I saw Uther’s Afterlives video and not gonna lie it was pretty interesting. However there are a couple questions I have
When Uther’s soul got split in two, did Uther realize what happened? Is the one part aware of the other’s existence? Does Uther know what his other half said, did, or thought? Does he know the other half forgave Arthas?
Are there two different consciousnesses now? Because that would mean that there are two different Uthers and as such, two separate souls. Two different people. If that’s the case, which one is by definition the most “real” Uther?
If the two were to merge into one, would that cause Uther to suffer from split personality disorder? Because if it’s two different souls then they are two different people, since the concept is that you don’t have a soul but rather you are a soul and what you have is a body.
When Frostmourne broke all the freed souls went to the Shadowlands. Does that mean that Terenas saw Uther and Devos coming down to claim Arthas in the end?
Is the Archon a tyrant? We see the Kyrian being afraid to voice any thoughts that might upset the Archon. When Devos does, she is demoted. Seems pretty totalitarian to me.
This one is basically a definitely.
Bastion is, ironically enough considering how good guy they look in appearance, the most horrificly cultish and creepy afterlife possible.
I wouldn’t be surprised if this comes into play in Shadowlands, and the whole split in two soul thing plays a part in Uther’s arc.
The concept of a soul is that of existence and conciousness, which remains unharmed even after the breaking of one’s body, which serves only as a vessel. This, as a concept, is pretty fair and makes sense, considering it would be a dick move to stop existing at the point of your death. Just imagine how non-existence would feel in comparison to existence. Are you having fun with this thought?
Uther’s soul split in two is indeed confusing, strange, difficult to grasp, and to some, “dumb”. It might as well be a dumb concept for a soul being split into two different hypostases (beings). But keep in note that this “splitting” is an idea of Blizzard and Blizzard alone, that serves the story arc of a FICTIONAl character in a FICTIONAL universe. That does not mean the real life concept of a soul/spirit is “dumb”.
They are two different things. The concept of the soul is about an existence, a conciousness being immortal even after bodily death, while the other concept, Blizzard’s concept, is about magical swords being able to split an existence into two seperate ones.
So I’d suggest that you correct your comment into: “See, this is why concept of souls splitting in two seperate beings through the magic of WoW’s version of hell is dumb ”.
No, it doesn’t make sense because consciousness is an effect of a biological construct such as the brain and by altering the brain we can easily alter consciousness which is can be easily proven.
So claiming that soul is a vessel for consciousness is a pure fiction which btw ignores the facts.
No, it wouldn’t because no one owes you anything and you don’t deserve anything.
There is no point in imagining non-existence because when your brain dies you can’t experience anything.
She’s not demoted, the archon orders her to stop her preoccupation with the maw. Devos disobeys, ascends Uther and then starts a chain of events which screws everything up, probably none of this would have happened if she listened to the archon.
The whole soul splitting thing is a retcon. Period.
Not once was that kind of thing ever PRESENT or noticeable or even planned before!
And not only does this go against Uther’s character, it’s an abomination.
It should have been Sylvanas to throw Arthas into the Maw or whatever…making a pact with Jailor to punish Arthas even in afterlife, something something.
I watched the new cinematic many times, but nothing can rid me off of the ‘cringy’ story about Uther and the soul splitting.
And ofc…let’s depict Angel-like people as bad once more, let’s head with the Diablo style… Sigh
Still a bit of story to go and discover, but I didn’t like what they did with Uther or Arthas, OR Kyrian either…
Hopefully the rest of the story will be more intriguing to me.
That sounds terrible. You couldn’t even finish your own idea.
To think that proposal is less “cringy” than the Uther story is baffling. There is nothing “cringy” about what happened with Uther.
You mean depicting angels as… angels…?
Frostmourne was created from the darkness within the Maw, that was apparent from the animation. It would make no sense for Frostmourne to consume 100% of the soul and stop it going to the source of it’s power, the Shadowlands.
Frostmourne no longer consumes / traps (whatever) the entire soul, just a fraction.
This
…unless, the Arbiter would have decided to send Arthas straight to the Maw anyway…the suggestion is, that he would have been given one final chance at redemption in Venthyr by the Arbiter…but that a person or persons unknown, wanted to make sure that didn’t happen, for reasons as yet unclear…Frostmourne having its origin in the Maw, also makes things a bit complicated.
Could frostmourne trapping part of a soul not be a strategic design rather than a simple nerf?
So we know the wielder of frostmourne grows in the power the more souls it houses, so this part stands.
However with the sending a fractured soul to the SL, that could be a strategic move by the creator to undermine the SL to hasten the Jailers escape? After all these broken souls don’t belong wherever they end up due to being partial, as Devos noted when considering Uther. Send enough of them into the various realms and you undermine their natural orders, filling them with contaminated soils and causing stuff like what Devos and Uther did to occur (ie just completely ignoring the process and chucking people in the Maw). That only benefits the Jailer.
Its possible that when the soul got split that the selfless part got sucked into frostmourne while the resentful one moved on to the shadowlands. I dont think the souls knew of one another. Now after Frostmourne got destroyed tho i wonder what happened since logically they should have merged when the good uther moved to the shadowlands. Perhaps thats the reason why we fight him in Shadowlands since his inner self is ripping him apart.
Then Tirion should have seen them as well. Or Bolvar for the matter. Its possible they hid themself from anyone else present there (also as to prevent ANOTHER lore hole)
Yes the Archon is a tyrant. The whole place stinks if you ask me and i hope we beat her off her high horse. Many of the people in the shadowlands are already annoying me from a personality PoV.
Then she should have at least listened to Devos and give more consideration to what she said instead of going “No! Stop! Go back to Work and stop thinking!”. A weapon of the shadowlands being in the mortal realm alone should have caused the Archon to go in alarm mode and investigate.
Angels are not ultimately good. Including in our religious origins of them. Keep in mind who the guy downstairs is. Angels at best are nothing more but mindless zombies destined to obey.
And the “angels” of WoW would be beings of pure light and even the Light has proven to as corrupting and vile as the void.
I believe it has been stated that the Naaru represent the “angelic” archetype in wow, which makes sense as they are the closest things to direct messengers of the Light. As we have seen however, they can also embody negative traits like excessive zeal. They do however still display that unwavering obedience (pretty much everything they do and speak about is regarding the Light and they don’t seem to talk about stuff like their own opinions or desires so much as how they interpret the Lights Will)
Kyrians are angelic in a sense (looks, they retrieve souls, their society is founded on obeying a plan) however they do not serve a benevolent “good” being nor do they appear to have any kind of compassion or stewardship towards mortals (instead viewing them as potential cogs to add to their machine) and most angel lore has something of this kind, even if it’s a “I’m the grown up, I know what’s best” kind of compassion. Kyrians appear utterly indifferent by the by.
There are exceptions tho like A’Dal for instance. He seems to have a conscious of his own. As visible in Wotlk where he came all the way from Outland to Icecrown as to bring a fallen child of the light home only to then return back to outland. He didnt have to do this, he wanted to and because he pretty much owes us alot of favours.
Technically they serve the wheel of the shadowlands. Die, go to Oribos, get told where to go, do as the coventant tells you to. Rinse and repeat.
Ye and this is highly annoying to me. Like when they look down to us “ye mate hate it to break it to ya but you know that big bunch of very powerful and evil people that got send on mass to the maw in the last 15years? Yeah, make a guess whos responsible for that. Show some respect if you expect respect from me. Not to mention your “you have to die” thingy doesnt even apply to me. I can freaking corpserun in your shadowlands.”
Im just pointing out that angels being possible of evil is not exclusive to diablo or now WoW but has already been part of the origins considering the horned guy downstairs who wasnt exactly happy with how a certain someone acts.
Absolutely, I wasn’t disagreeing so much as chiming in. Naaru indeed do display conscience on occasion but they still very much do it by the book of “the light” and don’t toss us favours that violate that, that’s probably closer to what I meant.
I also think naaru are closer to angels because all Naaru (at least as far as draenei lore tells us) go on about an eventual “end time” where an army of the light will end evil and everything will be glorious, which is very apocalyptic. The difference seems to be some naaru like a’dal are quite chill and just have confidence it will happen, whereas x’era seemed to believe in a bit of “forcing the hand of fate”.
Which will cause a Light Xpac which i look forward to since it seems the AU Light Mother seems to be X’Era where in ours pretty much A’Dal took her place (especially after Illidan made bbq out of her) and i assume A’Dal will side with us against her, causing an internal clash within the light.
And the “LIGHT” itself has no affiliation to begin with as it has demonstrated several times that it doesnt care who or what you are and what you plan to do as long as you pray to it or whatever. And event then its up for debate if it is in the mood to assist ya.
Probably the archon knows better what the proper level of consideration is and secondly she didn’t say that fact should be ignored, just that it’s not Devos’ job to deal with it.
“you will abandon this cause” is what she said. Which is basically saying “ye thats bull. Nothing can escape the maw like the puppet behind you said. Abandon the thought and go back to work as the shadowlands depent on it”.
The fact that NOTHING has happened from their site is a pretty good indicator. They didnt even bother to inform oribos and they in the very least should have done that. Not to mention that they didnt even seem to be bothered that the Deathlord is literally running around with Frostmourne in hand (or was since its power is now exhausted)
