What is going on Lore Team Blizz - do you not understand Fans anymore?

Lore Story
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So surprised he killed Cenarius along with a small army.

So strong, the Wardens Vault was solo invaded by a handful of legion felguards and if Maiev hadnt releases the demonhunters gg.

What you really really really need to realize my friend, is that such powers are only used against, serious evil.

Yes, Malfurion is the strongest being alive and the novel he can draw power from Azeroth and the Emerald dream , co-existing in both realms at the same time critically dmging everything and being your God!

But such powers will NEVER be used in the faction war!!
Because the petty childish arguments of mortals are not something the Dream, Azeroth or the elements would lend this level of power for. Such forces dont scheme for mortal thrones.

So you really need to understand that.

Against Xavius , Malfurion is our Daddy. Against the Horde, not that much…

We are all Azeroths children. Everything magnificent about Night elves is to be used against the Legion, Void lords etc, not for their own supremacy. Cause last time nelfs went down the path or race supremacy and arrogance, Azshara happened.

And maybe you dont remember how that went, but the nelfs do

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And why wouldn’t the Night Elf forces regard the Horde as a serious evil?

What’s your source for this?

Sigh

And how is this all even remotely relevant?

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You see, I wrote a post above, completely negclecting WoTA and focusing on WC3 and even mentioned that above, because WC3 story came BEFORE wota and chronologically stands AFTER WoTA, where Night Elves were presented to playerbase and people loved them. WC3 Night Elves where first representation of how they lived and what were they in world of Azeroth and LATER WoTA got released to show how they came to that state of present days.

And to be honest I dislike WoTA Night Elven civilisation.

Well you are talking about WoTA and Im talking about WC3 so idk what to say here really…

And explain me how is being - 1. lacking of 10k millitary experience, 2. slaughtered in whole region by group of rogues (All right I understand Lorash was very very skilled rogue, but all of them?), and 3. Faithless is somehow characteristics of “powerful race that defands their homeland”. For a fan I must say that is slap across the face. That is not what night elves stand for.

Jez make them lose but not like this… Its just shame.

Where in my posts did you get the implication that I think so?

Yeah you want to be taken seriously after this kind of attitude?

Im sorry, I did jot realise people would not understand I meant Wild Gods and Loa parallels, without spelling these words out :unamused:

Exactly! They lost so many wars. I mean I really dig Zandalari but at least we have seen their decline woth series of events. But that is not case with post WC3 Kaldorei and Vanilla ones.

And here is where I see you failing to understand that their nerfs were tackled differently. I see you mention that almost everywhere in your post. Night Elves were nerfed and told to deal with it.

Idk Zarao, maybe because they have betrayed each other. Led two wars that resulted in failure and other personal goals both on Draenor and Azeroth that lead to deaths of so many Orcs and entire Clans.

And lost… that is the point… But at least they have that moment EXPLAINED why they are not so powerful to this day.

On a double dose of demon juice, thanks.

Irrelevant arguement. We are talking about Kaldorei of Legion? Where people are complaining about Night Elf state? Thanks for backup I guess…

And for the rest - when strength of races can be nerfed and spiked depanding on plot that story is utter garbage and does not provide any satisfaction, interest or logic.

Oh and what Haiete said.

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Because the first one is a misconception that assumes that Night elves battled non-stop after the Well blew up, when the reality is that they remained fairly at peace for most of those 10k and only needed to actually call forth their armies again in a serious way when they faced Archimonde again in the Third War (about 20 years ago).

And the second is an understatement that extrapolates and simplifies the whole War of Thorns to some very specific situation that happened within it. When the reality is that the combined armies of the Horde were the ones that defeated them in Ashenvale, not a bunch of rogues.

Night elves, as a whole, aren’t the most pious race ingame to begin with. They aren’t immune to losing faith.
They did in the past.

Because plenty of those consequences carried forth in Wc3.
Also I talked about WotA because it’s also reference aplenty around here.
For starters, the person I first replied to talked about ‘Books’. And Warcraft 3 doesn’t have any about Night elves.

In the fact that you address a plan made by guys like Nathanos Blightcaller and Varok Saurfang as orchestrated by ‘Mindless Forsaken and Orcs’.

People get tired of the constant arguments thrown forth about the same cliches that apparently have certain players unable to acknowledge the fact that their race isn’t the kind of power fantasy they were in the past.
I could argue non-stop about how is it that the chosen Loa paragons were made playable under a failure banner, or how is that the descendants of Grond and the chosen champions of the elemental furies, a planet worth of population, are but a fraction of an already diminishing faction on Azeroth.

People get tired of reading the same stuff being thrown over and over again because people are unable to grasp at the fact that the narrative has evolved to the point their favourite race is no longer in the spot it used to.
And what you read there was the exasperation seeping in.

Night elves where ‘nerfed’ after the Sundering almost wiped them of the planet.
They were nerfed afterwards when they had to renounce their immortality to defeat the next demonic invasion.
They were ‘nerfed’ when their enemies grew and consolidated their power in a continent they had up until then, controlled uncontested.
They were nerfed when their various segments splintered and the beings they used to control were called forth by other races that were about as ‘good aligned’ as them.
When Druidism ceased to be their exclusive thing, and when shamans landed on Kalimdor.

They were nerfed when Fandral almost wiped their capitol, and wrecked their armies and former allies in their own land.
And they have suffered about as much as every other race has, when it comes down to the rest of World ending threats that have happened on Azeroth throughout the years.

There is a wide range of reasons as to why the Night elves aren’t the kind of powerhouse they used to be.
And if the orcs, trolls, Draenei, and even Humans, can cope with these sort of events and acknowledge they are no longer the alpha dog, then so can Night elves.

Arguing that the current portrayal of Night elves is as bad as certain people make it to be, is just moronic.
The Horde needed the combined armies of all their races to invade Ashenvale and face the Night elves alone.

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You guys nelf complainers managed to ruin another topic with your nelf “demands” as you simply refuse to get any kind of argument.

If you like Haite dont understand what “race supremacy” means and “what happened when they thought they were better than everyone , was Azshara and sundering” then read more nelf history.

Cause all you nelf complainers complain about is “nelfs are superior we have the power of 10.000 years we have everything” when your Leader herself Tyrande says all the time “I am no Queen. I will never be Azshara”

So, you want the writers to make nelfs all powerful arrogant, when it goes against their very values lol. Get real

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Your argument was rather dumb as well, and I’m not a NElf fan. The opposite.

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Problem with lore not being consistent is: you can write what ever you want, after all " continuity should not restrict the writers."
-.-’

Had they respected the established lore perhaps:

  • Night Elves are not as easily beaten, which seams a attack on Ashenvale a bad idea.
  • Horde just came from a costly conflict, Azeroth is dying, maybe it’s not the best idea to start another one ?

Maybe if we take established lore the all concept of BfA sounds … Ludicrous perhaps ?

Remember it’s all fun games criticizing the other players when their lore expectations are not met in game, but that’s a double edged sword.

If the same happens to your side, what moral do you have to come and complain after ?

Just my thoughts.
Cheers.

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The lurking ungulate expresses her appreciation of your sentiment.

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There is a lore to this game? I thought WoW was a parody of the fantasy genre. :thinking:

Fear not, no matter how high the losses, we shall use the cloning machine beneath Orgrimmar!

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What should the players expected reaction be if someone kickstarted a complaint by marking THEIR race better than YOURS while dismissing/hand waving any scenario or situation that says otherwise?

I mean, every race is entitled to have a story that portrays them in a good light.

But if the complaints are founded on scenarios that have 8 to 1 odds against them and 7 playable races armies against 1, and still we are met with “Not enough” even when they are portrayed as putting up a good fight…then we are going to have a problem.

The rest of playable races aren’t expendable fodder to make your favoured race look good.
And I’m saying so as a Forsaken, troll and Orc player. Which are, without doubt, the most used as such.

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https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4972582/

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For me the Night Elves can be portrayed as overpowered in their own land.
I have zero problems with that.

As long as the Horde races aren’t portrayed as warmongering idiots who don’t know anything else but to wage war and conflict.

And this is why a Bfa is a sensles expansion.
When the factions are at a state of cold war, this type of confrontations don’t take place.
Why we must compare which side has the bigger “gun” all the time ?

Just my thoughts.
Cheers.

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Ok, and now we factor in other forest dwelling races, that have any kind of story that vindicates them to claim Night elf land. How do we solve this?.

Oh, and now we have a dozen other races, with their own lands. Are they overpowered in their own territory too?
Do orcs get an automatic buff every time they cross back into Outland?

And if you are talking about the natural and obvious tactical advantage of fighting in known territory, then sure. That’s fine.
We already have that.
But complaining any further even when the narrative is written in a way that considers said circumstance and evens the odds in any other way (like it happened in the War of Thorns), Is doing so without any footing.

Unless you are arguing about invincibility, in which case I’d just say that whoever thinks that way, should probably get their head out the clouds.

PS:

We. Are. One.

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Laughs in made-up pass, rogue killed outposts and famous right-turn undetected next to Ashenvale I think Anduin at Lordaeron would be more competent :thinking:

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  1. Night elves aren’t the only ones that made their home in the northern forest of Kalimdor.
  2. Unguarded and vulnerable settlements can be destroyed and outrun by coordinated attacks. That’s pretty much standard warfare knowledge. Night elves aren’t immune to this.
  3. Warsong gulch.
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  1. Lived there for 10,000+ years and somehow never noticed this pass, or guarded it.
  2. Those outposts had Sentinels in them from a race of scout/forest specialists. Destroyed and silenced a few? Sure. Silverwind Refuge, a place notorious for its history, able to be overwhelmed and mounts killed so easily? Draw the curtain of disbelief please.
  3. Doesn’t the mere existence of that place mean that Horde movements are more likely to be watched and noticed?
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I’m concerned about the problem allied races contribute to - they struggled to bring forward every individual race in the story before the appearance of allied races. Now, with the number of playable races doubling, more and more players are going to feel left out as their favourite race inevitably gets forgotten lore wise.

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It is EXACTLY how I felt. Scammed and let down.

Stops me from trusting anything they write about any new race.

Caused me many a time to quit wow. ESP in cata the way they portrayed both the arcane Night elves and the night elf sentinel forces in their own forest (nothing like you’d expect from their lore and description - it’s like the Wc3 and wotA was a scam, you describe them and set them up one way, you have us looking forward to it, and what we get is nothing like it.

I thought about this many a times and realised the nerf was un-necessary too. Night elves didn’t have to play a major part in alliance affairs being a bit overpowered, but they always felt like their own people and would be minimally involved with the alliance even occasionally taking issue.

Example: Being over bearing with younger races which would irritate humans, magical monitoring too, especially when the redeemed highborne return, they censor humans for responsible use and refuse to share their more advanced knowledge because they claim humans aren’t responsible enough uetbor ready which also annoys the humans, they also have their druids always clashing with loggers and miners which also annoys. But the counter is having a night elf on the front line is a major boost, and the women are gorgeous even if they harp on about Elune and more than not look down on males.

And so you brought them in for the giant plots like Cataclysm and Legion and Azshara but not for MoP , WoD, BFA, where they would have a token character - or lend a troop for strategy - and you would show their wisdom and experience as well as magical aptitude like they did for the elves in Lord of the Rings and hobbit.

Even in a world with a human perspective, that would be possible. We didn’t need to see the night elves much, but when we saw them it would be something special (rare but very meaningful when a kaldorei would show up - whether as priest, ancient mysterious magi with lost knowledge, or forest lord.

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They were at peace. Though they kept their military active, trained and sent across the continent. Ironically one might think 10 000 years is a hell of a lot of time, even without the any real enemy present, to realise not to send the Army away, when you have the enemy at your doorsteps.

I do not mind Night Elves losing a war, even losing Teldressil. But I dont want to see race which I like to act out of character. I do not enjoy when for the sake of plot, race being portrayed as rookies in tactics, enemy anticipation and surprise attacks.

That is the nerf, not the military strength loss.

That is bit confusing, because some Troll and Tauren start to worship them they go like "Yeah man, now I get these real sick Troll and Tauren worshippers so you know I dont have to defend my other worshippers, because that would be favouritism… "

And I m not asking to. But do not say people should not be mad about a race being nerfed because plot demands so the other races look good, sounds fair?

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It’s actually the other way around.
They’re not telling the story on the basis of a script that works as compelling lore… they’re telling it on the basis of what people like to see in game. They change their story to the whims of the larger part of their players (for reasons of $$$/€€€) and that killed the story as a whole.

From what I read, people on this forum love Sylvanas as a Warchief not because of the character, but because everyone hates it. They just enjoy the salt of the rest of the players and can’t resist provoking them. Lore wise, killing Vol’jin like that and putting Sylvanas on the throne was just weird and as of yet they have to show us how or why… but I won’t be surprised when it’ll be quite underwhelming.

That’s also why you see all these cinematics and novels telling the story outside of the game… they’re trying hard to establish a lore they completely messed up in game, but it’s not working because the game is the world we “live” in. That is our character’s reality.

The cinematics and novels are better than they have been (omg, there have been such poorly written novels…) and tell a good story… too bad we’re not living it in game because the game focuses too much on trying to please the players who don’t give a feck about lore and selling them services and in-game crap.

I’d call it poor design and wrong prioritization. Emotions have little to do with this, the game nowadays is purely focused to make them more money.

That’s the world of today. Look at Trump, he does the same thing on a daily basis.
That’s business for you. It’s basically advertising on steroids:
“OMG I can’t believe how epic our results are [shows shiny turd] and look at all those good reviews [created by corporate shills like IGN] it is so wonderful!”

Just ignore all the criticism, declare victory and make those who complain feel they are the minority, so they don’t feel supported and strengthened to group together and then sneakily try to solve it over time.

They know and don’t care. They’ll just pump out another and overhype it so people can’t help themselves. Just look at the big gaming companies today, they’re all doing the same thing.

I think the Legion success was luck rather than planning. After the crap they pulled before and after it, this suddenly worked. The fact that they ff-ed up immediately after Legion shows they hadn’t a clue why and how Legion worked so well. After all, a broken clock is right twice a day.

At this point, I’d rather have them spend ALL their budget on cinematics, because g-damn, these are good :slight_smile:

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