark energy. That’s blatantly false, as those were her literal motives as she herself proclaimed later and wondered about it to herself.
Also, beheading an orc and using the head as part of the ritual is worse than genocide apparently.
I am sorry then, I misunderstood your statement 
Heavily dependent on the background. We keep receiving information that Sylvanas is evil and Tyrande is an avatar of vengeance. In the light of this, if a Horde leader did the same - a bad guy 
Not quite. See above. Depends on the background. Add to that, that what Tyrande does is, I believe, supposed to feel dark and brutal. They are arming Night Elves with their fangs again.
They also made “Draenor is free!”.
Exactly. Hence, depends on what a character is supposed to be in the story.
Again, exactly. Hence, Blizzard is apparently doing a good job with:
… After all
I wouldn’t do what Tyrande did. But in my personal “eye of the beholder” it’s easier to stomach when she does it than Sylvanas because in my “eye of the beholder” Sylvanas is evil.
You and everyone else is more than welcome to have a very different opinion.
Your tusks are quite majestic. I see you even drilled holes in your scarf to accommodate them properly xD
Who said that?
But not like she protected them because they care about them or sth. She need them to survive. Why do you think that he compares them with her arrows? She “saves” her people to protect herself. It’s a selfish act.
Again with the terminology. Alleria has a similar phrase regarding her soldiers, she wants them dead too?
And once again, round you go shooting at random concepts that have nothing to do with the argument at hand.
We have Sylvanas stating she wants to save them, and had said goal with Helya. Not on some short story from 10 years ago, but on the latest novel that features her inner thoughts. There is nothing else to say.
My girlfriend was marketed a pretty different scenario when she made her Forsaken.
Again, that depends on the perspective.
And I find it reasonable to say that “from my point of view this looks bad, even if I understand that from yours it’s…less so”.
What I will usually find myself arguing against, are statements about “This is objectively evil because from my point of view, it’s seen as such”.
I know…gotta look good. Spending lots of time hanging around Zandalari chicks.
Better show off how big my…tusks…are. Wink,wink.
Everyone want to save their people. But it’s kinda different with Undead. Everyone would have an other opinion about that. It’s war. You send your troops to the frond as an member of the alliance like everyone else to win the war and protect the civilians.
Or it’s kinda: "Oh I just realized that I even saved them… that does not really suit me but whatever.
She had taken her flagship, the Windrunner, to Stormheim in the Broken Isles in search of more Val’kyr to resurrect the fallen. It was, thus far, the only way Sylvanas had found to create more Forsaken. “I was almost able to enslave the great Eyir. She would have given me the Val’kyr for all eternity. None of my people would have ever died again.” She paused. “I would have saved them.”
Before the Storm.
From the curse that I spread about all living beings by raising them as Undead
Maybe it’s just something what she realized but don’t really care about that. We all know that she don’t care about anyone. Look at Undercity where she blighted her own troops!
No, from dying.
Her pale brows drew together in a terrible frown. “Do they want extinction, then?” she hissed, anger flaring brightly inside her. “Do they want to be rotting in the earth?”
Next page.
To save the rest she sacrificed a minority. And then issued this speech:
Honor means nothing to a corpse, Saurfang. You have the luxury of underestimating death, but it is something with which I am intimately familiar.
Maybe you don’t care if your people die so long as it is honorable, but to me, this Horde is worth saving. Anyone who disagrees does not deserve to stand among us.
Doesn’t sound like someone willing to have them all killed.
That makes no sense. Do you want to say that Sylvanas is a gift for all dead creatures because she doom their soul by raising them as Undead?
No, I’m saying that no matter how much you try to derail it, or try and put words in my mouth regarding this, what Sylvanas does in Stormheim is about wanting to save her people (the Forsaken), from dying.
And your claim about she wanting the Horde dead or simply not caring about it, goes against several sources I’ve already quoted.
What have she ever done for the Horde? It’s just her perspective that she saves the forsaken. Other would see it differently.
What did she say back in the days?
What joy is there in this curse?
What are we if not slaves to this torment?
Saving its leaders at the Broken Shore? Defending Quelthalas and the Ghostlands? The list is quite extensive.
But really, this is reaching absurd levels of moving goal posts.
Sylvanas used the dark powers (or tried to) of Helya to save her people. Her own words.
But people demonised her for it.
Why do you not comment on the quotes?
I will do.
This quotes were before she knew, what real torment awaits after its really over. Compared to the eternal torment that awaits afterwards, undeath is a gift. Because for all we know, every undead can go there after death… so undeath is the only thing keeping them from the eternal anguish
Because I won’t tackle derailments.
And I’m growing tired of arguing about random tangential stuff you feel like throwing into the thread.
Your claim was about how Sylvanas wasn’t trying to save her people with her deal with Helya. I proved that you are wrong and even quoted a novel that points at it.
There is really nothing else to say.
I don’t feel like going into another debate about how evil someone thinks Sylvanas is.
Okay another question: “Why Sylvanas killed herself”. I mean of you think it’s random stuff then you should be able to answer that at least. She doesn’t wanted to life that way. After her third chance she started to raise every human from his grave? What changed her mind?
Are you ignoring the unlife changing fact for her? Dying and seeing what awaits afterwards?
Oh I hate being undead, I kill myself -> dead -> real eternal torment -> comes back -> doenst want to die again
Here a pandaren version of all:
you tell that the lasagna you are eating tastes like garbage -> you get real garbage to eat because you didnt appreciate the lasagna -> you now know, its real garbage or lasagna forever and you have to choose. -> you of course take the lasagna! and will do everything to never get the garbage treatment ever again!