Well i have never done a single M+ as i have no interest in those so i have never looked how loot is given in them.
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You have to complete the whole thing and loot is given from a chest at the end 
ā¦if youāre lucky
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It is why the sane healers left around always recommend communities and guilds for people interested in healing and tanking to join.
Sadly pugs act like a bunch of rabid hyenas when it comes to queue-able content like normal/heroic dungeons.
Though it does not help on this situation that leveling dungeons are way too easy, and that is what the playerbase learns: brute-force.
Then they encounter a brick wall which they try to solve the same way: brute-force it with more itemlevel and damage.
There are many reasons.
One of the biggest ones is that healing at any competitive capacity requires for most people an extensive UI customization that no other role requires. (Clique at the very least, then better raid frames or a full UI overhaul)
You have the added stress of taking care of the rest of the group along with yourself.
Add to that the times where others in the group choose to shift all the blame on the healer for all their game choices
See how in classic it was a joke/mistake to not wait for the healer to recover. In M+ it is a requirement to race for a timer.
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Generally go with the majority. If the tank runs forward alone without a care in the world while the party struggles against unavoidable party wide damage you just let the tank die. If most DPS follow the tank while one decides to steal aggro and duel one mob way back you let the DPS die. Those are my thumb rules.
Itās a thing because Blizzard overreacted to a problem they created by gating M0 so players were stuck with heroic gear as their BiS for a week or two, and would have solved itself anyway once M was added, but instead they decided to placate the complainers then and there and now you get deserter at any point you leave/get kicked, not just before first boss.
My opinion still stands that instead of penalizing players who leave they need incentives for players to complete the dungeon. Nobody leaves normal dungeons mid way outside of stuff like emergencies because the sweet EXP is at the end. Give heroics some sort of tokens at the end so you can eventually buy your BiS on heroic level instead of hopelessly spam dungeons.
Evoker is one of the more mobile classes, and is pretty good while healing on the run. I just donāt try to solve what is a player issue of having to stay in range of your healer instead of expecting them to follow you.
Serpentrix in Legion timewalking can be suffering, or a good source of entertainment if you can detach yourself from it. I had groups where nobody knows what an interrupt is and at that point you either have to be god level or overgeared healer or itās a wipe. And there were times healers besides shamans didnāt have interrupts and so you frustratingly watch as no one interrupts and they expect you to heal through that.
Priests still have no interrupts, and I personally donāt run resto druids with an interrupt either, Iām not one of those crazy cat weaving rdruids.
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However, ātrying to adaptā only goes so farā¦ I play a worgen restodruid, arguably the most mobile and fastest of all healersā¦ But if Illidumb over there canĀ“t be arsed to slow down at any point in time because he thinks his wings are a bulletproof batsuit, then no amount of tiger dashing, stampeding roaring and darkflighting is going to save his leathery behind from getting stomped on, and itās entirely his fault. 
With all due respect, both of you are completely wrong.
The deserter punishment has been in place since before M dungeons were even a brainfart, and has never applied to Mo or M+ dungeons to begin with because these have never been random queueable content.
Deserter was added in Wrath shortly after RDF itself because people left any group for Oculus, Soulforges or HoR, then was extended to votekicks in Cata when People (primarly tanks and healers) held groups hostage and demanded to be kicked after rolling Grim Batol, and was only recently updatet to cover the entire run because of people leaving after the first boss because it no longer applied after that.
And will more likely sooner rather than later become account-wide and /or not tick down when logged off, due to people now āconvenienientlyā disconnecting after the first boss
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For sure !
But you said it. You got outrun by a tank while being the most mobile class in the game. Not just the most mobile healer.
And its easy to blame the tank there. Blaming is always easy. But one day you will do a M+10 or something, and the tank will be forced to do things like that in order to time the key. So take it as a positive learning lesson here.
And if you never do a +10 in your life, its also OK. The next dungeons will be a walk in the park.
All it takes is a change o attitude from ātanks are trollsā to āim just gonna do my best, try to improve, and see what happensā.
2:00 show the issue perfectly
And here same on pictures.
And even if modes are named āsoloā it dont mean that ppl are supposed play solo, these modes are 3v3 and 8v8 and intended to be work as teamwork based modes even if the modes name might have āsoloā on it. LFG and Soloq will always be bad if solo people play solo even when joined in team content 
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IĀ“ve run 20+ successfully on numerous classes and specs in literally every season IĀ“ve chosen to engage with until this one tyvm, where I just canĀ“t be arsed to run mind-numbingly boring m+ dungeons just to play the vault lottery, and therefore only ran 6 or 7 keys in week 1 for pre-raid gearing. Feel free to check my achievements and raiderIo, which easily go back as far as yours do and then some .
This is not so much an an m+ issue, at least not for me, because I donĀ“t pug M+and mostly stopped pugging anythign in late BfA. ItĀ“s most prevalent in LF(x) content, where people think theyĀ“re some sort of rambo just because open world mobs havenĀ“t killed them yet. And if the tank thinks IĀ“m going to continue to chase him, while all the mobs he pulled but didnĀ“t hold threat on are standing āhereā stomping on the DDs while he just keeps pulling more, heĀ“s delusional and deserves to pay the ultimate price while the hunterpet and voidwalker do his job for him. 
Your generally condescending tone which repeatedly implies that IĀ“m some sort of inexperienced scrub that hasnĀ“t been playing this game at an above average level for almost 20 years, despite the achievements to prove otherwise, is not in any way warranted, nor appreciated. We can both learn things from each other, but not as long as you continue to operate on the baseless assumption that merely having a higher M+ score in the current season makes you superior, as I could easily do the same by disregarding you for not having heroic raid achieves from Cata, Pandaria, WoD, and SL S1, or for that matter even clearing it in the current season.
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I absolutely hate this, and it makes me so miserable when a tank puts me in this position. As a healer I feel responsible for all the healthbars in the group, not just theirs. Itās so inconsiderate that itās not even a question anymore of whether I can catch up with that tank, but whether I want to. And I donāt want to in that case.
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If they die to stupidity itās not your problem. No need to even think twice about it.
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Deserter was only a thing if you didnāt kill bosses, but early TWW people left heroic dungeons after the first boss in some dungeons because they were targeting their BiS. And like I said instead of trying to incentivize people to stay for the entire run they just said well now you get a deserter at any point before the last boss.
What I said is that once you have higher difficulties people donāt bother to fish for their BiS on heroic dungeons, at least not in numbers where it becomes a problem for people.
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IĀ“m sorry for the misunderstanding, that was not clear to me from teh way it was presented.
However, I still disagree, as the issue still persists to this day. And teh people that continue leaving, or as is now more common āconveniently disconnectingā and thereby forcing a votekick, are more often than not the tanks and healers that already generally have the satchel as an incentive to stay. 1-1.5k gold for 10 minutes seems quite fair to me.
Therefore, the carrot is already there, and itĀ“s obviousl not working, that leaves only the stick. Which will continue to get bigger until either someone invents a better carrot, or the behavior stops.
There will always be leavers. If someone rage quits because they didnāt get their BiS on the 1th try theyāre not gonna care if they get deserter or not. My point is it needs a balance point. Even the rare times when a tank or healer leaves nowadays you wait a minute or two for refill (you get priority). Even before this change was implemented someone leaving leading to actually ruining the run was pretty rare, and there are legitimate reasons to leave a run.
The deserter debuff started to prevent people from abandoning dungeons they donāt like because without it unpopular dungeons will never get completed, but once a player gets to the point where they already had to kill one boss they just keep going most of the time even if they could leave without a penalty. Case in point the community never felt the game needed an extension on the deserter debuff (not in significant numbers) until that fateful TWW release.
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Yes, the debuff was extended due to the same sort of antisocial behavior that caused it to be introduced in the first place, as well as expanded to cover votekicks. To be honest, IĀ“m a bit surprised it lasted so long (>13 years) without having to need further changes earlier.
At the end of the day, this is merely adapting the systems alreeady in place to fit the community theyĀ“re being applied to. And the community is, compared to then, chock full of antisocial ego driven players that view everyone else as NPCs and act accordingly, which is exactly why many of us generally avoid engaging with it wherever possible.
the mindset being " itās my time", whichlogically means that 1 personĀ“s time is worth more than 4 peopleĀ“s timeā¦And No, sorry, itĀ“s not, and the punishment needs to be at least equivalent to the amount of collective time you stole from the others. IMO the debuff shouldn`t even start ticking down until the group has killed the next boss, unless they disband completely, in which case it simply doubles, as there have been times for example late nights near the end of seasons when in LFR and even LFG myself and others have waited 30+ minutes to be able to continue, simply because requeing would have presumably taken even longer.
But coding that progressive āpunishment to fit the crimeā would be a nightmareā¦ but on the other hand if someone with a capacity for rational thought and self reflection gets saddled with a 12 hour Deserter debuff because they couldnĀ“t be arsed to spend 5 minutes killing an LFR boss, maybe theyĀ“ll either not queue anymore and save others the grief, or just kill the boss next time
That is something you asume. I did not even check you achevements and I am sorry I made it look like that.
All I wanted to say is that this āpracticeā in queuable dungeons (heroic + timetravel) is useful in M+. No matter the level you choose to play in.
And because I did not even bother checking your credentials I presented both cases just in case: People that push, and people that dont.
And doing 20+ in past seasons is the equivalent of doing +10 today (remember the M+ squish).
The issue here is healers and healing in general is seen as easy, most people dont realise how much a healer as to do to keep the grp up, add in S1 upped the skill levels across the borde and healing is a nightmare.
Need mana thats a healer issue, tanks dont wait and die due to the healer having no mana healer issue. Tank dies due to overpulling & or not using defensives correctly that the healers issue, dps standing is goop dies thats a healing issue I could go on.
The long and short of it is, healers dont gain enough respect for the job they do. Its expected and so at best were ignored at worst were the ones that get ranged at.
YouĀ“re kidding, right? I DonĀ“t have to āassumeā, i only have to read your statementĀ“s, like
or
To judge them for what they are. Condescending. Because they ALL assume that I have never played the game at anything above an open world or LF(NHC) level
No you didn`t, and thatĀ“s the pointā¦ every single statement you made with the exception of āFor Sureā (which can in light of the rest only realistically be viewes as sarcastic) was either assuming a failure on my part, or implying ineptitude, or criticizing my attitudeā¦ If you canĀ“t see that upon rereading it, then thereĀ“s no point in any further discourse, and itĀ“s better for both of us to simply to put you back on ignore again.
Because, with all due respect, the last thing I need to listen to is some dude who didnāt even start running any sort of challenging content until it was nerfed in in shadowlands S2 to lecture me on motivation, sacrifice, and self improvement.
For example when was the last time you respecced your professions to help your Team? Probably never, because you never had to, because when you started pushing, professions were already irrelevant. Wheras I was one of the ones who ditched engineering and skilled up leatherworking, just so we would have more drums available for Muru in the Sunwell RWF, only to respecc BACK to engineering and tailoring again for Wrathā¦ before you could āsaveā your profession progress, so i had to relearn 375 skillpoints, starting with copper bolts, before I could even start to be useful in current content, which effectively cost me the chance to get the Black Protodrake with my guild, simply because others that didnĀ“t have to respec their professions were available for raiding before I was.
No? Really? You donĀ“t say!! Thanks, I never knew Wowhead existed until this very moment. Why did Blizzard never publish this in at least half a dozen press releases before launch, and why did not a single youtuber or streamer ever mention it? 
ThatĀ“s exactly what IĀ“m talking aboutā¦ you āKnow everythingā and consistently assume that others know nothing, so every statement is trying to impart some sort of wisdom that anyone who runs more than lfr or Timewalking has known for 15+ years, or that anybody who even just skims ofer the forums without ever participating in them has read in at least 2 or 3 blueposts. And it makes you appear to be talking down to others 24/7ā¦ and then you act surprised when they call you out for talking down to them. Because you are, whether you understand it or not
Maybe itĀ“s a language barrier, I donĀ“t know where youĀ“re from or if english is your first language. But for any normal reader with proper english skills, you consistentl present yourself as a half-god and / orseem to assume that every one else is a blithering idiot
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I might have gotten lost in translation. What I meant by āyouā is people. Not you specifically. Im sorry none the less.
Apparently I was not clear enough in my previous post.
I was playing with my warrior back then. But OK.
I still did not bother with looking at your Raider IO profile. I said im sorry already enough times. Im not sure what you plan to gain by looking at mine.
You mentioned +20 since BFA. A +20 in BFA is not the same as a +20 today (and again, I still did not check you Raider IO because its not relevant to this conversation). But I am not interested in going through your CV. Its not the point and I donāt care.
However, you criticize my writing even though I tried to clarify my statements, indicating that I made a mistake by implying I was referring to you specifically.
And then you come to me with unclear statements yourself. Be a bit more clear next time.
I will for sure learn this lesson and use the word āyouā in the correct context.
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