Why Cataclysm was a failure

[Pounder-magtheridon]

I think raids has very little with expansion popularity.
That was the time when Blizzard made statement that less than 5% players raid.
It must be something else that dropped playerbase and imo, it is a kill of iconic villain in wotlk, game over for many.

[Bernysanders-firemaw]

Berny thinks cata is similar to bfa or wod.
Both bfa and wod were super fun for 1 month, then there was absolutely nothing to do.
And Berny was slow and pvped instead of rushing.
Cata has even less to do than those expansions.

[Peridós-firemaw]

You litteraly can’t read.

What I said is that a random casual guy that leveled from 80 to 85 has finished 2 days ago! Not in the first day of Cataclysm not in the second and not a week later but 2 days ago!
So now imagine the casual guy has to go out again and level his alt from 1-60, not in Cataclysm but rather with your nostalgia nonsense.
It will take months! 1-60, 60-70, 70-80, 80-85 with the slow classic system that you want!
And that is impossible!
Sry but that is the reality, most people have not the time anymore, they are not 16 years old! they have a life! The average age of a World of Warcraft player especially in Classic is above 30! So with 2h of gameplay his alt experience will take months if its still the old garbage system of Vanilla. He has to go trough the Cataclysm Classic patches now with his Main that will get spit out in no time and then has to level his Alt.
Remember Cataclysm Classic is only till January 2025!!!
So leveling has to be faster, the new zones has to be more casual.
Also most of the quests are still the same, there are some new ones and some old ones while terrain in the world has changed…

So Larry with his hunter Alt will have to do all the leveling, then doing 2 major professions, dailys, farming Justice Points, farming Valor that is weekly caped and then gearing for P1 BiS that will get replaced in P2 Cataclysm Classic…
Not to mention all the reputation, gold
& material grind.
It’s what I’ve said if Cataclysm Classic is a permanent expansion for the next X years why the hell not.
But Cataclysm Classic will only stay for 7 months.
So Noooooo, Нет, Nein, いいえ, 不, Non, Não, لا, 아니요.

[Freemind-pyrewood-village]

Cata is very similar to Wotlk more than any future expans after it.
What did wotlk or tbc offer that was sooo much more than Cata? Do tell.

Because all you did there was farm rep, farm heroic dungeons to get prebis, raid log.
TBC & Wrath had nothing to do outside that, nothing.

If you suggest pvp, Cata has it to, now even RBG.

Edit: Hell with transmog, you can argue that Cata gives even further more to do than tbc/wrath.

[Thalissa-dragonfang]

I’m so sorry, but it’s you cannot read:

@Peridós-firemaw

What I said is that a random casual guy that leveled from 80 to 85 has finished 2 days ago! Not in the first day of Cataclysm not in the second and not a week later but 2 days ago!

Yes, Cata launced May 20 so he did in 3 WEEKS! He faster than me! In OG Cata I made 85 on Jan 12, It launched December 7.

@Peridós-firemaw

It will take months! 1-60, 60-70, 70-80, 80-85 with the slow classic system that you want!

Yes IF this was what I said. But I said:

@Thalissa-dragonfang

I love not know where to go. I love non-streamilned levelling. I love levelling take months, Is solely matter of taste. I NOT like Cata levelling, I like Vanilla, TBC and Wrath Levelling.

AND as a follows of this I WANT Era servers for Wrath and TBC - I do NOT want remade Cata, I do not WANT Cata at all!

@Thalissa-dragonfang

My solution is: Give 2 – or 3 better – Era servers to each expansion – also Cata when its days done.

[Wkellar-gehennas]

I can’t believe some [redacted] flagged my post.
Bet it was OP.

[Thickhorn-mograine]

@Freemind-pyrewood-village

The vanilla leveling was 100% a “you think you do, but you don’t.”

Absolutely not, first we had Classic, then Hardcore, and then SOD… All of these servers had a massive amount of people leveling because its enjoyable. People REALLY wanted classic, but it won’t last forever, as with any game.

But the “you think you do, but you don’t” meme is just proven to be INSANELY wrong.

[Spáwny-pyrewood-village]

Yay I got to 85 with some questing and a few dungeons … yay now i have better gear I can do more of the dungeons … yay if i can grind just a few more ilvl points by doing the dungeons I can get into the heroic version of the dungeons … yay I got geared enough to do the heroic versions of the same dungeons over and over yet again … yay now i can do Heroics i can grind faction rep by doing loads of the dungeons … yeah nah i need a break from these dungeons … yay i can level my 2nd toon to 85 while im taking a break from dungeons… yeah nah whilst the questing was a LOT of fun first time around this 2nd toon is grating because of the same few zones … yay at least i have Twilight Highlands which i didnt touch on my 1st toon … yeah nah i still got to go through the same 2 or 3 others to get there … yay at least i can level it in the dungeons !! … yay and theres always RBGs … yeah nah long queues just to end up with a team of AFKers or BOTs and even when you somehow manage to win you get hardly any exp … yay but at least im getting loads of honour … yeah nah cant buy any gear til im 85 …

People were shocked that Blizz only gave Cata such a short timeline. I’m already thinking that it’s far to long.
This is OFC just MY opinion so no need to get your panties in a twist just because you disagree. Love & peace man V.

[Bernysanders-firemaw]

Berny custom ratings:

1. TBC: pretty awesome, decent raids, itemization was fun since older raids were still important in later stages, and most importantly TBC had insane wpvp in outland and the old zones. TBC world pvp is almost as good as classic.
2. WotLK: CURSED CURSED CURSED. Worst expansion BY FAR. Even day 1 was boring.
3. Cataclysm: a bit better than wrath since it added a few new stuff, but still horrible.

[Peridós-firemaw]

@Thalissa-dragonfang

AND as a follows of this I WANT Era servers for Wrath and TBC - I do NOT want remade Cata, I do not WANT Cata at all!

And people like me want Cataclysm because TBC and Wrath was Garbage. TBC was dead mid expansion and Wrath was dead in P4.
Cataclysm fixed content progression around the world it was litteraly an upgrade to Wrath in every single way.
In PVP & PVE, Gearing, Profession, sw overhaul with different auction houses like in the dwarf district, better mounts, hunter pets and the theme overall.
People are more around in Azeroth now, back then everyone was either AFK in Shattrath or Dalaran. More people then ever are now around leveling their alts then back in wrath, because no one had the motivation to do so, now they have new hairlooms, a better guild system where you do more with your guild now then in wrath like getting the achievments and other bonuses you didn’t get in wrath. People can now join you with the same raid progress instead only joining a new ID and avoid progression raids. litteraly every single system is better now then back in Wrath. Anyone that still thinks else is just malding about stuff that they have no clue about.

[Thalissa-dragonfang]

You can have Cata all you want. New shiny is always new shiny.

And what is good and not is question of taste.

Just give me and those want it Era Servers to Wrath and TBC.

[Lilíith-draenor]

@Laugrim-nekrosh

I like the question. It’s not about if cataclysm IS a failure. It’s only about WHY.

People playing Cataclysm Classic, what’s up with you? What’s the point in playing it?
It’s an old, known expansion, no new content. And Cataclysm doesn’t have classic feel - it’s more like actual expansions, with late game focus, faster game and so on. It’s worse than a real classic and it’s worse than a “new” WoW. So, what do you play it for?

i have quite a lot of fun runinghc cata dungeons and gearing up my retri pala.

pretty proud of 14.4k dps i just did in BH 25 in 331 gear - we hit enrage and killed the boss 3 sec later.

2 more dungeons for vp cap and then i will swap to doing m+ in retail.

i have 1 goal in first tier in cata - to gear up slowly to really enjoy zandaari dungeons which will come in next mini patch .

ireally really liked those dungeons back then and gonna really enjoy them when they will release

ffirst tier raids are meh so skipping them - then im gonan really enjoy doing FL on my pala and then DS on pala and on boosted hunter which i will boost with mop classic presales

[Aarlandar-sulfuron]

We know what each version of Wow is and isn’t at that point :

• If your point is that Cata isn’t really a MMORPG then yeah it isn’t. But to be fair almost all of these criticisms could be made about WotLK, and even most of them could be made about TBC : when most of the game happens in instances the world is neglected and we no longer have a MMORPG. It is mainly TBC and WotlK who killed the MMORPG aspect of Wow. Only the “Warcraft III theme” of WotLK makes it more “classic” than Cata.

• Now what is fun in Cata is it’s class gameplay and it’s raid deseign. As a healer I much prefer Cata gameplay over the more modern version of the game I’ve played. T11 & 12 & PvP gameplay stand among the best the game have to offer. To be fair I haven’t played Dragonflight but I cant imagine the game being vastly different from Shadowlands, BFA or Legion. I just dont want to spend hours re-learning a new gameplay who’s probably not that fun when I can have fun here.

• Why have Cata been a “failure” ? The basic gameplay loop of leveling and gearing was way faster than it used to be. It took month in Vanilla and TBC, 1-2 weeks in WotLK, just 2-3 days for Cata. This have left players with nothing to do other than pvp or raiding. Moreover the raids were too hard for casual guilds, too mechanic focused or not enough lore centred for players who just wanted to have fun like they did in wraith naxx or ICC – this is particularly true for 10-man content. To complete the picture, Dragon Soul, a mediocre raid, lasted almost a year. Blizzard is well aware of that - that’s why they want cata to last only one year.

As a general state, the best statistical predictor for the “success” or “failure” on an expansion have always been the amount of content (raids, dungeons, bosses, zones, quests). The classes gameplay, the bosses mechanics, the “theme” of the expansion or the “features” aren’t. This is why WotLK, MoP, Legion are considered as good expansions but Cata, WoD, Shadowlands aren’t.
When everything left in the game is infinitely repeatable content – like farming raids, m+, arenas, BG’s – the players are able to reach the limits of the gameplay. The less content there is the more obvious the gameplay imbalances, weaknesses and repetitiveness appear. The less content there is the more the “system” vacuum become apparent – azerite power, island expeditions, garrison, Thorgast, world quests aka dailies 2.0…
On the other hand when there is content players can feel that farming is a rewarding activity.