I don’t view the pruning as a complete failure as certain specs actually got more of an identy, but on the whole I agree with your sentiment. They’ve been homogenizing the classes for a very long time. On one hand it’s good because the game becomes more balanced, on the other hand it’s bad because the classes lose their identities. Right now, what separates the classes the most are gear and animations.
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and you wonder what it was ?
i can give you 2 hints:
“lfm dungeon X +4 , must have 410 itlv and 3k raider io score”
“lfm curve or gtf , 410 itlv minimum for normal mode”
while on opposite part of spectrum they have games like apex legends or lol where all they have to do is push “play” button - they join and they play .
wonder why no new blood is coming to wow hm…
nobody sane will come and play wow in 2019 which requires you to puti n effort equal to 2nd job just to enjoy game.
just because blizzard decided that catering to hardcore is good idea few expansions ago.
they never recovered since then. and never will as long as they dont weed out elitism and toxicity.
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To be fair, you had Gearscore in Wrath which started the whole thing off, so you can’t really blame Blizzard, it was the addon writers that started it, Blizzard just added to it when they introduced Ilvl etc.
However yes I agree something has to be done to embrace newer players without the ridiculous requests put upon groups.
I don’t know whether it’s fair to say that all of the high level loot is welfare though.
The mythic weekly box requires mythic completion. That is content. That is not “welfare loot”. You do a sem afk run of freehold 2 and you get a box reward below emissaries. You do a mythic 10 which requires some actual knowhow and such, you get a 410 box. What’s the problem? Would you prefer it if people had to do say 2, 3, 5 dungeons at that level to secure the box? When does it stop being classed as welfare?
That’s assuming you get you 10 run. These days players create an artifical layer of elitist policing by demanding people outgear content massively. So most casuals are switched off because the idea of having to run dungeons they don’t need gear from constantly for weeks just to plump up a score is not fun. It’s work.
I will agree with others, warfronts weekly etc do reward loot that is too high (it should be 15 higher than the wf loot itself). Emissaries maybe reduce by ten levels or so so its equal to mythic 0 rather than better.
But I don’t get this idea that people are frustrated that gearing up to content that is current is quicker each patch. If you make each player have to do a steady grind to have any chance of seeing the latest raid, etc. Then you kill off alt possibility massively. Essentially you reward time played, not skill. Let’s be Frank. Running normal dungeons, then heroics etc isn’t so much as test of skill as it is how many hours can you log a week.
So essentially you’re complaining that ppl can now quicker reach the content that does actually test their skill? Eh? It only feel special if you do a numbing grind first?
Its just stupid jealousy. The casual player who only dares to do emissaries and WF will only reach 400 ilevel after months and months of luck. The more dedicated player can do it in days/weeks.
The casual player in this scenario will Never reach 425 ilevel outside of extreme luck by max titan forging their wf quest reward… And even then they will never get a 425 trinket or ring because wf don’t reward those and emissaries can’t TF to 425. So to do this the casual needs to do high mythic which is content.
So no, a “true casual” cannot each the lofty heights of a dedicated player who has mythic 10+ on farm and raids mythic weekly. Seems people are just Peeve that they dare to reach item levels like 385-400 after some weeks of preferred play rather than staying at scrubby ilevel like 340. How dare they, the knaves!
Don’t worry guys, your 415 gear is still better.
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I have problem with gearing speed which is high at start and then it falls off quickly. Besides achievement alone and setting your own goals like “I will do all dungeons on +20” there is no reason to do higher keys. I’m not even talking about ilvl, but there should be something. Perhaps really, really cool transmog set or just Mythic+ sets.
I can tell you what went wrong with WoW. The answer is very simple - Blizzard don’t see anyone competitive on the market and that’s why they can be lazy and do only 10% of possible potencial of this game!
Once a monster-rookie comes and starts eating Activion’s market cake and attract millions of new players, Activision-Blizzard will immedeately start doing something new and unique for WoW. Nobody wants to lose money, especially greedy ceo from Activion.
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And that’s exactly the problem Lilith many people accept wow as a second job they are ok with it and those of us who want to relax and play the game we are 
to them and that isn’t right I am already stressed from my accounting job don’t really have to have high blood pressure problems from Elitists.But that is just one of many reasons I considered quiting many times.
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I disagree. Toxicity has always exisited in the game since the beginning. But it comes across more prominent now as gear is not enough to tell if someone is good. You get gear so easily in BFA, it’s not longer a measure of if you have good gear you must have done hard content.
I don’t think they’ve catered to elitists for the last few expansions, I think its the opposite. Do you really think if they made it for hardcore players only you could get raid level gear from doing a 30 second WQ which is the case now?
In the other thread you jumped on me for thinking the allied race rep grind is dumb and takes far too long due to gating, but here you complain the game is too much like a second job? Make up your mind.
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There are a mountain of minor problems but the short verison:
Blizzard gives people a feeling of losing progress by trying to reinvent the wheel every expac.
TBC, Wrath, Cata, and MoP were all fantastic expacs, their content didn’t differ extremely from what we have today, they had Dailies, we have WQs, they had BGs we have BGs, they had Heroics, we have M+ (wich i think is way better than Heroics ever were), Raids, Arena etc.
But, TBC, Wrath, Cata, and MoP were just adding stuff onto the previous expac.
BFA doesnt feel bad because it doesnt have content, wich it does, it feels bad because its basically just Legions systems, minus the artifact weapon.
We didnt really gain anything new so it feels like we lost gameplay even though we didnt really.
If the next expac was just Wrath Of Bolvar: Electric Boogaloo, and we simply go the usual, +5-10 levels, but instead of some random Azerite or Artifact system, we simply got 1 more talent row, people would love the expac beyond imagination, because it would finally feel like out characters grew in power again.
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But you do not get raid level gear from doing 30 seconds world quest. World quest are this moment giving ilvl 360 loot as rewards(edit: and 360 ONLY if your ilvl is high enough). Even LFR gives better ilvl (370).
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Regardless, my point still stands. If this was a hardcore only expansion you wouldnt get such rewards from such awful content.
Low ilvl level rewards for easy (“awful”) content? Shouldn’t it be like high ilvl ones to prove your point?
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Well you can get WQ drops better than Uldir LFR and almost equal to the normal mode. This is another problem with the game, invalidating it’s own content. There’s no progression from tier to tier anymore. Uldir is already completely obsolete due to things like WQ dropping loot at a similar level.
My point does still stand. Why should a 30 second WQ killing one mob give the same reward as a dungeon for example?
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You cannot compare it for older raids, when uldir was current content world quests gave much lower ilvl loot as well. Currently ilvl difference with mythic current raid and world quests is 55 ilvl, i think that is pretty good difference. I don’t know how low rags you would need others to run to feel special? Perhaps something under ilvl of Molten Core, so world quests would not reward raid lvl loot?
Dungeon loot i cannot say anything about cause i have yet to see anything drop for me in dungeons those few times i have been doing one on BFA. It does seem that at least the amount of drops should be upped from those. But it seems normal dungeons are done mostly when leveling and after dinging 120 people move into mythics, which do reward better loot than world quests as well.
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I agree with you, just small addition, they should redo dungeons, where only tank can handle mobs, this should prevent dps pulling everithing bcs rush rush rush, levels, rewards, more, next, rush, pull, pull more… just let dps die for one or two hits from mob.
This is where my problem lies. Uldir isn’t from a previous expansion, it should be current content. The cutting of tier progression and addition of many ‘catchup’ mechanics has been a mistake in my opinion.
I just think rewards should be in line with the difficulty and effort of the content done. I don’t see why gear equivalent to the previous raid should be given out basically for free.
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What is your proposal regarding mythic then? Where do they sit?
Let’s say Bod is out and uldir retains relevance as WQs emissaries do not drop the Higher loot… What of dungeons now? You keep mythic frozen in difficulty so now mythic is no longer viable for gearing up to endgame? Or do you scale mythic too, thus rendering Uldir “pointless” in your opinion.
What is the solution here? Because either way one person’s preferred method of progression (raiding or mythic) is being neglected in favour of the other.
Even if you kep mythic gear scaling above 10 (so gear keeps going up in ilevel beyond this) that still renders uldir pointless does it not?
I mean, uldir was arguably pointless pre patch. I had an ilevel of 369 on my monk and I had never stepped in uldir once. Mythic only.
So long as mythic and raids are both viable endgame models you will never have a situation where one doesn’t seem to render the other redundant.
The problem is people seem them as competitors. They are meant to be different ways of gearing up. Doing heroix uldir gears up for raid finer Bod (arguably normal). Nothing to stop you doing it this way.
The issue is that WQ rewards and emissaries scale over 350. This should be the cut off point. That way to get gear of 370 or higher you must either be doing raid or mythic. No issues with wqs giving 350 gear (this is rightish level for entry into mythic uldir and mythic 0s)
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rewards like what ? no source out in world offer anything above 400 itlv atm.
where are your mythical level rewards out in the world ?
385 is garbage in world where people demand 410+ for anything in game.
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It is only garbage because of how easy it is to acquire. Gear does not mean as much as it used to anymore as evident by the rampant use of addons such as Raider. io
Blizzard has to keep inflating ilvls more and more as they invalidate their own content in the current expansion.
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Not at all. As I said at the end of my other post, rewards should reflect the content done. Once mythic reaches a level higher than Uldir then yes, it should drop better items. Having better items drop basically for free? No.
I agree that there should be multiple end-game options for players. I never said that mythic dungeons shouldn’t drop raid quality loot. I said things such as WQ and Warfronts shouldn’t. Giving away such gear for the easiest of content is what invalidates gear, not having it rewarded for different content in general.
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